New Ohio Gun law legislation question....

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David
Ohio HB 231 (Eliminate 'No Guns' Victim Zones)


"Under the proposed legislation, Ohioans would be able to carry concealed guns in churches, day cares, private airplanes and government buildings. The bill would also allow college campuses to permit concealed guns on their campuses if they choose to."

Doesn't the FAA aka Federal Government pre-empt this one? As in no gun on airports that receives Federal Funds?

I am confused, not against the bill, confused. I am in the middle of a CCW permit class here in Ohio anyways so I need to learn all this stuff.

Two bills are in consideration to bring us more in line with other states gun laws.

David
 
You may already carry on private planes and only "passenger terminals" are fed no gun zones
 
As a CCW permit holder, my advise is to stay away from any federal managed or owned area whether inside a friendly state or not, with few exceptions. that being park land in certain states. I think every law abiding citizen should carry, just don't be one of those guys that wants people to know they are carrying by printing on purpose! Keep it truly concealed. I think we need numbers without intimidating those that are against us.
 
As a CCW permit holder, my advise is to stay away from any federal managed or owned area whether inside a friendly state or not, with few exceptions. that being park land in certain states. I think every law abiding citizen should carry, just don't be one of those guys that wants people to know they are carrying by printing on purpose! Keep it truly concealed. I think we need numbers without intimidating those that are against us.

I would not print on purpose either but I am not so sure open carry is bad either. There is a big open carry movement here it seems, at least online anyways. Have thought about it but I am not sure I have the courage to do so.

David
 
I would not print on purpose either but I am not so sure open carry is bad either. There is a big open carry movement here it seems, at least online anyways. Have thought about it but I am not sure I have the courage to do so.

David

Georgia is an open carry state. I personally don't have an issue with it, but it seems odd to see someone with a holstered gun walking around in blue jeans and a t-shirt.

If I were to carry a firearm, I'd rather go concealed.
 
I would not print on purpose either but I am not so sure open carry is bad either. There is a big open carry movement here it seems, at least online anyways. Have thought about it but I am not sure I have the courage to do so.

David

Those guys are obviously trying to make a statement. With that aside, open carry is not an advantage for you as a permit holder. It is actually a disadvantage. If you were to open carry in a situation where a bad guy was about to do something, you are already a target. Besides, there are many states that allow open carry without a permit. Concealed is the way to go.
 
Thanks!

Maybe they are making the distinction of concealed carry then.

David
It would seem I was wrong about the planes

Where you may not carry
"(1) A police station, sheriff’s office, or state highway patrol station, premises controlled by the bureau of criminal identification and investigation, a state correctional institution, jail, workhouse, or other detention facility, an airport passenger terminal, or an institution that is maintained, operated, managed, and governed pursuant to division (A) of section 5119.02 of the Revised Code or division (A)(1) of section 5123.03 of the Revised Code;

(2) A school safety zone if the licensee’s carrying the concealed handgun is in violation of section 2923.122 of the Revised Code;

(3) A courthouse or another building or structure in which a courtroom is located, in violation of section 2923.123 of the Revised Code;

(4) Any premises or open air arena for which a D permit has been issued under Chapter 4303. of the Revised Code if the licensee’s carrying the concealed handgun is in violation of section 2923.121 of the Revised Code;

(5) Any premises owned or leased by any public or private college, university, or other institution of higher education, unless the handgun is in a locked motor vehicle or the licensee is in the immediate process of placing the handgun in a locked motor vehicle;

(6) Any church, synagogue, mosque, or other place of worship, unless the church, synagogue, mosque, or other place of worship posts or permits otherwise;

(7) A child day-care center, a type A family day-care home, a type B family day-care home, or a type C family day-care home, except that this division does not prohibit a licensee who resides in a type A family day-care home, a type B family day-care home, or a type C family day-care home from carrying a concealed handgun at any time in any part of the home that is not dedicated or used for day-care purposes, or from carrying a concealed handgun in a part of the home that is dedicated or used for day-care purposes at any time during which no children, other than children of that licensee, are in the home;

(8) An aircraft that is in, or intended for operation in, foreign air transportation, interstate air transportation, intrastate air transportation, or the transportation of mail by aircraft;

(9) Any building that is a government facility of this state or a political subdivision of this state and that is not a building that is used primarily as a shelter, restroom, parking facility for motor vehicles, or rest facility and is not a courthouse or other building or structure in which a courtroom is located that is subject to division (B)(3) of this section;

(10) A place in which federal law prohibits the carrying of handguns."
 
It would seem I was wrong about the planes

Where you may not carry

(8) An aircraft that is in, or intended for operation in, foreign air transportation, interstate air transportation, intrastate air transportation, or the transportation of mail by aircraft;

um, isn't flying by definition "transportation"? If I were to fly from one in-state airport to another in-state airport, that would be "intrastate air transportation", right?
 
um, isn't flying by definition "transportation"? If I were to fly from one in-state airport to another in-state airport, that would be "intrastate air transportation", right?

And what government body is the only government body that regulates intrastate air transportation?
 
PA has a pretty good (short) list of prohibited places:

Off-limits places in PA and what makes them off-limits:
1. Court Facilities - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 913
2a.*Grounds and buildings of Elementary and Secondary schools(K-12 grades), whether the school is private or public. There is an affirmative defense for "other lawful purposes" however there is no case law determining on what that includes. To be safe, its wiser to assume it does not include our carrying "rights". - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 912
2b. Within 1000ft of a school unless you have a license/permit issued by the state in which the school is located - US Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, Subsection 922(q)
3. Casinos - by regulation Title 58, Part VII, Chapter 465, Subsection 465a.13
4. Certain Department of State buildings - by regulation
5. ****Places off-limits by Federal Law or regulation, IE: military installations(exceptions for hunting at some bases), Federal Government buildings, after the security check point in airports,etc.
6. Any private property where a landowner, tenant or person so authorized to maintain property has asked you to leave because you are carrying, or where the property owner or tenant has placed signs or placards denoting that guns are forbidden - Title 18, Chapter 35, Subsection 3503
7. Detention facilities, correctional institutes, or mental hospitals - Title 18, Chapter 51, Subsection 5122


*Colleges are not prohibited by law, however the college could levy their own infractions like expelling the person or other civil punishments.
****The Federal Parks and Reserves are legal again. New law went into effect 02/22/10. Federal buildings in Fed. Parks and Reserves are still off-limits. While in a Federal Park, you follow the laws of the state in which it is located.



 
um, isn't flying by definition "transportation"? If I were to fly from one in-state airport to another in-state airport, that would be "intrastate air transportation", right?

Now we have to figure out if "transportation" means you are transporting people/goods for hire, transporting people/goods for free, or transporting yourself I guess.

But does not matter to me. In NYC, we cannot have a gun. Period. In home takes over a grand in applications, appointments, interviews, etc. And carry is only in a special circumstance, where you can prove that you are transporting cash over $10k on a regular basis, and have reasonable fear for your life.
 
Now we have to figure out if "transportation" means you are transporting people/goods for hire, transporting people/goods for free, or transporting yourself I guess.
Exactly. Under Ohio law you're only engaged in transportation if doing so for hire, so PPL has no worries.
 
There is a big open carry movement here it seems, at least online anyways. Have thought about it but I am not sure I have the courage to do so.

The only time I open carry, when permitted, is while on the motorcycle. It is amazing how many cagers that "Don't see" motorcycles give you a very wide berth when they see a sidearm strapped to your hip.
 
I would not print on purpose either but I am not so sure open carry is bad either. There is a big open carry movement here it seems, at least online anyways. Have thought about it but I am not sure I have the courage to do so.

David

It isn't as common as the OC guys would make you think.

I have a few reasons I don't do it often (though I don't care too much if I print or my jacket blows open)

1) surprise factor
2) I don't want the attention
3) guns scare sheep and sheep vote against what scares them
 
It isn't as common as the OC guys would make you think.

I have a few reasons I don't do it often (though I don't care too much if I print or my jacket blows open)

1) surprise factor
2) I don't want the attention
3) guns scare sheep and sheep vote against what scares them


All good reasons not to open carry.

#1 is one they covered in CCW class ;last night. Also, it is an opportunity for a thug to arm himself with your gun.

#2 is a big one for me. I would be afraid of that first encounter with a anti-gun person in a store raising a fuss.

#3 is bad for our rights.

David
 
All good reasons not to open carry.

#1 is one they covered in CCW class ;last night. Also, it is an opportunity for a thug to arm himself with your gun.

Yeah, that's why all thugs are armed with guns they took from uniformed cops.

Your CCW instructor is an idiot, if he didn't teach you the Gunsite color codes:

WHITE -- unaware of surroundings. Fat, dumb and happy. Self-designated victim.

YELLOW -- aware of surroundings, no imminent threat detected. A person carrying a gun should ALWAYS be in Yellow or higher. "I might have to shoot today."

ORANGE -- possible threat noticed (focus drawn). "I might have to shoot HIM today."

RED -- POSITIVE and ACTIVE threat IDENTIFIED. "If he doesn't stop what he's doing, I HAVE to shoot him!"

#2 is a big one for me. I would be afraid of that first encounter with a anti-gun person in a store raising a fuss.
Why? Not that it happens very often, but if someone does give you flak, you simply ignore them, or turn it around with a joke. On the rare occasion that someone asks why I'm carrying a gun, I say that it's because if I ever need it, it's too late to go get one.

Or:

"Why do you carry a gun?"

"Because a COP would be too HEAVY."

I carry pretty much every day, everywhere that it's legal. I've had about 20 positive responses to every neutral or negative response. In fact, I'm about to go to lunch at a place that hasn't been robbed since they posted a sign announcing a discount to people who are carrying.

#3 is bad for our rights.
What is worse for our rights, people complaining about them, or people afraid to use them?

Notice that even on the NATIONAL level, hoplophobia has proven to be a career-killer for most politicians. Nobody has ever been turned out of office for voting in favor of civil rights -- including the ones in Arizona who voted to make "Constitutional carry" legal -- while an increasing number are being thrown out for voting to restrict them (such as the two most powerful legislators in deep-blue Colorado).
 
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PA has a pretty good (short) list of prohibited places:

Off-limits places in PA and what makes them off-limits:
1. Court Facilities - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 913
2a.*Grounds and buildings of Elementary and Secondary schools(K-12 grades), whether the school is private or public. There is an affirmative defense for "other lawful purposes" however there is no case law determining on what that includes. To be safe, its wiser to assume it does not include our carrying "rights". - PA Title 18, Chapter 9, Subsection 912
2b. Within 1000ft of a school unless you have a license/permit issued by the state in which the school is located - US Title 18, Part I, Chapter 44, Subsection 922(q)
3. Casinos - by regulation Title 58, Part VII, Chapter 465, Subsection 465a.13
4. Certain Department of State buildings - by regulation
5. ****Places off-limits by Federal Law or regulation, IE: military installations(exceptions for hunting at some bases), Federal Government buildings, after the security check point in airports,etc.
6. Any private property where a landowner, tenant or person so authorized to maintain property has asked you to leave because you are carrying, or where the property owner or tenant has placed signs or placards denoting that guns are forbidden - Title 18, Chapter 35, Subsection 3503
7. Detention facilities, correctional institutes, or mental hospitals - Title 18, Chapter 51, Subsection 5122


*Colleges are not prohibited by law, however the college could levy their own infractions like expelling the person or other civil punishments.
****The Federal Parks and Reserves are legal again. New law went into effect 02/22/10. Federal buildings in Fed. Parks and Reserves are still off-limits. While in a Federal Park, you follow the laws of the state in which it is located.




Clause 2b is patently absurd. What if you live within 1000 feet of a school or drive past one?
 
Being a Michigan resident, and use to our clear, concise CCW law, I find Ohio's quite cumbersome. I once stopped to grab a bite and later found that had I been confronted by a cop I would have been in violation because the place sold alcohol. It was a pizza shop. Had it been a bar I wouldn't have gone in.

Their CCW laws do need some cleanup and clarification.
 
Open carry nut-jobs do more damage to gun rights than any anti-gun groups.

Trying to intimidate a bunch of moms at a lunch meeting just looks bad.

1458500_462787307172528_367801306_n.png
 
There is a certain beauty with CCW in that the firearm should be concealed unless you need to use it. If you need to use it, I doubt the legality of possession would be a major concern of yours at that point. I'm not advocating ignorance of the law, nor noncompliance with it, I'm just making an observation about enforcement.

I don't have a huge problem with open carry, except that many in the general public do. It only takes one of the wrong kinds of people to get a glimpse of what they think might be a firearm to make a scene, which is never a good kind of attention.

In my opinion, many of the firearms laws exist to protect the public from their own ignorant, irrational fears. They certainly don't do anything to actually protect the public, and have cost many lives over the years. Nevertheless, firearms owners need to acknowledge the reality that walking around with a firearm on your hip as a demonstration of "exercising your rights" generally isn't helpful to the cause.


JKG
 
Being a Michigan resident, and use to our clear, concise CCW law, I find Ohio's quite cumbersome. I once stopped to grab a bite and later found that had I been confronted by a cop I would have been in violation because the place sold alcohol. It was a pizza shop. Had it been a bar I wouldn't have gone in.

Their CCW laws do need some cleanup and clarification.

We fixed that.
 
Open carry nut-jobs do more damage to gun rights than any anti-gun groups.

Trying to intimidate a bunch of moms at a lunch meeting just looks bad.

1458500_462787307172528_367801306_n.png

What about those who peacefully open carry and don't participate in such shenanigans? There are those who don't believe OCing an AR15 is a good idea, actually, the majority.
 
What about those who peacefully open carry and don't participate in such shenanigans? There are those who don't believe OCing an AR15 is a good idea, actually, the majority.

One bad apple spoils and such. . .

Company you keep . . . And such.
 
Ohio HB 231 (Eliminate 'No Guns' Victim Zones)


"Under the proposed legislation, Ohioans would be able to carry concealed guns in churches, day cares, private airplanes and government buildings. The bill would also allow college campuses to permit concealed guns on their campuses if they choose to."

Doesn't the FAA aka Federal Government pre-empt this one? As in no gun on airports that receives Federal Funds?

I am confused, not against the bill, confused. I am in the middle of a CCW permit class here in Ohio anyways so I need to learn all this stuff.

Two bills are in consideration to bring us more in line with other states gun laws.

David

Weapons are only prohibited on the airline ramp/secured area of an airport by the feds… Thats not the fence line, thats the terminal and the portion of the ramp that is designated for the airline operations.

I've legally carried a handgun in my bag during many of my travels, and on my person after exiting the plane, (In Texas) and it was not an issue whatsoever. And all the states I flew to had reciprocity with Texas at the time…
 
What about those who peacefully open carry and don't participate in such shenanigans? There are those who don't believe OCing an AR15 is a good idea, actually, the majority.

And what about the ones who do? And also, I would like to hear just ONE sane reason why do you need to open-carry AR15.
 
And what about the ones who do? And also, I would like to hear just ONE sane reason why do you need to open-carry AR15.

And just who are you that someone needs to justify it to you?
 
Why is every rifle called an AR-15 or AK-47 by those who don't know any better? Because that's what the media wants them to think.
 
And what about the ones who do? And also, I would like to hear just ONE sane reason why do you need to open-carry AR15.

two words--zombie apocalypse


in all seriousness, unless you're taking the AR15 from your car to the house or vice versa, not a whole lot of reason to have one out in the open. Just because you can doesn't mean it's a good idea.
 
Yeah, that's why all thugs are armed with guns they took from uniformed cops.

Your CCW instructor is an idiot, if he didn't teach you the Gunsite color codes:

We were taught the different alert levels without the hard to remember color codes. The color codes are useless in everyday life and I doubt anyone thinks "I am in yellow condition." LOL

David
 
Being a Michigan resident, and use to our clear, concise CCW law, I find Ohio's quite cumbersome. I once stopped to grab a bite and later found that had I been confronted by a cop I would have been in violation because the place sold alcohol. It was a pizza shop. Had it been a bar I wouldn't have gone in.

Their CCW laws do need some cleanup and clarification.

You can go into a bar now and carry CCW as long as you do not drink. Better? That got cleaned up in 2011 I believe.

More changes going through the legislature in two different bills as we speak. One got passed by the Ohio House yesterday.

David
 
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Weapons are only prohibited on the airline ramp/secured area of an airport by the feds… Thats not the fence line, thats the terminal and the portion of the ramp that is designated for the airline operations.

I've legally carried a handgun in my bag during many of my travels, and on my person after exiting the plane, (In Texas) and it was not an issue whatsoever. And all the states I flew to had reciprocity with Texas at the time…

Thanks Dave. The laws get confusing sometimes.

David
 
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