[NA] Pond Question

Ted

Ted

The pilot formerly known as Twin Engine Ted
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Our house has two fish ponds. Both are pretty small, and both have fish in them (goldfish). The one needs a new pump, which I'm going to order after I'm finished typing this up.

We aren't familiar with having fish ponds, so haven't been through the process before. With the weather warming up, it is obvious that there is a lot of algae that has grown on the rocks. The water has cleared up substantially after getting a lot of junk out with nets (we should've put covers on over the winter, but didn't).

What sort of chemicals, treatment, or other maintenance do you all recommend for your fish ponds? It seems the real issues are getting the algae off the rocks, and anything that's good for keeping it clear.
 
Ted, I have a friend that is a Pond Savant. His claim to fame was that he bought James Earl Jone's pond back to life. Tomorrow I'll get you his contact information.
 
Algae on the rocks are a good thing. They use up nutrients that would otherwise go to floating pea-soup algae.

What kind of filter system do you use? A bio-filter that has been loaded with the appropriate bacteria does a nice job of keeping the water clear. You need to watch the PH and KH as well. But, in general, once everything is stabilized, it can pretty much run on it's own. I just clean out the filter (a big tub of scrubbie things) and the pump box every year or two.
 
No chemicals of any kind are needed, a pond is a natural ecosystem. What other plants are in there other than algae? We have some anacharis, which tends to outcompete the algae during the warm weather months. We also have a large lily and a couple of bog plants. Combine this with a biofilter, and the algae is manageable. BTW, anacharis is an invasive exotic in some places, if you have any that you need to scoop out, either bury it or put it in a compost pile so it won't start growing in any naturally occuring waterways.

You may want to remove some of the muck at the bottom every few years. Also, is some of the water getting flushed out by rainfall every once in a while? If not, you may want to do an occasional partial water change. If you are using city water, not too big of a change, the chlorine is hard on fish gills.

Also, please remember that algae is a natural component of pond plant life, more so at some times of the year than others. We're having a bit of a spirogyra bloom right now, as the sun gets a little higher it will go away,
 
Good information, thanks.

My ponds don't need to be "brought back to life", I just have no idea WTF they're supposed to do, and WTF I'm supposed to do. There is some junk that I need to get out (leaves, etc.). I've got most of them, but not all. There are no other plants in them. It's sounding like they're actually overall pretty decent, other than needing to get cleaned out a bit more. I will say the ponds were clearer and had less algae on the rocks when we bought the house. But, that wasn't after having sat all winter.

I have no idea what the filter system is on these, and I haven't cleaned out the boxes. What should I be looking for to find a filter? In the big pond there's a 1" thick fibrous thing before the pump, I don't know if that's the filter or not. In the small pond, the pump seems to be fed by three horn-looking devices in the bottom (all of which are covered in algae).

We ordered a new pump last night for the big pond. Amazon Prime, so should be here tomorrow or Wednesday. Once I get that going, I suspect the big pond will clear up more, same as the little pond has.
 
steingar said:
Get something that eats algae, like snails.
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And/or add plants to compete with the algae for nutrients. Floaters like duckweed, water hyacinth, hornwort, pennywort, and Amazon frogbit are easy and cheap.

The algae is more of a symptom of questionable water quality than a problem in itself, by the way. The fish don't mind it in the least. It's actually beneficial to the extent that it's helping to resolve the probable water quality issues.

Rich
 
Theboys said:
I use copper sulfate in my pond to keep algae down. Can buy at farm store
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As long as you have no crustaceans or other invertebrates in the pond. Copper beyond the tiny amount they need to synthesize hemocyanin is deadly toxic to invertebrates.

Rich
 
You are going to get some algae bloom in the spring.

My filter is about 2 feet in diameter and 1 1/2 feet high or so and filled with plastic scrub things. I set the water flow through it to be a moderate trickle. I haven't fired it up yet this spring...
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
You are going to get some algae bloom in the spring.

My filter is about 2 feet in diameter and 1 1/2 feet high or so and filled with plastic scrub things. I set the water flow through it to be a moderate trickle. I haven't fired it up yet this spring...
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A biofilter is essentially just a (usually) plastic box with something inside it, like foam or plastic balls, that provides a surface for bacteria to colonize. The bacteria break down the fish waste, ultimately to nitrogen gas. I open mine up once a year and rinse out the foam at the top. The bottom is filled with plastic balls, they require no maintenance. Some people run an ultraviolet light that kills single cell algae that makes the water cloudy. After the pond is established, this shouldn't be necessary. You may get an algae bloom in the spring, but it usually takes care of itself.

When you have a pond, you have water, nutrients in the form of fish waste and uneaten food, maybe some frog eggs, and the dust that blows into pond. Add to that some sunlight, and Nature is going to insist that something green is going to grow in there, whether it be algae or some aquatic plant.
 
I have a converted 20' x 36' in-ground pool with koi, goldfish, fathead minnows, bluegill, largemouth bass, and red-eared sliders. A pair of mallards nest here every year and a lot of their friends visit too. The ducks add a lot of poop to the water too. I have plenty of plants (in a bog filter that takes up the entire shallow end) to eat the nutrients, and I supplement with barley-straw extract during the warm months. I dropped one of those little plastic stakes that the nursery uses to label plants and it settled to the deepest point, just short of 10' deep. The water is so clear that I could still read it.

The barley straw controls the suspended types of algae, but not the stringy kind or the little puffs that grow on rocks and other surfaces. The koi and goldfish keep that under control wherever they can reach it, and the remaining nooks and crannies look good with a bit of algae anyway.

If your ponds are not very deep, raccoons and birds will get your fish. If that is the case, just go with the flow and stock feeder goldfish in your raccoon feeder. Otherwise the battle gets tiresome and the nets and other defensive measures become unsightly.
 
The previous owner put an owl up by one pond, which seemed to keep the fish pretty safe. It seems to have worked, there are a bunch.

Good information guys, thanks. I don't know much about normal ponds, but this all makes sense.
 
Heh - owl decoys...

I came home from work years ago and heard a real commotion going on in my back yard. My neighbor had an owl on the fence to keep rabbits away from his garden. I don't know if that worked or not, but there was a juvenile red-tail hawk on the fence trying to start something with that owl. The hawk was squawking, flapping his wings, hopping up and down, and pretty much really ****ed at that owl. He'd hop over it to get to the other side, then hop back. Eventually a dog came over to check out the action and the hawk flew away.

I have a buddy that's pretty much into ponds (didn't you ask about this last fall?) I can ask him any specific questions you might have.
 
Got the new pump for the larger pond. I wasn't sure which one to buy, so I bought one that looked the same and had the proper flow rate according to some online calculator I found.

It works, water flows, it's a pretty pond. Fish are happy. Water is clearing up.

However, the box that the pump in doesn't seem to flow enough water to keep full. Here's a picture of it in use. Is this normal? I'm thinking not, my other pond doesn't do this. This makes me wonder if I bought too large of a pump, and if I should then either:

1) Get a smaller pump
2) Increase the flow to the box
3) Leave it alone

Thoughts?
 
IMG_20160313_160618.jpg
 
I would be inclined to add a second inlet just for when one of them gets clogged with a leaf so that the pump doesn't run dry.
 
I just checked with my fish pond expert buddy. Is that pumping into a filter? Waterfall?

That system has a couple of problems - the inlet allows debris into that chamber where the impeller might chop it up and add junk into your system. That inlet can get clogged, and it can allow fish to get in. The pump should be submerged. You might think about adding some kind of prefilter to keep debris out, and maybe increase flow to thw pump. He said, ideally, 3-4 water volume changes per hour for a fish pond is a rule of thumb for pump capacity.

He's forwarding me some more info.
 
Here are some links my buddy just gave me. He also can recommend a few places around the KC area that know what they are doing.

>>>

These forums are good for learning about any kind of pond: plants only, goldfish, or koi. The principles are the same. There are sticky discussions that list the general concepts of pond care that are a great starting point.

http://www.thepondforum.com/forum.php

http://www.koiphen.com/forums

https://www.kcfishclub.org/

http://www.fishchannel.com/

http://www.koiusa.com/

http://www.fishchannel.com/

http://www.koi-bito.com/forum/forum.php

<<<
 
Sounds like the big thing is it needs an additional inlet. I had the same thought about junk in there, and yes, fish have made their way into that part as well.
 
I don't know if anybody as mentioned it, but you can get blue pond dyes that are not toxic to fish. The blue dye blocks sunlight, which inhibits algae formation. They are fairly effective in closed pond systems.
 
I found that having the pump running periodically helped keep the algae down to a reasonable level in and of itself. It seemed like stagnant, standing water seemed to promote it more.

Small amounts of Copper Sulfate to maintain through the year. Run the pump in the winter periodically when the water is liquid.
 
We ended up giving up on the "self-balanced system", as that balance seemed to include way too much algae. A little fish-safe algaecide has worked very well. For the time being there's still enough algae for the fish to eat, but not the ridiculous amount that made the ponds look ugly. We'll buy some fish food if we have to, but if we can keep it at a low level of algae, that's the best.
 
GlennAB1 said:
If you leave fish in it year round they need the muck at the bottom. And, if you get Koi, don't get very many because they get huge.
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We have a large, spring and creek fed natural pond. None of the koi were bigger than 3" or 4" when bought, and we have about seven a foot long or more.

Here are some cruising under the ice in January, 2014:


The darker ones are brim or crappie that just showed up one day and started multiplying.
 
The biggest we have are about 6". They're fun to watch. I don't think our ponds would support a footlong, not enough space.
 
Ted DuPuis said:
The biggest we have are about 6". They're fun to watch. I don't think our ponds would support a footlong, not enough space.
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I've heard koi will only grow to accommodate the space they have, on average growing about an inch a year.

An idea of the size of our pond:

26471932952_cbb60c7d07_z.jpg
 
FastEddieB said:
I've heard koi will only grow to accommodate the space they have, on average growing about an inch a year.

An idea of the size of our pond:

26471932952_cbb60c7d07_z.jpg
Click to expand...

Yeah, your pond is a bit larger than our fish ponds... :)

I've heard as well that they only grow to accommodate the size of the pond. I have no idea how much per year. We're seeing some 6" guys that we didn't recall seeing last year, but last year we only had a month or two before things got closed up for the winter. We had enough else going on that we didn't pay much attention.

Your pond looks great! We have a good sized pond at the back of the property (see here: https://goo.gl/maps/oS3sgp1HYBt). Right now, there's so much brush and overgrowth that we can't get all that close to it. We might clear the brush up some so that we can use it, but that's very low on the priority list. No idea if there are fish or anything else in there.
 
The nice folks at the Fisheries Dept at the university recommended that I get 3-4 sterile grass carp to eat this mess down to a manageable size. May work for Eddie, too, but not for those with "water features" vs. ponds.
 

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I had the largest molded plastic pond available at Lowe's, put a dozen Koi in it in the spring and they were huge by fall, some were about a foot long, even with a filter and plants the water was a cesspool.
 
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