Mental Illnesses & Third Class Medical

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David Jackson

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Hi,

So I've wanted to be a pilot since I was a child however I have two problems that I know are considered disqualifying for a third class medical either outright or indirectly due to the medications (Bipolar Disorder and ADHD). I was diagnosed as a child with both (~40 years) and am one of the exceptionally few that not only found the right medication but have been on the same meds for decades at this point with no incidents of mental issues, legal troubles, career issues or other problems that are normally associated with these two disorders. I'm aware of sport pilot not requiring a medical however I also believe that the regulations require that if you have a known disqualifying condition, you aren't supposed to fly assuming I read the rules & regulations right. The same is also true if you denied a third class medical too.

I have had some people say I should go sport pilot anyway, including a couple of docs, but I don't want to do this because:
1. It's not legal! This is assuming I'm reading the rules & regulations correctly of course but breaking the law to exercise a privilege isn't right legally or morally but more importantly would just reinforce the idea that someone with a mental condition can't be trusted to make the right decisions. I'm not out to prove everyone with a condition can be safe, that's simply not possible, but I want to prove that I can be safe and lying out of the gate or omitting information isn't the way to achieve that.
2. Sport pilot doesn't allow you to fly at night or achieve an IFR rating. While these aren't privileges I would exercise on a regular basis they are something I want to work on specifically to become a safer pilot. My father was a test pilot ib the air force and said if I ever learned to fly, he'd highly recommend spending the extra time training to "plan for the unplanned".
3. I'm aware of the potential side effects of the medications and my conditions which in my view makes it even more important to go through the process of trying to get a third class medical. Why? Because although I'm highly successful in my field and haven't had any issues since childhood, that doesn't automatically mean I'm safe to fly and only someone else who is qualified should make that determination.

I know this would be an uphill battle and my chances are probably slim but I've been thinking about this for over a year now, the only question remaining would be where start or if I should even try.
 
I'm aware of sport pilot not requiring a medical however I also believe that the regulations require that if you have a known disqualifying condition, you aren't supposed to fly assuming I read the rules & regulations right. The same is also true if you denied a third class medical too.
Not quite. Under FAR 61.53, "a person shall not act as pilot in command, or in any other capacity as a required pilot flight crewmember, while that person knows or has reason to know of any medical condition that would make the person unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner." That's in your judgement as a pilot. It doesn't say anything about disqualifying conditions for a medical; otherwise there wouldn't be any point to SP.

However, if you apply for and are denied a 3rd class medical, then you can't fly as a SP until it's cleared up.
Sport pilot doesn't allow you to fly at night or achieve an IFR rating. While these aren't privileges I would exercise on a regular basis they are something I want to work on specifically to become a safer pilot.
Nothing says that a SP can't get instruction in night or instrument flying; you just can't do it solo or get the rating without a medical. I never fly at night and have flown safely for 50 years without an instrument rating.
 
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Nothing keeping you from starting training for Sport. The 3rd Class gives you no medical advantage. You can also train for PPL, IR, Comm, just don’t need to do the checkrides if you want to keep learning skills and be safer, but wouldn’t be able to get the certs due to whatever that might be disqualifying under those.
 
Not quite. Under FAR 61.53, "a person shall not act as pilot in command, or in any other capacity as a required pilot flight crewmember, while that person knows or has reason to know of any medical condition that would make the person unable to operate the aircraft in a safe manner." That's in your judgement as a pilot. It doesn't say anything about disqualifying conditions for a medical; otherwise there wouldn't be any point to SP.

However, if you apply for and are denied a 3rd class medical, then you can't fly as a SP until it's cleared up.
Emphasis added for OP
 
Thanks all so it seems my assumptions around sport pilot, in particular having a disqualifying condition or medication stops you from being allowed to fly sport, was wrong. Based on the above and some more digging I found these:

- https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-61/subpart-A/section-61.53
- https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/chapter-I/subchapter-D/part-61/subpart-J/section-61.303
- https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-...-D/part-61/subpart-A/section-61.23#p-61.23(b)
- https://www.faa.gov/faq/if-i-suspec...have-never-had-faa-medical-certificate-denied

Dana's post in particular comes up in the first link. The third link comes from the Federal Air Surgeon calling out changes that were made to 61.53 specifically to allow for usage of a driver's license as a medical qualification referencing the second and third links which lays out more specifics. The bits that are the most relevant here are under https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-14/part-61/section-61.23#p-61.23(c)(2) (which goes back to Dana & 455's posts).

So for me I think the best next step is to talk to my doctors and get their opinions before I do anything. I believe I'd be safe going the sport pilot path but I want the third party opinion first, especially given they'd be better equipped to see any changes I might not have noticed over the years if any.

One final question, probably for bbchien or another AME. If I got my sport pilot certificate and built hours with no incidents, could that later be used to help pursue a special issuance or other path toward a medical in the future if I want to do so? I'm aware it's not a guarantee that a medical certificate will be issued in these cases, and it could prevent me from flying in the future if it's denied, but I'm curious if there's precedent for it?

Thanks again for all the responses.
 
Sorry OP, but I disagree with the others and think that you are correct. I would not consider it legal to fly on sport pilot with a known disqualifying condition.

My apologies, that's hard if it's a dream of yours.
 
I don't know the answer to the question but would ask the OP if they have taken a discovery flight with an opportunity to handle the controls. You may dream of flying but the reality may be different than the dream. If you don't want to pursue Sport until you can settle the questions you have there are some awesome ultralights that you could enjoy in the meantime ...


I've flown a number of ultralight aircraft (a few moons ago) and one of my favorites was the CGS Hawk. Single seat pusher with three axis control and real flaps:

1773631106899.png
 
Sorry OP, but I disagree with the others and think that you are correct. I would not consider it legal to fly on sport pilot with a known disqualifying condition.

My apologies, that's hard if it's a dream of yours.
What you consider legal is not really the point. Can you cite a regulation that supports your position?
 
Sorry OP, but I disagree with the others and think that you are correct. I would not consider it legal to fly on sport pilot with a known disqualifying condition.

My apologies, that's hard if it's a dream of yours.
It’s not disqualifying outright, it’s disqualifying for an unrestricted class 3 or above, not sport pilot.
 
Another plug for taking a flight or three… be very upfront with the instructor about the fact you want their opinion about your overall suitability for flying in the venue you intend, taking into account your concerns.

Frankly, neither docs or cfi’s have ALL the answers. The combination will be even better.
 
It comes down to, "Am I safe to fly?"
I won't fly if I don't feel as if I'd be competent.
Sure, and medically certificated pilots are expected to ask that of themselves prior to every flight.

If the OP wants to be thorough, do the cog screen and see if the Dr sees any aeromedically deficient results. Otherwise, the OP needs to be honest with themselves.
 
What medication/s? Not only is bipolar disqualifying so too are many of the drugs that treat it.

If you manage to get through the hoops to get a 3rd class medical I would be impressed! If you are committed to getting a medical certificate nothing should stop you just be prepared to spend a lot of time and money.
 
What medication/s? Not only is bipolar disqualifying so too are many of the drugs that treat it.

If you manage to get through the hoops to get a 3rd class medical I would be impressed! If you are committed to getting a medical certificate nothing should stop you just be prepared to spend a lot of time and money.
I have yet to find a medication used to treat bipolar as being approved. And I had a senior AME at a pilots round-table years ago say that people with bipolar do not get any class of medicals. I was grounded years ago after being diagnosed bipolar, medical wasn't suspended or revoked, just let expire, but as such even though I could fly Sport Pilot (especially now with Mosaic), I wouldn't feel comfortable flying. I took a recurrency flight with an instructor a year ago, the first since being placed on medication, and discovered I could no longer keep up with the airplane. Sure, skill atrophy but I believe medication can cause cognitive deficits and I haven't been up since.

Not saying OP should or should not pursue Sport Pilot. That's a personal decision based on one's interpretation of the rules. And if he want's to pursue a medical, I'd go for a consultation and not ruin the opportunity to do Sports Pilot
 
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