marshaller trust

[Let'sgoflying!]

I got to thinking about marshaller responsibility and training (and insurance/legal) when parking at an airport yesterday where every thing was VERY tight squeeze. If we hit something while being marshalled into an FBO, seems like it is going to be our word against theirs ('I motioned him to stop" vs "He was waving me forward") and likely the PIC would lose any such debate, I think. So here is a poll.

 

[Henning]

I got to thinking about marshaller responsibility and training (and insurance/legal) when parking at an airport yesterday where every thing was VERY tight squeeze. If we hit something while being marshalled into an FBO, seems like it is going to be our word against theirs ('I motioned him to stop" vs "He was waving me forward") and likely the PIC would lose any such debate, I think. So here is a poll.

YOU as PIC are responsable anytime you are controlling the motion of your craft. The actual function of a marshaller is to provide you an extra set of eyes on what you may not be able to see and advise where ground would like you to put your plane, which you may or maynot agree with.
So, I use a marshaller for what (s)he can provide me, but typically for the planes I fly, I have no need for one.

 

[Carol]

I got to thinking about marshaller responsibility and training (and insurance/legal) when parking at an airport yesterday where every thing was VERY tight squeeze. If we hit something while being marshalled into an FBO, seems like it is going to be our word against theirs ('I motioned him to stop" vs "He was waving me forward") and likely the PIC would lose any such debate, I think. So here is a poll.

Regardless of whose fault it is, the marshaller is not going to have to pay out the $$ to get the plane fixed. Or be left without an airplane while it is in the shop.

 

[fgcason]

Nope.

It's my airplane, not theirs. If the plane gets pranged, I'm responsible, screwed and stranded until it gets fixed. They go home and drink their beer all happy that night. Remember that their training and experience can range from extremely excellent to nonexistent. Unless you know them you can't know which is which.

For the planes I fly and most likely ever will fly, other than them pointing where they specifically want me to park for whatever reason, I have no need for them. If I'm close enough to something that I need them to avoid a collision, I will shut down, get out and have a look myself. On more than one occasion I have directly and blatantly disobeyed their signals.


Things I've learned as a pilot and ex-ramp rat watching stupid tricks, here's a few bits of advice to anyone who is or wants to become a ramp rat:
(1) DO NOT stand in front of my prop at ANY distance for ANY reason. You DO NOT belong there at all. DO NOT walk toward the front of the plane. (Note: You really do not want me to have to do an emergency shutdown with the mags because of you. I won't be nice about it in the least)
(2) DO NOT walk up to my little storm window on the Cherokee for any reason even if the engine is stopped. Go stand behind the wing and wait until I open the door. Same basic principle applies to high wings.
(3) DO NOT disappear under my nose to put a towbar on the nosewheel or to put chocks under the nosewheel or mains. Stay where I can see you. (Excluding emergency situations, no tugs, handpull only, if it needs to be tugged somewhere I'd rather taxi or do the pull myself)
(4) Don't walk in front of the plane (always behind). NEVER touch the prop. Just stay back and don't touch anything until I say it's ok.
(5) I do the tiedown myself even if the Atlantic Ocean is being poured through a sieve on my head. Don't redo the knots, mine are secure. Don't untie it unless it's an emergency such as something about to run over my plane at which time I will thank you for your excellent foresight. (If you have to untie it, call me at the number I gave you and I'll come back out and tie it down again) I also bring my own ropes. If I don't trust your rings, I'll park in the grass and use my own screws.
(6) Refuel only when I'm present at the airplane. I prefer you to just hand me the ground clip and hose and talk about the weather and what a wonderful day it is to be flying. I put the oil in.
(7) If the plane is alone and facing immenent disaster, do whatever needs to be done. Don't let it just sit there.

My airplane, my responsibility, not theirs.

 

[BruceAir]

I've had many intersting experiences with marshallers when taxiing in the Extra. As you may know, one solos from the rear seat of the Extra. From that position, you have zero visibility directly ahead while on the ground.

When I taxi in to an FBO ramp, invariably the marshaller assumes a position directly in front of the nose as I turn into the tie-down spot. I stop as I complete the turn. Sometimes, I can barely see a pair of batons being waggled high, but most of the time, I'm looking at the sky and the pretty clouds.

Sometimes, the marshaller finally recognizes that if he or she can't see me, I can't see him or her. Most of the time, however, I wait a few moments to determine if the ramp person is going move to the side, and then shut down. This action usually produces a puzzled/irritated look from the marshaller when he or she approaches the cockpit. Then, when I explain the situation, the light bulb goes on.

I need one of those stickers like the big rigs have ("If you can't see my mirrors, I can't see you").

 

[Ed Guthrie]

The marshaller indicates preference as to where s/he would like the aircraft parked and sometimes what route s/he would like me to take getting to that spot. I decide if it will happen and how.

 

[bbchien]

There was a marshaller at Scahumburg who had never read the standard AIM hand signals. He kept approaching my left prop. I kept shutting it down. I offered to buy him the AIM. I finally complained to the manager. He parked me three times. Count em, six plus 3 more engine starts to save his bacon.

I have never been back.

 

[fgcason]

There was a marshaller at Scahumburg who had never read the standard AIM hand signals. He kept approaching my left prop.

That's what scares me to no end about the ones that try to walk up to my storm window. They can stupidly do that and get away with it on a single (assuming they don't get knocked into the prop or blunder into it on their own) but once they routine themselves into that mindset, they're instant hamburger on a twin.

It's way too dangerous in prop country even without bad habits.