looking for a little help

[firedog0311]

I am seeking some advice. I have always wanted to fly and am now looking into going to school for aviation but have some questions about my past. I am 27 and a us. Marine vet served and got out after my 4 years honorable discharge. I then went on a stupid spree and got dwi just over 5 years ago now at .15, disorderly conduct, receving stolen property and. No contact order violation all within 3 years. Most recent 2010 i am no longer on any probation.I have since went to rehab and college for natural resources and currently work for the state full time on a wildfire crew. Please let me know if i could pass an inital 2nd class med cert thanks

 

[gprellwitz]

You don't specify whether you want to go into aviation for recreation or a career. You should be able to get your second-class medical without too much of a problem, though you will definitely have some hoops to jump through. Standby for Dr. Bruce, after he gets back from Thanksgiving with his family. Even better, look through some of the previous threads on DUI. You will find a lot of information there. Note, if you are actually interested in a career in aviation, there may be some additional challenges.

 

[bbchien]

FireWoof, there's the list of requirements:

(1) SAP from A Certified Drug and Alcohol Counselor, according to FAA format. What they do usually for the Courts will NOT DO, and these generally run $200-400. HIGH QUALITY is really really important and I have been disappointed in the CADC type reports, A Ph.D psychologist is better.

(2) DMV search showing that as your DUI is the one and only

(3) Letters from employers/associates who can testify that you are reliable, can be left to work unsupervised, don't cancel at the last moment. (All of those are drug/alcohol behaviors).

(4) Personal Statement
(5) Evidence of attendance at an educational course.
(6) If you can mount it, a normal CBC and a normal ALT (Liver function test).
(7) The actual papers from the DUI. They want to compare your behavior at the scene to 0.150, and hopefully find that you are not "tolerant". At 0.15 no way could I operate a vehicle. I'd be opening the door and falling down on the curb. (I know, you're a marine. ).

Lastly you need an AME who can evaluate the package, negotiate at time of exam, the issuance, so that you walk out PIC and not put up with the 105 day review-wait.

N.B: For a third class they do not expect total abstinence, but if you claim it and you are tolerant, they will call B.S. If you note continuing use, if it is reasonable and intermittent, that won't be a stumbling block. But if you wish an upperclass certificate you have to be abstinent, and be able to show it.

Have a great Holiday. It's about family.

 

[RJM62]

I am seeking some advice. I have always wanted to fly and am now looking into going to school for aviation but have some questions about my past. I am 27 and a us. Marine vet served and got out after my 4 years honorable discharge. I then went on a stupid spree and got dwi just over 5 years ago now at .15, disorderly conduct, receving stolen property and. No contact order violation all within 3 years. Most recent 2010 i am no longer on any probation.I have since went to rehab and college for natural resources and currently work for the state full time on a wildfire crew. Please let me know if i could pass an inital 2nd class med cert thanks

Thank you for your service. And thanks for taking responsibility and fixing the things that needed fixing in your life, rather than whining and pointing the finger of blame elsewhere. Someone who takes responsibility is always a refreshing breath of fresh air here.

As for the rest, Doc B. already replied, so you already have the definitive answer.

-Rich

 

[AggieMike88]

I also thank you for your service and wish you success in getting your medical and pilot certificate.

If you want to know some more about Wild fire fighting and aviation, seek out Douglas Bader on the various forums.

 

[firedog0311]

Thanks guys. Is the dwi the only charge that matters? Do the others get mentioned if so what paperwork do i need on them. Happy turkey day

 

[bbchien]

Even if you beat the DWI, it's the arrest that counts. FAA treats that as a medical event that requires the evaluation protocol...

The disorderly, if it was the same event, doesn't matter.

If the disorderly was an alcohol event and was separate, then you cannot hold a medical certificate without sponsorship from a HIMS AME, federal approval, and demonstrated sobriety (Random Urines). You need at least 6 months of proven sobriety and then a psychiatric eval that is at that point favorable (Two events, in the preceeding 10 years).

 

[firedog0311]

Copy....are there attournys out there to help with this stuff ? Am i beating a dead horse thinking i can still get it? Getting my current job was not to bad i had to provide similar paperwork And i know the state dose quite a background check to be able to drive with lights and siren..

Thanks again guys

 

[bbchien]

Copy....are there attournys out there to help with this stuff ? Am i beating a dead horse thinking i can still get it? Getting my current job was not to bad i had to provide similar paperwork And i know the state dose quite a background check to be able to drive with lights and siren..

Thanks again guys

These are all documents you can get. I have not met an attorney yet who is familiar with Federal Administrative Process.

Find the attorney who did your DUI work, he's got those records.
Go to the phone book and find a CADC. Lookup the federal standards for the evaluation.
Got to the state DMV and pull your record.
Call up your boss and tell him upfront what's up (so he doesn't think your changing jobs).
Tell your doc what you need for the labs.
You have to own this.

 

[firedog0311]

Thankyou very much. I am hoping to use my gi bill to cover school in may , i am hoping to get a good early start on this. I just need to stay positive and pro-active and hopefully things will turn out well. I will keep you posted if you would like.

 

[RJM62]

Thankyou very much. I am hoping to use my gi bill to cover school in may , i am hoping to get a good early start on this. I just need to stay positive and pro-active and hopefully things will turn out well. I will keep you posted if you would like.

Please do. I'm making book you'll do it.

-Rich

 

[Unregistered]

Have you ever attended A.A. ? You will find that a lot of your answers will be answered there. Many airline pilots can be found in A.A. Along with doctors, nurses, salespeople, lawyers.ministers, priests, Etc. you would be amazed at the number of professional people are in this program. One doctor I knew has to be dragged from the operating room drunk when he insisted on doing the operation. He recovered and moved on after a time. Good luck!

 

[firedog0311]

Another question...i realize i need to provide all paperwork i can dig up for my dwi but what do i need to show for the other arrests if they were not alcohol related, i dont think i noted none are felonys. Thanks

 

[bbchien]

Another question...i realize i need to provide all paperwork i can dig up for my dwi but what do i need to show for the other arrests if they were not alcohol related, i dont think i noted none are felonys. Thanks

I think progressive revealations suck and i am done here. They ARE all related to getting medical approval and diminsh your chances...

We are. Now. getting into "persomality disorder multiple acts" and other grounding psychiatric diagnoses, or more serious than onetime alcohol abuse. Good luck you're gonna need it.


I am done as, "oh, by the way" ends a lotta applications.
I cannot work with a guy who isn't upfront.

 

[Steve Foley]

I think progressive revealations suck and i am done here. They ARE all related to getting medical approval and diminsh your chances...

I believe OP is asking about the non-dwi charges he already disclosed.

disorderly conduct, receving stolen property and. No contact order violation all within 3 years.

 

[DaleB]

Bruce, cut the guy some slack. He did state in his first post that he had multiple charges and not all at the same time:

dwi just over 5 years ago now at .15, disorderly conduct, receving stolen property and. No contact order violation all within 3 years

Looked pretty clear to me that his "spree" was more than one event.

 

[bbchien]

Bruce, cut the guy some slack. He did state in his first post that he had multiple charges and not all at the same time:

Looked pretty clear to me that his "spree" was more than one event.

.....and that is what gets us into other diagnoses. Sociopathy, for example. Even if the guy is "good" now we're going to have to fight off all those diagnoses.

Dale, I have no patience left for the guys who try one little bite at a time. We don't do medicine that way, either, its, "BIG PICTURE and important trees".

I get so tired of that c_ap.
These are the guys you can't help out.

 

[DaleB]

Not arguing at all with the diagnoses; it sounds to me like it would be a real uphill battle to get someone certified after a few years off the reservation. I was just pointing out that it didn't seem to me that he was trying to slide in additional incidents -- my reading of his first post was that he'd had three years of trouble, some involving law enforcement and court actions. A guy can get into a lot of trouble in three years with sufficient application of booze and drugs, I've seen it happen. Lots of times.

And sorry my last post on the topic came off a little more abrupt than I intended. I was in a hurry and, quite frankly, have been grumpy as hell lately.

 

[firedog0311]

I was asking a honest question and told the truth in my first post. Regardless of the hoops i need to jump through , and all personal jabs aside i am still going for it with a little help from my employer and the va. I have already obtained a positive mental health and drug and alcohol eval...just a start. Thanks everyone for your info.

 

[TMetzinger]

.....and that is what gets us into other diagnoses. Sociopathy, for example. Even if the guy is "good" now we're going to have to fight off all those diagnoses.

Dale, I have no patience left for the guys who try one little bite at a time. We don't do medicine that way, either, its, "BIG PICTURE and important trees".

I get so tired of that c_ap.
These are the guys you can't help out.

sorry bruce but I think he was up front in his original post.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4

 

[bbchien]

Well, I will say that with the profile of a grifter, FAA is going to demand a forensic psychiatry evaluation (hopefully) from a psych known to them.

You will need all the court paperwork from all the problems, the restraining order, everything. This is now a psych eval.

Firedog I wish you luck but you really really have f-'ed up your record. They are going to make you EARN it back.

 

[poadeleted20]

The original post spoke of "...dwi just over 5 years ago now at .15, disorderly conduct, receving stolen property and. No contact order violation all within 3 years," with that "spree" ending three years ago. That's a lot of stuff not very long ago, and I'm guessing maybe there was alcohol involved with the disorderly conduct arrest (which would be noted in the arrest report). Put that all together, and it's a lot more of a problem than the guy who posted about one DUI 13 years ago with zero other issues. However, while Bruce may have missed those other issues the first time, the OP was up-front about them, so I'm hoping Bruce calms down and comes back to help.

 

[bbchien]

That is correct I didn't count how many there were in addition to the DUI.

The problem is the BIG picture.
Psych eval.

 

[poadeleted20]

That is correct I didn't count how many there were in addition to the DUI.

The problem is the BIG picture.
Psych eval.

That means the full 4-axis (or whatever it's called) evaluation from a HIMS psychiatrist -- several thousand dollars, right?

 

[TMetzinger]

Well, I will say that with the profile of a grafter, FAA is going to demand a forensic psychiatry evaluation (hopefully) from a psych known to them.

You will need all the court paperwork from all the problems, the restraining order, everything. This is now a psych eval.

Firedog I wish you luck but you really really have f-'ed up your record. They are going to make you EARN it back.

Thanks, Bruce!

To the OP, you'll have a bunch of work to do. Only you can decide if it's worth it to you, as I'd predict there'd be some significant expense involved. Light Sport operations are a way to work on flying while you keep going. I expect that every year of "good" living helps when it's time to get evaluated. Best of luck!

 

[SCCutler]

Unbidden, I will urge that, if there is any possibility that alcohol was involved in the various other events, you should very seriously consider visiting with an AA group. The pilot-centric BOAF (Birds Of A Feather) can be a stunningly-useful resource; they know, they won't BS you, and will not be able to be BS'd by you, either.

Call them, if you'll allow it to happen, your rehabilitative DI.

 

[firedog0311]

I see a lot of talk on other legal issues reguarding expungement. Anyone have any experience with this?

Edit... well after a simple google search ,expunged or not, it still needs to be reported. So i dont think it would change a thing.

 

[poadeleted20]

I see a lot of talk on other legal issues reguarding expungement. Anyone have any experience with this?

It's all about exactly what happened and your state's laws on point. You need to ask an attorney in your state with the actual paperwork available for examination.

 

[dell30rb]

This is now a psych eval.

Firedog I wish you luck but you really really have f-'ed up your record. They are going to make you EARN it back.

From the sound of it, he's in about the same boat as my friend who was diagnosed with ADD in middle school.

 

[bbchien]

I see a lot of talk on other legal issues reguarding expungement. Anyone have any experience with this?

Edit... well after a simple google search ,expunged or not, it still needs to be reported. So i dont think it would change a thing.

Problem is, the form asks "have you ever in our life" not, "is there record of".....sigh.

 

[RJM62]

I see a lot of talk on other legal issues reguarding expungement. Anyone have any experience with this?

Edit... well after a simple google search ,expunged or not, it still needs to be reported. So i dont think it would change a thing.

I do wonder how one would obtain the documents related to an expunged conviction if it occurred in a state where expungement really means expungement (as in the records no longer exist, and therefore can't be provided). That would be an interesting Catch-22.

-Rich

 

[bbchien]

I do wonder how one would obtain the documents related to an expunged conviction if it occurred in a state where expungement really means expungement (as in the records no longer exist, and therefore can't be provided). That would be an interesting Catch-22.

-Rich

There is almost always some for profit felon database out here with the undexpunged record on it.....

 

[firedog0311]

Hi guys
I have been wondering about how the faa looks at criminal history. Do they look to see if the person has learned from their past and took steps to improve? Or is it more in depth than that.

 

[Unregistered]

Firedog- If you want badly to be a pilot, you can do it no matter what. Everyone makes mistakes. Get a HIMS AME and start the process. Clear each obstacle as it presents itself. It will cost money, but its only money. I was arrested for an alcohol related offense, and flew jets after that. Just go for it.