Logbook question

rottydaddy

rottydaddy

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beaky
My logbook is full!
Well, not exactly... the (three) spaces reserved in the back for flight reviews is full, but I haven't even filled out half of the flight information pages.
Chances are slim that I will get the rest of the flight pages filled in the next 2 years and get another book (unless I win the lottery), so where does the next BFR get entered?

:dunno:
 
there is plenty of blank spaces on the inside covers and pages, as well as even in the logbook entry pages itself, that a CFI who can read and write could put in a flight review endorsement.
 
tonycondon said:
there is plenty of blank spaces on the inside covers and pages, as well as even in the logbook entry pages itself, that a CFI who can read and write could put in a flight review endorsement.
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That's what I figured; thanks.
But wait... you said a CFI who can read and write?
:D
 
When I was teaching, we had a small sticker with the appropriate endorsement that only had to have the blanks filled in with Pilots name, cert #, date, etc... We then would place those inside the back cover or on one of the last pages of the log book.
 
CFI's in CA are doing REALLY well then. :) One of mine logged 1800 hours just in flight instruction, not including the ole 'walk to the plane' time. @ $50/hr.
 
We had a guy pass the ride two weeks ago. In just a few day, his schedule was slammed.

The Indian and Korean students are neverending on top of local students.
 
AirBaker said:
CFI's in CA are doing REALLY well then. :) One of mine logged 1800 hours just in flight instruction, not including the ole 'walk to the plane' time. @ $50/hr.
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Most flight instructors that I've talked to do not get the $50 per hour that their FBO bills. Try more like $8, maybe $10. Also they don't get 1800 hours per year. You do the math.
 
jesse said:
Most flight instructors that I've talked to do not get the $50 per hour that their FBO bills. Try more like $8, maybe $10. Also they don't get 1800 hours per year. You do the math.
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Our flying club just required the CFIs be active members and attend the meetings. Life must be good at the club.
 
in Ames, the summer i worked full time, i got somewhere around 10 an hour, but since i didnt have school and we were flying a big photo contract, i was able to push 100 hrs a month. i would fly photos until cumulus clouds popped, then fly students. sometimes i would sneak away to instruct in gliders or tow (no pay) because i liked it. only nice thing was since i was full time i had a monthly guarantee of 500 bucks. anything over 40 hrs flying a month and i got paid 12.50 an hour. compared to working part time during the school year, i was rich. i was making as much a week during the summer as i did in a month part time in the winter. can't wait to get back to that.
 
AirBaker said:
CFI's in CA are doing REALLY well then. :) One of mine logged 1800 hours just in flight instruction, not including the ole 'walk to the plane' time. @ $50/hr.
Click to expand...
That's 150 hours per month, and frankly, I do not believe that's humanly possible. I logged 220 hours of flight instruction given in July-Aug 1977; I spent all day, six days a week, at the airport, and was physically whipped at the end, and that was the long, good weather summer days, not Jan-Feb (when I instructed like 30 hours/month). I can't see how anyone could do 50% more, month in, month out, than I did in my two best months -- just can't be done.
 
AWACSEng said:
Nobody said the instruction was quality.
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Neither did I. I just can't figure out how you could actually spend that much flight time in a training aircraft as a flight instructor within a one-year period. Between paperwork, weather, mechanicals, student cancellations, and the FAA's 8-hour/day limit (not to mention breaks for physiological necessity like food and waste disposal), I just don't see how you can do it.
 
That's just what I mean. Without making accusations, just generalizations, a less than honest, money hungry, time building CFI may bend a FAR or two to better his position while providing a less that adequate service to his or her students. As much as we'd like to think those around us are of the highest moral composition, we all know that is not the case.
 
AWACSEng said:
That's just what I mean. Without making accusations, just generalizations, a less than honest, money hungry, time building CFI may bend a FAR or two to better his position while providing a less that adequate service to his or her students. As much as we'd like to think those around us are of the highest moral composition, we all know that is not the case.
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Perhaps, but a flight school would be taking a considerable risk (especially if they're a 141 certificate holder) if they were paying an instrutor for more hours than may be legally flown.
 
Ron Levy said:
That's 150 hours per month, and frankly, I do not believe that's humanly possible.
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Whoever implied CFI's were human? I got the distinct feeling that they were 2nd class bipedal hominids to be used by the flight school owners until they wore out. :D:D

1800 hours does not seem to be very believable. That would be 45 40-hour flying weeks in the year. On my best week, when I was flying full time, I was able to get a 40+ hour week. That was only because I pulled double 20+ hour missions due to crew shortages and aircraft grounding during a time that we were willing to waive certain restrictions on flight crews.

As for the $50/hour. Is that what the FBO charges or what he claimed to earn? If it is the FBO charge I am sure the CFI made but a fraction of it. If the CFI claimed that was his income I remain skeptical, but then you might just have found the highest paid CFI in the world. Kareem, from the red board, makes decent scratch as a CFI in the Bay area and those numbers are way higher than what he has told me about in the past. He even has to have a second job to make ends meet.
 
I cant believe Fbo's actually take a cut from the CFI anymore. At my school I let the CFI's charge whatever they want and keep it. Assuming a CFI gave a proper lesson that's 2.5 to 3 hours of time spent for that one hour in the air. A guy should take home no less than $ 30 for his time.
 
do you insure your CFI's? how do you pay for that?
 
tonycondon said:
do you insure your CFI's? how do you pay for that?
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Yes, we insure our CFI's. But they work as "independent instructors". I found it really works much better this way, especially for the CFI's.
 
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taters said:
I cant believe Fbo's actually take a cut from the CFI anymore. At my school I let the CFI's charge whatever they want and keep it. Assuming a CFI gave a proper lesson that's 2.5 to 3 hours of time spent for that one hour in the air. A guy should take home no less than $ 30 for his time.
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That is only $10 to $12/hour

Starbuck's will pay around $15/hour and give the 'associate' health insurance too.

Glad to know that my barista is worth more than a CFI :mad: :no::no: :mad:
 
smigaldi said:
That is only $10 to $12/hour

Starbuck's will pay around $15/hour and give the 'associate' health insurance too.

Glad to know that my barista is worth more than a CFI :mad: :no::no: :mad:
Click to expand...

There isn't a Starbucks around here that is going to pay anything near $15 per hour. Cut that in half and add a dollar and I'm still probably high.

$10 to $12 per hour to instruct in my free time? I'd be all for that.
 
My client, the flight school and FBO, is looking for instructors. They pay from $15.00 to $18.00 per hour, including ground time, depending upon experience level. No one's getting rich, but I think it is not slave-driving, either.
 
SCCutler said:
My client, the flight school and FBO, is looking for instructors. They pay from $15.00 to $18.00 per hour, including ground time, depending upon experience level. No one's getting rich, but I think it is not slave-driving, either.
Click to expand...

$30k-36k per year assuming 40 hours per week and 50 weeks a year. I agree, not slave driving but not rich either.
 
Unless you're in a great-weather part of the country, assuming 2000 hours worked per year instructing is way off.
If you assume half that (which is probably more reasonable) you're looking at 15-18K per year gross, which is poor.
 
TMetzinger said:
Unless you're in a great-weather part of the country, assuming 2000 hours worked per year instructing is way off.
If you assume half that (which is probably more reasonable) you're looking at 15-18K per year gross, which is poor.
Click to expand...

I don't disagree. However, I made my assumptions based upon the fact that ground school is paid at the same rate. When I was working on my PPL, ground school was conducted on low ceiling days.
 
Good point. If the pay rate is the same no matter what type of instruction given, it is reasonable. OTOH, if you are paid that rate for flight time and only a fraction for ground time you are flirting with having to pay rent on a van down by the river.
 
during tax time they fly at their "own risk









j/k of course..we have a really good ins policy that we pay a bunch of $$ for.
 
rottydaddy said:
My logbook is full!
Well, not exactly... the (three) spaces reserved in the back for flight reviews is full, but I haven't even filled out half of the flight information pages.
Chances are slim that I will get the rest of the flight pages filled in the next 2 years and get another book (unless I win the lottery), so where does the next BFR get entered?

:dunno:
Click to expand...
No rule says he have to fill up one book before you get a new one.:D In fact, I have been thinking of getting a new book early since the old one is looking a little ratty. Not full either.
 
CFI Pay is something that always struck me as odd.

Most of the FBO's around here take a cut of their CFI's hourly rate (I use a private instructor so this doen't apply)

Now go over to your local country club and ask how much their tennis/golf pro charges?

Last I knew no one ever died from a poor tennis swing.
 
CapeCodJay said:
CFI Pay is something that always struck me as odd.

Most of the FBO's around here take a cut of their CFI's hourly rate (I use a private instructor so this doesn't apply)

Now go over to your local country club and ask how much their tennis/golf pro charges?

Last I knew no one ever died from a poor tennis swing.
Click to expand...
Tis better than a valid point. And oddly, with exception of the professional pilot candidates, those who've achieved financial security sufficient to obtain a pilot certificate and ultimately owning an aircraft either are simultaneously or have at one time or another paid for both.

Worse yet, some will balk at paying more to a young guy charged with teaching them flight skills, safety and procedures. Then, they'll say nothing of the charges by a "golf pro" who helps improve their swing. Though it may not be admitted, I believe it's merely because he may be or appear to be ten or fifteen years older than the CFI. The older person seemingly deserves higher fees by their apparent experience by age.

One may compare that to a person who enters a career as a lawyer later in life. He completes a JD at forty and begins practice. Some may look at him and believe they are getting more "legal experience." They are willing to pay more than for the younger-looking guy in his late twenties who has already established himself as an accomplished litigator.

Mis-perception can come back to bite ya. On the other hand, if it gets me an extra twenty bucks over the young whippersnappers I'll be working with... :D
 
rottydaddy said:
My logbook is full!
Click to expand...

So's mine. The "tail #" is legitimate, but I'm wondering if I should "LOG"
these trips.

HR
(and who ever said, "Retirement to the country is a cinch" is full of ---- )
 

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