Why do you believe that? I bet he changes his mind, if'n that is he's not an Internet troll.
Letter of Discontinuance for different endorsement wording
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Why do you believe that? I bet he changes his mind, if'n that is he's not an Internet troll.
Bad DPEs and bad pilots, same same. The checkride is to assess safety. If you don't qualify due to lack of hours etc. that is one thing. If you have typos or missing info, then its a discontinuance to get it fixed.
This also applies to the flying. if you come up consistently short in regard to PTS standards on a few things, a discontinuance is called for till you correct them. If you are a total mess on most of it, then a fail.
Sadly, the entire thing is subjective. So picking a fair DPE is the key. If this guy took your cash and you only did part of the checkride, then you should get your money back and use someone else, if he won't give it back, then pursue it by all means at your disposal. Don't let him steal it.
This also applies to the flying. if you come up consistently short in regard to PTS standards on a few things, a discontinuance is called for till you correct them. If you are a total mess on most of it, then a fail.
Sadly, the entire thing is subjective. So picking a fair DPE is the key. If this guy took your cash and you only did part of the checkride, then you should get your money back and use someone else, if he won't give it back, then pursue it by all means at your disposal. Don't let him steal it.
AggieMike88
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The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
Henning... I got five words for ya...
Papyrus
Zippers
Recording the exam
Bring back memories?
Papyrus
Zippers
Recording the exam
Bring back memories?
Everskyward
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I'm not succeeding at changing your mind about him changing his mind, am I? I would be even less likely to succeed if I started throwing insults around or trying the shaming tactic like others here have done (not pointing the finger at you).
Nothing wrong with people stating their opinion in a rational way which sometimes sways people, but these threads always seem to turn into ****ing matches in the end with both sides are equally guilty and no one changing their mind.
I have no mind set to change, I am not convinced of anything.There is nothing wrong with using shame to convince people, it has been the stock in trade of every mother. That is one thing our society is seriously lacking in fact, some bloody shame. Sometimes people need reminding there are things to be ashamed of, not doing the right thing is the primary one.
No part of the checkride was completed, the checkride was not even started because -- after 3+ hours -- according to him I was not eligible. Why that took him 3 hours to determine, I have no idea. I had plenty of hours, the only reason was the alleged improper endorsement.
In any event, the guy has not returned my calls or e-mails, and my bank did end up reversing the check after I called (doing something called a "timely return" of the funds from the receiving bank, something I've never even heard of or knew was a possibility). So I will follow the near-unanimous advice and let the FSDO know, especially since I've tried speaking to the guy already and he's obviously not interested -- although I think insults were not necessary.
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Dave Theisen
En-Route
I'm not really sure why you posted about this in the first place if you already had your mind made up and really didn't want to take anyone's advice.
I agree that this is a FSDO matter and not the chief counsel's. If you and your wife were having marital problems, would you talk to your local priest, or write a letter to the Pope?
Our posts crossed paths. See above.
I think an opinion from the CC is useful though. Before the Herman letter there were still plenty of debates about whether some time could be logged or not, etc. An opinion from the Chief Counsel pretty much puts all the arguments and regional differences in interpretation to rest.
Lol, remarkable similarities between the two, particularly when it comes to the infallibility doctrine.
Dave Theisen
En-Route
Oops. You just posted while I while I was typing. Glad to see you are talking to the FSDO.
Good luck.
Good luck.
A better comparison is: there's an obscure matter of Catholic doctrinal interpretation. Different priests give different answers. So do you just ask your priest for his opinion or ask the appropriate Vatican designee to give a definitive, final, and binding interpretation on the obscure doctrinal matter.
MAKG1
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Go home, Pete.
There is clearly some rather important detail being left out, assuming any part of this is true.
What did he DO for that 3 hours? Even if he went over 300+ hours line by line, that wouldn't take three hours.
Don't tell me you don't know. You claim to have been there.
45 minutes or so on the phone with IACRA technical support because he didn't know what the item "letter of lessee not required" meant. 30 minutes arguing with me and telling me a safety pilot signature was required and having to look up the applicable regs. A couple hours spent going line by line in my logbook, making me change a PIC flight properly characterized as a PIC flight to a non-PIC flight, redoing all totals on the 8710 as a result including the PIC totals, the cross-country PIC totals, the dual totals, the night PIC totals, etc. Redoing it again because he still wasn't satisfied. Him manually adding up every single line item in my logbook, etc. I think I've detailed all of this already.
Total waste of time.
But again, really could care less whether you think it is true or not.
AggieMike88
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The original "I don't know it all" of aviation.
It didn't start with insults, it took a couple pages to get there.
rbridges
En-Route
well, my advice is find another DPE. I don't think your next checkride will go well if you use the same guy.
Matthew
Touchdown! Greaser!
Let us know what FSDO says.
Didn't we have another elaborate checkride story a couple of months ago. Iirc the poster was peeved that his foreflight briefing was not accepted as pre-flight planning for the checkride cross-country.
jpflys
Pre-takeoff checklist
Where is your Instructor during all this ?
Any instructor I've ever had would be assisting me with BS like this.
Any instructor I've ever had would be assisting me with BS like this.
warthog1984
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LanCA'r
Sadly, some instructors go AWOL or work against the student when the rubber hits the road.
***Don't use schools more concerned about billing than flying***
This has been a Public Service Announcement.
Didn't use a school and my instructor thought it was equally ridiculous.
eetrojan
Pattern Altitude
I hate to say it, but it's stuff like this that makes the "flight schools" that have a DE running them the place to be. Your checkride is scheduled when you arrive, you fly every day until you pass and you pass. The DE is usually the owner of the school. He has all his instructors trained to do things his way.
My certificates and ratings were licenses to learn. Except for my private where I learned the basics, I've pretty much taught myself everything I know. That and just learning from hangar talk with fellow pilots. This board is really pretty good.
DE's make quite a bit of money, don't they?
My certificates and ratings were licenses to learn. Except for my private where I learned the basics, I've pretty much taught myself everything I know. That and just learning from hangar talk with fellow pilots. This board is really pretty good.
DE's make quite a bit of money, don't they?
No need to go to a puppy-mill. Just a CFI who has been arond for a while and has a relationship with some of the local DPEs.
Dunno, both of mine were experienced pilots an probably could have more that day with a contract flying gig (one of my checkrides got rescheduled because the DPE got a charter).
With two checkrides in a day it would be good money.
warthog1984
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Depends on the DPE. There are junky ones (like the one in this thread) that are basically mills and find ways to tack-on charges- they make bank.
OTOH, the DPE for my second PP ride charged the equivalent of $75/hr for the test itself- and that didn't include her prep time, pre/post-test Q&A, or any "paperwork" fees.
But how do you know if an instructor has "been around a while" and "has a relationship with a DE". Of course he will tell you he has.
Basically you do a part 141 school, which is what I'd do if I had to do it again. I learned my lesson.
My first DPE was very honest -- but he was in a different part of the country. This is almost enough to make me want to fly out there and just do it with him. Ugh.
If Betty Faux was still alive I'd send you down to SoCal to ride with her, she was a heck of a gal, a WASP during WWII she had hundreds of hours of ferry time in planes that make most of us drool, and when she went into teaching mode on a ride you learned a lot of nifty things.
marcoseddi
Cleared for Takeoff
That insane if he accepted a check, cancel it. Over here they only accept cash..
If you have a FSDO that's willing to do them, I think they are a great option. Most plane owners don't like it because they go over the plane and paperwork with a fine tooth comb.
I am glad that I have not experienced anything to the contrary. As far as the plane exam, the inspector had formerly been an instructor with the flight school where I was taught, and knew of the good reputation of the FBO for properly maintaining their aircraft. Of course, when I do my instrument in my own plane, that is a consideration. Part of me wants to be told if there is a maintenance issue so I can fix it. But part of me worries about some inane issue that makes no difference grounding the plane until several AMUs have been spent.
wsuffa
Touchdown! Greaser!
Look for grey hair.
Ask around. Talk to former students.
Anyone who teaches on a regular basis has 2-3 DPEs that he sends his students to and will be able to tell you their respective quirks. A student on his own has no way of knowing whether the DPE he picked from a list on the FAA website is going to get hung up about the position of a comma or whether he cares about the skills of the candidate.
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