Lax jet dumps fuel on school.

Discussion in 'Flight Following' started by PaulS, Jan 14, 2020.

  1. Heftiger

    Heftiger Pre-takeoff checklist

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  2. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    Wow okay, I actually didn't mean to strike a nerve.. I did about 6 seconds of Googling and meant to include this: https://www.businessinsider.com/federal-taxes-federal-services-difference-by-state-2019-1 in the first post, as I was curious about N1120A's post about getting the monies back.. but posting on here via phone app is a pain

    I digress. I don't *actually* care that much. Someday I'll retire in Montana on a lake
     
  3. Velocity173

    Velocity173 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    The only requirement on the ATC end for fuel dumping is to assign an altitude of at least 2,000 ft AHO and then keep aircraft 5 miles away. Obviously if in an emergency they could be well below that. Saw a MD-80 depart SAN once with an engine failure that immediately landed at Miramar. They were dumping fuel at 700 ft.
     
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  4. wayneda40

    wayneda40 Pre-Flight

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  5. Peter Anderson

    Peter Anderson Pre-takeoff checklist

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    No one has found the live atc for it yet? It’s gotta be out there.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
     
  6. Ravioli

    Ravioli Final Approach

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    Pick an answer. Or better yet...
     
  7. CRQFlier

    CRQFlier Pre-Flight

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    Congratulations to the Delta pilots for returning safely - said no MSM anywhere.

    Sent from my SM-G960U1 using Tapatalk
     
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  8. benyflyguy

    benyflyguy Pattern Altitude

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    Would get pretty weirded out watching that pass overhead at low altitude. Will be curious made emergency dump over land required
     
  9. PaulS

    PaulS Final Approach

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    It's up to 50 injured now. No experience with jet fuel, but used to use kerosene to clean up after working on sludge covered engines, gasoline too. Never irritated my skin.
     
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  10. Grum.Man

    Grum.Man En-Route

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    Here come the law suits! I could see the hysteria in the moment not knowing what was coming out of an airplane that just coated your kid especially if they were looking up and got it in their eyes.
     
  11. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    Do you realize what incredible improvements in air quality have been made in Los Angeles? Probably not, since you aren't from Los Angeles.

    Since when did the MD80, or any narrowbody, have a fuel dump system?

    Also, there was no way the aircraft was that high when they did this. They also had no need to dump, just do the over weight landing. They had 13000 feet and a headwind.

    VASAviation already did a video
     
  12. Ryanb

    Ryanb Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Of all the times I’ve been there, I haven’t noticed any difference, just something I dealt with.
     
  13. smv

    smv Pre-takeoff checklist

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    In the early 90s the air was orange and smelled of bleach. Vast improvments have been made.
     
  14. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    I guess you can't tell the difference between pollution and an inversion layer.

    All those scary regulations that a certain set whine about have made a massive difference in Southern California's air quality in my lifetime.
     
  15. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    60 injuries now: https://abc7.com/5849623/ .. and 70 firefighters and paramedics needed to do so

    I can understand the concern from people seeing a plane overhead dumping stuff on them

    But I mean.. it's basically "gas" (fine, closer to diesel). Have these people honestly never spilled gas filling the mower, or gotten their hands dirty working on cars or anything? Seems highly sensationalized. Main stream media has moved from "walk, don't run, don't panic" to "FREAK OUT, PANIC!" mode
     
  16. Ryanb

    Ryanb Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Be nice now... we don’t need to start a whizzing match sir.
     
  17. smv

    smv Pre-takeoff checklist

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    I am certain some of it got on me here in the Upper Mid-West... Who do i sue?

    :eek:
     
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  18. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    There is a big difference between getting an ounce of gas on you and hundreds, if not thousands, of pounds of fuel dumped on you.

    It's offensive. The people of my state have done incredible work in cleaning the air and making this the best place on earth to live.
     
  19. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    Hey @Ravioli - Tantalum does lease his friend's Cirrus. Know how I know? I've flown with him. I even have my own oxygen cannula.
     
  20. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    So, you ready to head down to the airport and have someone grab the fuel hose and spray fuel all over you?
     
  21. Ryanb

    Ryanb Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

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    Good for them, I’m sure it’s better than it used to be. I apologize that my single comment was offensive to you. Might I suggest wearing a hard hat? Life can be tough at times when associating with others who share differing opinions.
     
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  22. smv

    smv Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Yah... Because atomized fuel falling from the sky is exactly like getting sprayed by a fuel hose...

    :rolleyes:
     
  23. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    Thousands of pounds does, and it hasn't atomized at that point.
     
  24. smv

    smv Pre-takeoff checklist

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    ...and everyone screaming "VICTIM" was doused with "thousands of pounds of fuel"...

    Again... :rolleyes:
     
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  25. N1120A

    N1120A Cleared for Takeoff

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    You think they would have even noticed if they hadn't actually felt an injury? Planes fly over there all the time.
     
  26. Everskyward

    Everskyward Administrator Management Council Member

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    I think it's atomized as it comes out of the airplane. That's why it's a white vapor. Looks pretty cool in live; I've done it (dumped fuel). Pretty sure they would be able to smell it or sense it, but it's not like someone dropped a bucket of liquid fuel on them.
     
  27. Velocity173

    Velocity173 Touchdown! Greaser!

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    Yeah I guess it wasn’t a fuel dump after all. I just remember in the radar room tower saying they were going off shore to dump fuel. DC-9 also.
    http://www.fss.aero/accident-reports/look.php?report_key=1148
     
  28. wilkersk

    wilkersk Pattern Altitude

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    You've never had a JP-5 bath (Navy jet fuel). I have (Shut off valve failure or someone else's f-up) and it was sometimes in a location and at a time where it was difficult to remediate.

    Jet 1A, JP-4/5 etc... is a big skin irritant. But, it takes having it soak through your clothing and then not immediately treated by removing clothing and washing affected area with soap and water. I suspect the kids were treated pretty quickly. And, I doubt any got soaked.
     
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  29. smv

    smv Pre-takeoff checklist

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    It appears that you think a fuel dump valve releases fuel in the same way that an aerial water bomber dumps water...

    ;)
     
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  30. denverpilot

    denverpilot Tied Down

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    Rumors from other sources say a compressor stall and loss of an engine. Other rumors say the Captain wanted to land overweight and simply have the inspection done but the company disagreed.

    Take with however many pounds of salt as you see appropriate...

    Different carriers have different procedures or push it hard to Captain’s discretion per folks familiar with their own procedures. Bunch of folks said their airline would back them up on an overweight landing if the crew wanted the aircraft on the ground immediately and would just ground the airplane and do the inspection.

    Anyway there’s the rumor mill.
     
  31. Ravioli

    Ravioli Final Approach

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    No **** Sherlock. Who didn't know that? [Well, maybe everyone didn't, but I clearly did if you read my post]
     
  32. Ravioli

    Ravioli Final Approach

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    Let's assume a 737 traveling at 200mph dropped ALL of it's fuel while inbound to an airport where it landed without further incident.

    How many pounds of fuel would any single person get dumped on them? What would the drop area be?

    Unless you're a moron, you could look at the drop area of a fire fighter plane DESIGNED to target a drop zone as reference. Passenger jets are not designed to target, and the drop would therefore take a lot of ground.
     
  33. Huckster79

    Huckster79 Cleared for Takeoff

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    Im not sure anyone was seriously harmed but if out kids were sprayed with a chemical that rained down on them Im pretty sure I would take it rather seriously...
     
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  34. schmookeeg

    schmookeeg Cleared for Takeoff

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    True. I've never bathed in Jet-A to that extreme. :D

    LA has waaaaay more lawyers than work. 3 series was being generous. I think a majority likely appeared (especially with the school being just north of Watts) in Chrysler Sebrings or Geo Metros :D
     
  35. Pilawt

    Pilawt Final Approach PoA Supporter

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    And it was much worse yet in the 1950s and 1960s, when I grew up in eastern Los Angeles County, almost on the border of Orange County.

    It was a one-mile walk home from my elementary school (yes, kids could do that in those days). I remember wondering, while walking home, why my chest hurt every time I took a deep breath. After I learned to drive I had to pull off to the side of the road more than once because my eyes were stinging so badly in the smog.

    In the mid 1960s I learned to fly at the Fullerton Airport. I learned early on what -X2HK meant, and special VFR clearances were common. Often the controllers would call 3-mile visibility, when it seemed more wishful thinking than anything else. I remember being in the busy pattern as a solo student, and being told to extend downwind to St. Jude's Hospital, which is three miles east of the airport. Turning final into that hazy afternoon sun was an exercise in faith and local knowledge. No localizer back then.

    Yeah, the SoCal smog is much improved now.
     
  36. smv

    smv Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Having done most of my early aging in the mountains of Montana, riding through the LA area on my motorcycle in the early 90s was always an unpleasant experience. Like you said. Painful in the lungs and eyes. When I returned 20some years later I was very surprised to see it had changed quite a lot. Still didn;'t much care for riding through there, but more for traffic reasons and not painful lungs and eyes reason. :p (As much as I enjoyed the thrill and adrenaline of lane "sharing", I much prefer living somewhere the traffic makes it unnecessay).
     
  37. Shoomp

    Shoomp Filing Flight Plan

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    Good thing Gweneth Paltrow wasn’t walking around with her new line of candles. That would have been quite the scent.
     
  38. Tantalum

    Tantalum Final Approach

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    ^this smells like my jet A
     
  39. luvflyin

    luvflyin Final Approach

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  40. Pugs

    Pugs Pre-takeoff checklist

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    Dropping a little fuel is better than dropping a 777 on them.:D