Landing at Closed Aiport

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During a recent cross country, I flew into some rain/drizzle which was a bit too much for my comfort level. I decided I needed to land and wait for things to lighten up. I spotted an uncontrolled airport out my window, looked up the CTAF on the sectional via my iPad, and landed. Hung out for an out until the weather lifted and took off.

After landing at my destination, I looked up the airport I had landed at in the A/FD. The airport is listed as closed indefinitely. Now, the sectional didn't reveal this closed status, and I was not in a position to refer to the A/FD when I needed to get on the ground.

How big a mistake/violation was this? Nobody was at the airport, and I have no reason to believe I was seen, although I did call out my tail number over the CTAF. Should I file one of the NASA reporting forms, or just let it go?

And, by the way, I learned a very valuable lesson about not flying into bad weather.
 
Unregistered said:
During a recent cross country, I flew into some rain/drizzle which was a bit too much for my comfort level. I decided I needed to land and wait for things to lighten up. I spotted an uncontrolled airport out my window, looked up the CTAF on the sectional via my iPad, and landed. Hung out for an out until the weather lifted and took off.

After landing at my destination, I looked up the airport I had landed at in the A/FD. The airport is listed as closed indefinitely. Now, the sectional didn't reveal this closed status, and I was not in a position to refer to the A/FD when I needed to get on the ground.

How big a mistake/violation was this? Nobody was at the airport, and I have no reason to believe I was seen, although I did call out my tail number over the CTAF. Should I file one of the NASA reporting forms, or just let it go?

And, by the way, I learned a very valuable lesson about not flying into bad weather.
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In my opinion, you did what you had to do. Personally, I wouldn't worry about it, but if you want to file a NASA report detailing the events leading up to the landing, feel free to do so.
 
Listen to me.

You did not look up the airport in the A/FD. You were in a situation which required a precautionary landing, you checked your CURRENT navigational chart, chose the field, complied with the standard rules on communication, and safe operation. You landed, waited for the storm to pass, and took off from the airport and went on your way. Before your flight you performed actions consistent with making yourself aware of all RELEVANT information for your flight, but the situation changed enroute.

That is all.
 
While your planning was lacking, it seems to me like you exercised your emergency option. I'd still fill out a ASRS just to be safe.
 
Precautionary landing, end of story. You showed excellent judgement IMHO. Don't like the weather? Get on the ground and wait it out. Good call.

I landed on the closed portion of I29 during the flooding last year and took a picture of my plane on the exit ramp. It was closed for 30 miles. That is one heck of a runway. ;)

I had to go! :lol:
 
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Unregistered said:
During a recent cross country, I flew into some rain/drizzle which was a bit too much for my comfort level. I decided I needed to land and wait for things to lighten up. I spotted an uncontrolled airport out my window, looked up the CTAF on the sectional via my iPad, and landed. Hung out for an out until the weather lifted and took off.

After landing at my destination, I looked up the airport I had landed at in the A/FD. The airport is listed as closed indefinitely. Now, the sectional didn't reveal this closed status, and I was not in a position to refer to the A/FD when I needed to get on the ground.

How big a mistake/violation was this? Nobody was at the airport, and I have no reason to believe I was seen, although I did call out my tail number over the CTAF. Should I file one of the NASA reporting forms, or just let it go?

And, by the way, I learned a very valuable lesson about not flying into bad weather.
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It's HIGHLY unlikely that anything will happen. As a matter of fact, I don't think that there is even an FAR that says that you can't land at a closed airport (91.13 aside)...but I'd file a report.

I'm with others that say you did right what you needed to do for the safety of the flight...right up until you fired up and took off again. There was nothing stopping you from looking at the A/FD while you were waiting out the rain. IMO, it was the second flight where you failed to gather all necessary information on the flight that you were about to take.

Just my $.02.
 
jason said:
It's HIGHLY unlikely that anything will happen. As a matter of fact, I don't think that there is even an FAR that says that you can't land at a closed airport (91.13 aside)...but I'd file a report.

I'm with others that say you did right what you needed to do for the safety of the flight...right up until you fired up and took off again. There was nothing stopping you from looking at the A/FD while you were waiting out the rain. IMO, it was the second flight where you failed to gather all necessary information on the flight that you were about to take.

Just my $.02.
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What would he, or you, have done if he did find out it was closed while he was waiting?

Call the local FSDO? :dunno:
 
ForeFlight would have the A/FD information for you inflight.

But a precautionary landing would be any port in a storm. Risk would be debris or damage to a runway that was not visible from the air. Time to walk the runway before takeoff to assure a normal departure would be safe.

File the ASRS.

And for those that say they do get all data before a flight. Do you check every airport NOTAM 50nm either side of course? 100nm either side.
No you check for chart updates between publication cycles and mark your chart for every new tower or other information?
 
Geico266 said:
What would he, or you, have done if he did find out it was closed while he was waiting?

Call the local FSDO? :dunno:
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I choose not to answer that question on the advice of my counsel. I will simply say that it's also not against the regs to take off from a closed airport. :D:D

That said, the act of knowing and the act of doing are two different things. I'm simply pointing out the reg that he actually did violate during all of this (91.103). If somebody were really trying to stick him for something...that's what it would be. That said, I still believe it highly unlikely that anything will ever come of it. But there is absolutely no reason not to file an ASRS report.
 
jason said:
It's HIGHLY unlikely that anything will happen. As a matter of fact, I don't think that there is even an FAR that says that you can't land at a closed airport (91.13 aside)...but I'd file a report.

I'm with others that say you did right what you needed to do for the safety of the flight...right up until you fired up and took off again. There was nothing stopping you from looking at the A/FD while you were waiting out the rain. IMO, it was the second flight where you failed to gather all necessary information on the flight that you were about to take.

Just my $.02.
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My research shows that there is no law against landing at a closed airport. I'm not the type to deny the existence of anything, but I can't find it, I've looked.. thoroughly. I see no reg broken.
 
Was there a big X mark on the runway ? closed runways are supposed to have proper markings, it's clear and mentioned in FAR too. if there was no X, I would land there not only in emergency situations but anytime else.
 
Greg Bockelman said:
I think that assumes testimony not in evidence.
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"alternatives available if the planned flight cannot be completed,"

I think using a closed airfield wouldn't fall under alternatives available. Like I said, if the flight cannot be completed due to an emergency situation then it becomes available.
 
Velocity173 said:
"alternatives available if the planned flight cannot be completed,"

I think using a closed airfield wouldn't fall under alternatives available. Like I said, if the flight cannot be completed due to an emergency situation then it becomes available.
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You have a lot more experience that me, but I didn't see an emergency, nor was one declared. I used 'precautionary' to avoid the dreaded emergency moniker with can have other legal and operational ramifications. I guess it could have been an emergency, none of us were there but it sounds like a pre-emergency, or avoided to me. ;)
 
The runways were not marked with X's. I actually looked it up in the A/FD while waiting on the rain at the airport, and that is when I saw that it was closed. But, what the hell was I supposed to do at that point. Trailer it up and drive it out?

The fact of the matter is that I flew into weather which made me feel very uncomfortable, and that was a mistake. I'm not happy I did that, but am sort of happy this happened, because next time this situation comes up, I'm putting the bird down earlier. I can definitely see how bad things happen when nervous, so I'm not letting it get to that point again.

Thanks for the replies.
 
No problems. Nice job pilot, you used your PIC authority to deal with a current situation.

File an ARSA or don't. You made an on the spot decision based on available information to prevent a more serious situation. You did it in a manner that you believe to be safe and from all evidence was safe.

A question - what's the difference between a closed runway and a cow pasture? The closed runway is easier to land on.
 
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Go here. You did well and did not get distracted. http://asrs.arc.nasa.gov/

Just don't make the "title" self incriminating (the title is public), use something like "Poor planning" for the title. Describe the circumstances that the runway is not visibly marked with the AIM-required X's.

I get the sense you don't see this is an OPPORTUNITY as well a a cover. That runway needs marked.

Had it been marked, I would have landed there anyway, provided there were no obstructions.
 
I'm just a lowly low time pilot... but I don't see a problem with your landing or takeoff either. IF you'd known ahead of time that airport was closed, a low pass before landing would have been nice... but you didn't know. You saw an airport, you landed. You took off. And you learned a lesson about weather so you don't repeat the particular mistake that led to having to deviate from your plan.

Better to have this discussion instead of speculating why another plane went down.
 
docmirror said:
You have a lot more experience that me, but I didn't see an emergency, nor was one declared. I used 'precautionary' to avoid the dreaded emergency moniker with can have other legal and operational ramifications. I guess it could have been an emergency, none of us were there but it sounds like a pre-emergency, or avoided to me. ;)
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Is a precautionary landing considered an emergency? It falls under the FAAs definition of emergency landings. I suppose it depends on how dire the situation is. If I'm diverting because of weather and I don't have fuel to get to a suitable landing area then I think landing at a closed airport would be an emergency situation. I don't know of any "dreaded emergency moniker." We've talked about declaring an emergency before on this forum. It's a no brainer. No paperwork or adverse ramifications on my side of it.

Of course declaring an emergency isn't a get out of FAA violation free card. If the emergency is attributed to pilot error (wx planning) they could still be found in violation. It seems right now we can't determine if landing at a closed airport is even a violation of the FARs. Would landing on a road be a violation of the FARs if you can't make an airport? Kinda gray. :)
 
Old Geek,

That was funny! I'd say we will get another 50 or so to join in.
 
One more vote that says you were not wrong to land there once it got to that point. File the ASRS report to share this event more widely with those who might find themselves in the same situation.

And see if you can improve your weather knowledge so you're less likely to have this happen again. Going for your instrument rating is another project you might consider.
 
Velocity173 said:
Is a precautionary landing considered an emergency? It falls under the FAAs definition of emergency landings.

Would landing on a road be a violation of the FARs if you can't make an airport? Kinda gray. :)
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Well, when it happened to me it was about 20 years ago. I made a precautionary landing at a small ranch out west. Took off, and a neighbor made that call to the FAA. They and I had a little discussion, and I was advised at the time not to call it an emergency, and to use the word 'precautionary'. It was a short informal talk, and they didn't want to pursue anything but told me that if I declare an emergency, they want to know about it, and the circumstances surrounding it. Even if there was no property damage or injury.

Gray it is. I still wouldn't tell anyone anything unless or until they ask. As you said, it's not a get out of jail free card.
 
Add me to the list. You utilized the judgement your examiners and instructors instilled into you to keep yourself alive with the best available information you had at the time.

File an ASRS in case someone who doesn't get it, and hasn't flown anything more powerful than a clipboard thinks otherwise, and move on.
 
bbchien said:
Just don't make the "title" self incriminating (the title is public), use something like "Poor planning" for the title.
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I would make the title something along the lines of "No X on closed runway", or "Possible incorrect information in A/FD".

2 of three sourced (chart & runway markings) indicated the runway was opened. One source indicates it's closed.

Can you find an old A/FD to see if it was listed as closed before the chart was published?
 
bbchien said:
Just don't make the "title" self incriminating (the title is public), use something like "Poor planning" for the title. Describe the circumstances that the runway is not visibly marked with the AIM-required X's.
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You're suggesting that not looking up every airport that you're going to fly over is poor planning?

I have alternates along the route...but every airport is not an alternate. If I discovered weather in my way and did not feel that I could safely make it to one of my alternates, I would have done exactly the same thing for the same reason.

The only reason to file an ARSA report is to note that the runway isn't marked as closed so that can be corrected.
 
odachoo said:
Was there a big X mark on the runway ? closed runways are supposed to have proper markings, it's clear and mentioned in FAR too. if there was no X, I would land there not only in emergency situations but anytime else.
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Bingo. If it's not marked with an X, it's not closed.
 
docmirror said:
Listen to me.

You did not look up the airport in the A/FD. You were in a situation which required a precautionary landing, you checked your CURRENT navigational chart, chose the field, complied with the standard rules on communication, and safe operation. You landed, waited for the storm to pass, and took off from the airport and went on your way. Before your flight you performed actions consistent with making yourself aware of all RELEVANT information for your flight, but the situation changed enroute.

That is all.
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Ding ding ding

I'd file the asrs, this type of thing is what it's for
 
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airguy said:
Bingo. If it's not marked with an X, it's not closed.
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That's not necessarily true. The owner/manager/airport authority can close an airport (or a runway) for any number of reasons ranging from construction to weather (snow) to a disabled aircraft on the runway. If they issue the NOTAM, it's closed.

(It doesn't mean you can't land there...but it does mean that it's closed.)
 
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"After landing at my destination, I looked up the airport I had landed at in the A/FD. The airport is listed as closed indefinitely."

If the A/FD says it's closed indefinitely, I'd expect the rwys to be marked. Are there any NOTAMS that mention the airport has re-opened since the publication date of the A/FD? Were there any other airplanes visible anywhere?
 
No X on the runway, no people/property on runway, I dont think you did anything wrong.

I've seen a few airports that are closed for some reason and never re-opened because the local person who owns the place (maybe just inherited it) never notified anyone that they moved their circus, or heavy equipment, or whatever off airport

We used to land on farmers roads all the time for work, never filed a report, never had a issue.

You will notice this is a gray area in the FARs (and for good reason), no Xs = land.

If you were one of my students I would rather you just land, then try to look up all the info in your afd, ipad, whatever and end up in IMC/dead. You glanced at your sectional, made the call and had a uneventful landing.... GOOD JOB
 
OP here. There is a NOTAM which states the following: "AD closed. Effective Immediately Until Further Notice. Created:12 Aug 14:09 2011"

Since this was apparently closed over a year ago, I would expect this to be reflected on the sectional, but it's not.
 
Makes me wonder if the owner of the airport wanted to effectively turn it into a private strip and not have John Q Public buzzing in and out? That would explain why it's still on the sectional and no X's on the runway.
 
Unregistered said:
If you were one of my students I would rather you just land, then try to look up all the info in your afd, ipad, whatever and end up in IMC/dead.
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How would looking up the airport info after landing cause him/her to end up in IMC? :confused:
 
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