KX-155A display is out

Discussion in 'Maintenance Bay' started by Bruce Collins, Apr 8, 2012.

  1. Bruce Collins

    Bruce Collins Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2012
    Messages:
    3

    Display name:
    Bruce
    1999 Cessna 172S
    Came out to find the display partially out then suddenly in-op but the radio seemed to worked for a bit... then nothing.
    Local shop says it is a common failure on these radios.
    The FBO had says their 172R did the same and they had to replace the radio.
    I am an old school electronics bench tech and find that hard to believe.
    I'm thinking maybe a display replacement is more like it.
    Anyone have any help in this regard?
     
  2. bbchien

    bbchien Final Approach

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2005
    Messages:
    9,669
    Location:
    Central Illinois

    Display name:
    Bruce C
    If you can get the part, good luck. Of course if it goes to the shop they will not let it out until it completly complies with the TSO under which it was sold.

    Whenever I have this happen it's $400. sigh.
     
  3. dmac5356

    dmac5356 Pre-Flight

    Joined:
    Jun 23, 2011
    Messages:
    45
    Location:
    MN

    Display name:
    Dan
    I have replaced a couple KX-155 displays, which were a very simple part swap. The part is about $200. But only the display had failed and the radio still worked. Also, mine were not 155A's. It sounds like there is more problems with your radio. You will have to find a radio shop.
     
  4. Skylane81E

    Skylane81E Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    8,059
    Location:
    Cincinnati

    Display name:
    Duncan
    Just for giggles shine a flash light on it and see if the screen comes back, it's often the light sensor on our king radios that causes that issue.
     
  5. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2009
    Messages:
    32,467
    Location:
    Denver, CO

    Display name:
    DenverPilot
    I've done that one to myself. Rest fingers on bezel, wonder why the display "disappeared". Haha.
     
  6. Skylane81E

    Skylane81E Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    8,059
    Location:
    Cincinnati

    Display name:
    Duncan
    What I've found is that the sensor fails and anything short of BRIGHT light it will be invisible.
     
  7. Bruce Collins

    Bruce Collins Filing Flight Plan

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2012
    Messages:
    3

    Display name:
    Bruce
    Thanks for the replies....
    The KX155A/165A display is now over $715.00. YIKES.
    Labor isn't too bad at around $120.00
    Not sure where to go with this but to the bank with a big sack...:(
     
  8. Walt

    Walt Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Apr 8, 2005
    Messages:
    122

    Display name:
    FOXMIKE
    Bruce,
    I have a KX 155A that I used for less than 500Hrs. If you want a virtually new radio let me know.
    Walt
     
  9. poadeleted21

    poadeleted21 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Messages:
    12,332
    eBay.

    I have no idea why B/K is pricing themselves into bankruptcy. They're practically begging you to go buy something else.
     
  10. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2009
    Messages:
    32,467
    Location:
    Denver, CO

    Display name:
    DenverPilot
    Does the radio/display use components that never got RoHS compliant replacements? It's a fairly old design.

    That'd explain the pricing.

    If Yes, they're just passing along the true cost of Europe's desire to make electronics more "green". ;)
     
  11. poadeleted21

    poadeleted21 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Messages:
    12,332
    Don't think so or every part they sell has the potential to cause the next Chernobyl disaster.
     
  12. Skylane81E

    Skylane81E Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    8,059
    Location:
    Cincinnati

    Display name:
    Duncan
    Replace radio before it happens again, because it will.
     
  13. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2009
    Messages:
    32,467
    Location:
    Denver, CO

    Display name:
    DenverPilot
    Ha. Pricing on non-RoHS components isn't related to their "danger" to the environment. It's because all the major fabrication houses converted to the "greener" standards and they no longer produce the older parts.

    There's a robust "no longer manufactured" electronic parts business with terms last "last run, last time purchase" where warehouses stock up on popular parts whenever technology changes and chip and component manufacturers end-of-life a chip or series of them.

    If Honeywell / BK is having to order parts from an ever dwindling supply in a warehouse somewhere to fulfill repair orders, they'll raise the price of repair parts higher and higher to cover costs.

    Garmin is no different. Their early GPS devices are still just fine, design-wise... other than mis-judging how much memory would be required to hold all the waypoints being created out of thin air. You'll just find that components to repair them slowly dry up.

    Having seen a number of otherwise perfectly viable and very expensive telecom systems EOLed instead of paying hardware engineers to re-design them with RoHS components and manufacturing techniques, I suspect Avionics manufacturers are now feeling the end of that long-tail of increasing prices on repair parts on any design created prior to RoHS.

    There was much weeping and gnashing of teeth in telecom when manufacturers started saying, "We no longer make that replacement card for that unit, and we warned your service contract and purchasing people, as well as your Operations people, of the upcoming EOL and End-of-Service dates seven years ago." Service providers assumed that huge deployed bases of units would trump that warning. "We spend $4 million a year on our service contract! Fix it. Now!"

    They were surprised to hear, "We would spend twice as much money fixing it as we would make from all of our service contracts combined. It's dead. We warned you. Good luck finding parts on the used market. Service contracts no longer cover hardware."
     
  14. poadeleted21

    poadeleted21 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2011
    Messages:
    12,332
    I don't think that explains the $740 price tag for a KLN94 data card (Which I believe is just an antiquated SD card of some sort with proprietary formatting). Or why a refurbished CDI is $200 more than the meter movement in it, or why the KLN94 is more expensive than a new 430W.
     
  15. denverpilot

    denverpilot Taxi to Parking

    Joined:
    Nov 8, 2009
    Messages:
    32,467
    Location:
    Denver, CO

    Display name:
    DenverPilot
    Ahh yes. Hard to say. We were discussing the display. Those screens likely contain some unobtainable parts if one doesn't have a large stockpile of "last time buy" inventory.

    Actually the 430W is also discontinued or soon to be, isn't it? Garmin builds with similar parts; they're just further up the availability curve.

    The other items are probably priced high enough to pay for keeping a relatively small Division of Honeywell fully-funded while still turning a profit.
     
  16. alfadog

    alfadog En-Route

    Joined:
    May 3, 2010
    Messages:
    3,733
    Location:
    Miami

    Display name:
    alfadog
    Actually not a great option if you mean find a display (unlikely) or another KX-155A. You will pay the same price or more for another radio as to replace your display and now you have a radio with a display that could fail tomorrow. Unless this is a recurrent problem, your cheapest way out is to fix it.
     
  17. Skylane81E

    Skylane81E Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    8,059
    Location:
    Cincinnati

    Display name:
    Duncan
    It is a recurrent problem with the king displays.
     
  18. alfadog

    alfadog En-Route

    Joined:
    May 3, 2010
    Messages:
    3,733
    Location:
    Miami

    Display name:
    alfadog
    What would you recommend he go with? I have a Narco 12D as my primary nav/com.
     
  19. Skylane81E

    Skylane81E Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    8,059
    Location:
    Cincinnati

    Display name:
    Duncan
    Local folks have been going to the bottom end garmin unit and like it, I only have the OEM nav com in my plane outside of the GPS units so I'm not to up on what's out the nav/com wise, I just know that if the 89B screen isn't on the way out in our 98 172 one of the 155s or the ADF is. We swapped the transponder out for a garmin for the same reason. We've been eyeing the used 430 market for a replacement for the GPS because of the issue.
     
  20. patrick wentworth

    patrick wentworth Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    May 18, 2010
    Messages:
    188
    Location:
    Santa Rosa, Ca

    Display name:
    Patrick
    there have been some posts about polishing the contacts on the display with an eraser YMMV

    :yikes:
     
  21. DaleB

    DaleB Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Aug 24, 2011
    Messages:
    2,312

    Display name:
    DaleB
    It's a time honored and proven solution to some contact oxidization and crud problems. I spent a lot of years fixing mostly-IBM systems ranging from 1950s and 1960s vintage mainframes (S/360, S/3, etc) to PCs to newer mainframes (everything from the S/370 to the 3090). The Pink Pearl eraser was a required and often-used tool in the tool box. Just the right amount of abrasiveness to deoxidize and clean without damaging gold plating.

    I've also spent a lot of time fixing obsolete crap, a term which seems to nicely describe the vast majority of what I have seen of GA avionics. It's not unusual to find a crazy-expensive part, like a display board, loaded with parts that can still be sourced if the repair guy knows what he's doing. In other words -- the assembly is forged from unobtanium, but the individual parts may not be.

    I don't know what the rules are for repairing aircraft radios and I'm too lazy to look it up right now. I'm guessing it would require a stupid amount of FAA certification. Otherwise I'd offer to take a look.
     
  22. Skylane81E

    Skylane81E Final Approach

    Joined:
    May 3, 2011
    Messages:
    8,059
    Location:
    Cincinnati

    Display name:
    Duncan
    Youd be guessing right