KSMO IFR Departures South, What to Expect?

[Mark H Russell]

I am flying in/out of KSMO on Monday 29 June and I wanted to know if any local pilots know what kind of clearance I will typically receive? I will fly a TEC route to KSEE, so POPPR to SLI ...

Thanks,
Mark

 

[Mark H Russell]

Got a reply from a local SMO pilot:

You're cleared to (KMYF or KSEE) via
fly runway heading
at the LAX 315-R turn right heading 250
expect radar vectors SMO
then outbound SMO 125-R
to join SMOP22 TEC route
climb and maintain 3000, expect 5000 five minutes after

 

[Neil Rubin]

I am flying in/out of KSMO on Monday 29 June and I wanted to know if any local pilots know what kind of clearance I will typically receive? I will fly a TEC route to KSEE, so POPPR to SLI ...

Thanks,
Mark

In a piston, I’d expect: fly runway heading; upon reaching LAX 315 radial, turn right heading 250; vectors to SMO; SMO 125 radial; V64; SLI and then the rest of the TEC route. There is a good chance you get vectored again once you are south of LAX and won’t actually fly the 125 radial all the way to V64.

 

[Tantalum]

Got a reply from a local SMO pilot:

You're cleared to (KMYF or KSEE) via
fly runway heading
at the LAX 315-R turn right heading 250
expect radar vectors SMO
then outbound SMO 125-R
to join SMOP22 TEC route
climb and maintain 3000, expect 5000 five minutes after

Yep, done that many times. That's exactly what it is

 

[Tantalum]

But unless it is IMC, just go VFR. You'll have to wait forever on the ground for release

 

[Mark H Russell]

But unless it is IMC, just go VFR. You'll have to wait forever on the ground for release

Can you get flight following and a squawk from the SMO tower to go south?

 

[Rgbeard]

But unless it is IMC, just go VFR. You'll have to wait forever on the ground for release

my record wait is 45min. I wasn’t comfortable enough with the airspace to depart VFR.

 

[Tantalum]

my record wait is 45min. I wasn’t comfortable enough with the airspace to depart VFR.

Yeah, it can be an intimidating little spot.. my first two times going coming out of that vfr corridor from the south I was too high and went around..

Can you get flight following and a squawk from the SMO tower to go south?

In my experience, yes. You go just offshore and do a sweeping right turn to gain altitude.. they transfer you over to SOCAL and you pop south through the vfr coastal corridor.. or if you're brave the svfr

 

[Mark H Russell]

Yeah, it can be an intimidating little spot.. my first two times going coming out of that vfr corridor from the south I was too high and went around..


In my experience, yes. You go just offshore and do a sweeping right turn to gain altitude.. they transfer you over to SOCAL and you pop south through the vfr coastal corridor.. or if you're brave the svfr

I have never had a problem in the SVFR but there is always a first time. The COASTAL VFR sounds like a good option if available. Thanks!

 

[Mark H Russell]

Yeah, it can be an intimidating little spot.. my first two times going coming out of that vfr corridor from the south I was too high and went around..


In my experience, yes. You go just offshore and do a sweeping right turn to gain altitude.. they transfer you over to SOCAL and you pop south through the vfr coastal corridor.. or if you're brave the svfr

So I just tried to get the coastal route at 5500' on my sim but it takes awhile. Will ATC let you climb into the B from below or do you have to go north of the 100/50 segment?

 

[luvflyin]

Can you get flight following and a squawk from the SMO tower to go south?

“Can”? Yes. Will you? No. Well, maybe...https://www.standard.co.uk/news/wor...ter-it-is-hit-by-a-polar-vortex-a4054421.html

EDIT: don’t want this taken wrong. It’s about being able to depart SMO and turn Southbound. Not maneuver to the North a little, gain some altitude, and then get a Bravo clearance Southbound.

 

[Tantalum]

So I just tried to get the coastal route at 5500' on my sim but it takes awhile. Will ATC let you climb into the B from below or do you have to go north of the 100/50 segment?

It depends but you generally have to be able to get to that altitude.. if you are willing to wait departing IFR can be an interesting experience.. I don't have the fixes on hand but @N1120A has them I believe

 

[N1120A]

So I just tried to get the coastal route at 5500' on my sim but it takes awhile. Will ATC let you climb into the B from below or do you have to go north of the 100/50 segment?

ATC will give you climb vectors to the Coastal Route if you depart KSMO. Similarly, they will give you a descent out of it. Still, better off using the SFRA or Mini (if able) in and out of KSMO..

 

[N1120A]

Can you get flight following and a squawk from the SMO tower to go south?

1) If you can get the Mini Route (more common now than a year ago, less common than 2-3 years ago), absolutely.

2) If you go around the Bravo to the Northeast, and hook back down, you can.

3) If you take a vectored climb into the Coastal Route (basically, they'll have you do the same thing as the IFR departure, fly NW along the shore and then turn back), you can.

4) Depart into the SFRA and pick it up from 127.2/125.35 as soon as you are on the other side. You are literally not talking to a controller for ~5 minutes or less from your frequency change from KSMO (usually around the time you're back over the VOR) till you exit the other side and are ready to call. Remember, the SFRA is literally from Lincoln Boulevard to the 105 freeway - just the width of LAX. You are clear of the Class Bravo and Delta (yes, LAX has a small Class Delta overhang on each end) at 3500 then.

As someone who flies KMYF-KSMO a ton, I usually fly to KSMO IFR to avoid the drop from the SFRA (plus, I often need to be IFR on departure, arrival or both cause of the marine layer in the morning) and then VFR back if it is reasonable VMC to avoid the long waits.

That said, for obvious reasons, I've not waited more than about 3-4 minutes for a clearance out of KSMO in months. In fact, I think they've been more conscious of those IFR hassles and were working on decreasing them anyway. Just don't ever try and get one off 3.

 

[Mark H Russell]

1) If you can get the Mini Route (more common now than a year ago, less common than 2-3 years ago), absolutely.

2) If you go around the Bravo to the Northeast, and look back down, you can.

3) If you take a vectored climb into the Coastal Route (basically, they'll have you do the same thing as the IFR departure, fly NW along the shore and then turn back), you can.

4) Depart into the SFRA and pick it up from 127.2/125.35 as soon as you are on the other side. You are literally not talking to a controller for ~5 minutes or less from your frequency change from KSMO (usually around the time you're back over the VOR) till you exit the other side and are ready to call. Remember, the SFRA is literally from Lincoln Boulevard to the 105 freeway - just the width of LAX. You are class of the Class Bravo and Delta (yes, LAX has a small Class Delta overhang on each end) at 3500 then.

As someone who flies KMYF-KSMO a ton, I usually fly to KSMO IFR to avoid the drop from the SFRA (plus, I often need to be IFR on depatture, arrival or both cause of the marine layer in the morning) and then VFR back if it is reasonable VMC to avoid the long waits.

That said, for obvious reasons, I've not waited more than about 3-4 minutes for a clearance out of KSMO in months. In fact, I think they've been more conscious of those IFR hassles and were working on decreasing them anyway. Just don't ever try and get one off 3.

This is great information. I will not hesitate to do the IFR departure if needed. It is an Angel flight in a C172, so I did not want to a long time for clearance.

 

[N1120A]

This is great information. I will not hesitate to do the IFR departure if needed. It is an Angel flight in a C172, so I did not want to a long time for clearance.

I do quite a few Angel Flights out of KSMO. With the exception of one, they have been very good about getting me out with a decent priority. I ALWAYS fly IFR when operating NGF - extra safety.

When it comes to the SFRA to FF transition, I look at it like departing VFR and getting an IFR clearance in the air, from a non towered airport.

 

[N1120A]

Got a reply from a local SMO pilot:

You're cleared to (KMYF or KSEE) via
fly runway heading
at the LAX 315-R turn right heading 250
expect radar vectors SMO
then outbound SMO 125-R
to join SMOP22 TEC route
climb and maintain 3000, expect 5000 five minutes after

They usually read it "fly runway heading, upon reaching the LAX R315, turn right heading 250 (Sometimes 270), radar vectors SMO R125 and the remainder of the SMOP22 TEC Route, 3/5/10, 125.2 (or 124.3), etc." They will ask if you have the route on board first. If you don't, they give you a FRC. I have the route programmed into my GPS already, including the SMO125/V64 intersection then SLI. These /U radial clearances are annoying and they should have fixes for everything, for those of us who have something beyond 1940s technology in our planes, but the newer touchscreen GPS products make these easier.

Another tip - they can't turn you back toward SMO till you are passing 4000, so you may want to consider that in calculating your climb rate - especially if you don't have any cooling concerns. I usually set like a 700-800 FPM climb. I might even do 1000 on cooler days. They will climb you to 6000 between LGB and SNA for departures off SNA.