Key Lime in the news (again)

Metroliners seem to land on one engine quite regularly, so why is this a big deal, other than the fact it's Key Lime
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
Metroliners seem to land on one engine quite regularly, so why is this a big deal, other than the fact it's Key Lime
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Media is just making a big deal about it because the same operator lost a plane (and pilot) due to engine failure a week ago.
 
How many UPS cargos can you lose before you lose your contract?
 
[/KeyLime]

Too much bad PR and they probably weren't making much to begin with.
 
I would imagine that insurability has to start becoming an issue about now.
 
Henning said:
How many UPS cargos can you lose before you lose your contract?
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Fatal was a repo, no cargo on board. 2nd one had no operational effect on the cargo. So this would be the only one with live cargo. At the end of the day, as long as UPS is getting it as cheap as they can, they don't care.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
Fatal was a repo, no cargo on board. 2nd one had no operational effect on the cargo. So this would be the only one with live cargo. At the end of the day, as long as UPS is getting it as cheap as they can, they don't care.
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Yeah, I figure insurance will stop them if anyone. The Repo flight I still don't understand why he went down SE with a light plane.:dunno:
 
Henning said:
Yeah, I figure insurance will stop them if anyone. The Repo flight I still don't understand why he went down SE with a light plane.:dunno:
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Assuming they aren't self insured... Seeing as they haven't killed anyone but employee's, I don't see their liability flinching at all.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
Assuming they aren't self insured... Seeing as they haven't killed anyone but employee's, I don't see their liability flinching at all.
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What does it take to self insure a 135 operation?:dunno: Me thinks that would take a large proof of reserve capital. I don't think you get by step 1 of the 135 process until you show your insurance binder or financial ability to self insure. Maybe cargo only isn't so steep to do. Don't believe the actuaries aren't paying attention just because they lucked out on these losses, it makes them even more nervous.
 
Henning said:
What does it take to self insure a 135 operation?:dunno: Me thinks that would take a large proof of reserve capital. I don't think you get by step 1 of the 135 process until you show your insurance binder or financial ability to self insure. Maybe cargo only isn't so steep to do. Don't believe the actuaries aren't paying attention just because they lucked out on these losses, it makes them even more nervous.
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Key Lime isn't cargo only...
 
Henning said:
What does it take to self insure a 135 operation?:dunno: Me thinks that would take a large proof of reserve capital. I don't think you get by step 1 of the 135 process until you show your insurance binder or financial ability to self insure. Maybe cargo only isn't so steep to do. Don't believe the actuaries aren't paying attention just because they lucked out on these losses, it makes them even more nervous.
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I'm talking hull insurance, in regards to self insured. I'm sure they are insured liability wise, but is 2 accident and a routine event on a SA227 going to be enough to cause issues, considering the volume of operations they have? Probably not.
 
Maybe AMF can get the contract and start a Denver base. In that case I want to move to Colorado and fly cargo.
 
Left engine producing power, right one windmilling?

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NJP_MAN said:
Maybe AMF can get the contract and start a Denver base. In that case I want to move to Colorado and fly cargo.
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Fat chance, they were having a difficult time staffing what they had.
 
They're flying mostly claptraps. Not much for the insurance company to pay on unless they actually hit something of value.
 
denverpilot said:
They're flying mostly claptraps. Not much for the insurance company to pay on unless they actually hit something of value.
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Those "claptraps" are the type of airplanes that keep Avgas relevant in this country. What's wrong with a freighter PA31? They are fairly easy to fly.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
Those "claptraps" are the type of airplanes that keep Avgas relevant in this country. What's wrong with a freighter PA31? They are fairly easy to fly.
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Lots of assumptions in that reply. I didn't make any judgment calls on how they affect the supply of Avgas nor did I say they were difficult or easy to fly.

I said they're junk versions of once-nice aircraft. They maintain them a few hundred yards from my hangar and park the stripped ones that'll never fly again there, that they steal parts off of to keep the rest going. Airworthy, but generally junk.

That's all I said. Come on out to the hangar and we can gawk at some of the ones that finally got grounded. Both the PA31s and the Metroliners. They're scattered all over the East ramp at APA. Dead ones there, dying ones over getting worked on at the mx hangar.

Not like this is news. The whole fleet is slowly dying.
 
denverpilot said:
Lots of assumptions in that reply. I didn't make any judgment calls on how they affect the supply of Avgas nor did I say they were difficult or easy to fly.

I said they're junk versions of once-nice aircraft. They maintain them a few hundred yards from my hangar and park the stripped ones that'll never fly again there, that they steal parts off of to keep the rest going. Airworthy, but generally junk.

That's all I said. Come on out to the hangar and we can gawk at some of the ones that finally got grounded. Both the PA31s and the Metroliners. They're scattered all over the East ramp at APA. Dead ones there, dying ones over getting worked on at the mx hangar.

Not like this is news. The whole fleet is slowly dying.
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That's SOP for an airline with dying airplanes. Not something exclusive to Key Lime.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
That's SOP for an airline with dying airplanes. Not something exclusive to Key Lime.
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Again. Assumptions.

I didn't say it was exclusive to them.

I could say I've seen it before, though.

Same cycle, different decade.

I heard through the grapevine that the guy flying the Cessna was their head check pilot on the type. Still curious what got him.

A former Aurora cop, supposedly too. Probably liked his new "safer" job... what a bummer.
 
Henning said:
That we accept this as ok because it is industry standard is both irrelevant and sad.
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How else are you going to keep parts for what you are flying. Who has a large pile of SA227 parts, PA31 parts, or whatever old airplanes you have flying? Keep what you have, to support what you are still flying.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
How else are you going to keep parts for what you are flying. Who has a large pile of SA227 parts, PA31 parts, or whatever old airplanes you have flying? Keep what you have, to support what you are still flying.
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Yup. Sanford and Son theme song, and all.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
So, sell your old unairworthy airplanes to a scrap yard, only to buy the parts back in 6 months to a year at a much higher cost? Good plan
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You don't sell them, you "put them out to pasture" and mechanics go out and pull parts and hardware as you need them. As an operator you actually keep your eyes out for "parts planes" and spare engine core deals.
 
Henning said:
That we accept this as ok because it is industry standard is both irrelevant and sad.
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You think the maritime industry is any different?

My first job as Third Mate was for a company that bought scrapyard ships and put just enough money into them to get them past the Coast Guard....then they'd win the grain contracts with the lowest bid.

That company is still in business.
 
Fearless Tower said:
You think the maritime industry is any different?

My first job as Third Mate was for a company that bought scrapyard ships and put just enough money into them to get them past the Coast Guard....then they'd win the grain contracts with the lowest bid.

That company is still in business.
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No, it's the same. Actually it's not bad, and I guess canabalizing is the next best think to keeping it working. Jones Act ships are good for US AID contracts, that's for sure. I did similar with a 1599 ton geared bulker to take a few trips of rice to Venezuela. Usually I try to modernize the gear some as time goes on though.
 
Henning said:
You don't sell them, you "put them out to pasture" and mechanics go out and pull parts and hardware as you need them. As an operator you actually keep your eyes out for "parts planes" and spare engine core deals.
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Yes we do..!!!:lol::lol::lol:

And the PA-31-350 Chieftain will not fly on one engine unless both cowl flaps are CLOSED.

Its on the one engine inop checklist.
 
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