KA/PC12 SP insurance Qs

[hindsight2020]

Probably a question for the pro sites, don't have accounts on the non-121 ones yet. Any lurking contract pilot brain trust on here know what kind of time-in-type the market generally is asking for SP contract work in the aforementioned?

Trying to plan out post-.mil pivot, part-time work so far appears verbotem. Contract and part 142 jerbs look to be the only avenue for the schedules I want. I exceed CATMS mins for EMS, there's no t-prop providers in the area where we're thinking of relocating to (CLT/RDU/GSO band). Floater pool jobs appear 14/14, that's a nonstarter.

Oh, side question. KA vs PC12, which is one is the wider net for contract work? PM if you don't want to share details publicly. Cheers!

 

[kayoh190]

If you don't get a good answer here, it might be worth just paying for a year at PPW and running it by that crowd. You're in a pretty unique situation - I think I'd want to have as many eyes on it as possible.

 

[TCABM]

Probably a question for the pro sites, don't have accounts on the non-121 ones yet. Any lurking contract pilot brain trust on here know what kind of time-in-type the market generally is asking for SP contract work in the aforementioned?

Trying to plan out post-.mil pivot, part-time work so far appears verbotem. Contract and part 142 jerbs look to be the only avenue for the schedules I want. I exceed CATMS mins for EMS, there's no t-prop providers in the area where we're thinking of relocating to (CLT/RDU/GSO band). Floater pool jobs appear 14/14, that's a nonstarter.

Oh, side question. KA vs PC12, which is one is the wider net for contract work? PM if you don't want to share details publicly. Cheers!

Too bad you can’t do (or maybe still can and don’t want to show those cards) an MC-12 or U-28 deployment to get the type.

With your background, I would expect the 142 instructor gig to build a network, then contract off that network would be most advantageous.

 

[hindsight2020]

Too bad you can’t do (or maybe still can and don’t want to show those cards) an MC-12 or U-28 deployment to get the type.

With your background, I would expect the 142 instructor gig to build a network, then contract off that network would be most advantageous.

on the bolded, yeah, hard pass. Iraq II was enough cognitive dissonance for me. Now this latest nonsense; I'm just done.

I retire in 23 months, but since I never did figure out what the heck I'm going to do after the military, I'll likely extend a year if they approve it. That gives the wife time to complete NP school practicals locally, then we can figure out when/where-to leave TX.

The inflection appears to be hours, not type ratings. PC-12 doesn't have a rating anyways; KA type for those variants that require it isn't a big hurdle. The insurance thing seems to be about time in type, I just don't know what that threshold is. If it's a couple hundo, no big deal, I can eat that up doing a year of EMS/local 135/whatever. But if it's 1,000 I'm hosed. I'll just have to keep my post .mil flying strictly recreational and do the sim thing for top off money until full retire. 1st world problems I know.

That youboober steveokinevo did a similar thing, I just don't know how he got the hours to be insured in the SP turboprops.

'tween you and I, what I'm actually trying to do is take a page form @catmandu and see if the trophy boy thing suits me in empty nest.

 

[TCABM]

…That youboober steveokinevo did a similar thing, I just don't know how he got the hours to be insured in the SP turboprops.

'tween you and I, what I'm actually trying to do is take a page form @catmandu and see if the trophy boy thing suits me in empty nest.

On the latter, that’s my plan if/when I get laid off from my current gig again.

Couple of thoughts; 1)Beechtalk has a lot if KA dudes and you could likely find an answer there. I would think with ATP mins/holding an ATP, ME time & recency, it wouldn’t be too onerous. One of my partners does contract work in light jets and did the FSI gig as well as a stint at Flexjet; I can ask him or see about an introduction if you want.

 

[hindsight2020]

On the latter, that’s my plan if/when I get laid off from my current gig again.

Couple of thoughts; 1)Beechtalk has a lot if KA dudes and you could likely find an answer there. I would think with ATP mins/holding an ATP, ME time & recency, it wouldn’t be too onerous. One of my partners does contract work in light jets and did the FSI gig as well as a stint at Flexjet; I can ask him or see about an introduction if you want.

If you could forward my question on how to break into the contract world and what are the insurance gotchas, that would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

 

[DavidWhite]

Generally a pro card from a 142 training center within the previous 12 months and 100 in type seems to do it for most policies. I’ve had people that didn’t care if I had a pro card or not, to people who didn’t like that I wasn’t going to the training center every 6 months. It just really depends. I also do contract flying maybe 10 days a year so I’m sure you’ll get a better answer from someone who does it more often.

Both types have plentiful contract flying available. Generally the bigger the airplane the more money you’ll make. There’s a few type specific groups on FB that post contract opportunities.

FWIW, between the King Air and the PC12, I prefer the King Air. Beechcraft definitely has some “isms”and I think the Pilatus is inherently more intuitive to fly but the only thing better than one PT6 is two of them.

 

[hindsight2020]

Generally a pro card from a 142 training center within the previous 12 months and 100 in type seems to do it for most policies. I’ve had people that didn’t care if I had a pro card or not, to people who didn’t like that I wasn’t going to the training center every 6 months. It just really depends. I also do contract flying maybe 10 days a year so I’m sure you’ll get a better answer from someone who does it more often.

Both types have plentiful contract flying available. Generally the bigger the airplane the more money you’ll make. There’s a few type specific groups on FB that post contract opportunities.

FWIW, between the King Air and the PC12, I prefer the King Air. Beechcraft definitely has some “isms”and I think the Pilatus is inherently more intuitive to fly but the only thing better than one PT6 is two of them.

Thank you! I can finally put a number to the requirements.

I've been mulling over the parlay between 142 employment and contract work. I think if I can get an agreeable location to relocate to (wife's geopreference comes first now as the younger worker, after I retire from .mil) among the part 142 providers, that blend would probably be a good avenue to pursue contract work. Perusing linkedin, I see a lot of folks employed at these 142 outfits (RW and FW alike) doing the exact same thing.

I'll likely still have to do a stint in a full time KA or PC12 gig to get those hours up. But it sounds a lot more doable than I thought, if your insurance numbers are valid for SP PIC. Thanks again. And noted on the KA being more proliferate, that was my intuitive sense, but needed confirmation from someone in the actual space.

 

[DavidWhite]

Thank you! I can finally put a number to the requirements.

I've been mulling over the parlay between 142 employment and contract work. I think if I can get an agreeable location to relocate to (wife's geopreference comes first now as the younger worker, after I retire from .mil) among the part 142 providers, that blend would probably be a good avenue to pursue contract work. Perusing linkedin, I see a lot of folks employed at these 142 outfits (RW and FW alike) doing the exact same thing.

I'll likely still have to do a stint in a full time KA or PC12 gig to get those hours up. But it sounds a lot more doable than I thought, if your insurance numbers are valid for SP PIC. Thanks again. And noted on the KA being more proliferate, that was my intuitive sense, but needed confirmation from someone in the actual space.

I wouldn’t necessarily say I am in the actual space as my primary job isn’t as a contract pilot. Usually it’s a friend of a friend deal where someone can’t do a trip and I get asked. I think some of the insurance requirements sometimes can be waived too. 2000-2500TT is usually a requirement as well, but I’m sure you have that which is why I didn’t mention it in my first post.

 

[hindsight2020]

I wouldn’t necessarily say I am in the actual space as my primary job isn’t as a contract pilot. Usually it’s a friend of a friend deal where someone can’t do a trip and I get asked. I think some of the insurance requirements sometimes can be waived too. 2000-2500TT is usually a requirement as well, but I’m sure you have that which is why I didn’t mention it in my first post.

yeah I'm at 6000+ at the moment, with 12 month turbine currency in excess of 100 hrs/yr to retirement.

 

[Groundpounder]

There is a training provider right next to JQF that does King Air training, including a lot of military contracts. I'm sure you'd be able to get hired there no sweat. Good way to get a type, and network your way into a flying job. It is called FlyRight.

Contract flying is not the glamours gig that a lot of the "influencers" make it out to be. You need to network your way to gigs, its hard to just say "hey I have a type rating, hire me!". And until you build up a excellent client list, you can't say no. The more you say no, the less likely you are to get called again. Had dinner plans with the wife on Friday night? Ooops, Mr Big wants to go to Key West and the regular guy isn't available.

 

[kaiser]

Just saw this so laying out a bit of word salad. I'm a contract pilot on a PC12. I got aboard via the owner and back door into the charter world that way, so I'm not sure what the market is asking pilots for SP. I'm assuming close to our open pilot which is: 2500TT 1000 Turbine 1000 retract 250 type (which I don't meet, so I'm on the insurance). From what I've heard PC12 is nicer than King Air. You get a bigger inside (unless you're the 300/350), and recall that our singe PT6 is a big one (1200SHP) so we have similar speeds. But then again Honeywell [avionics] is honeywell (which is the hardest part of that airplane to fly).

I think there's a big PC12 operator near CLT area - Labcorp or Quest or someone like that? On the contract side you'd probably have to pound the pavement with owners. I'm not sure how big the small mom-pop 91/135 market is (small as in smaller than planesense). My guess maybe there are more random KA floating at small local airfields that need the occasional pilot than PC12s.

Have you considered small jets? Citation, Phenom, Learjet?

 

[hindsight2020]

Just saw this so laying out a bit of word salad. I'm a contract pilot on a PC12. I got aboard via the owner and back door into the charter world that way, so I'm not sure what the market is asking pilots for SP. I'm assuming close to our open pilot which is: 2500TT 1000 Turbine 1000 retract 250 type (which I don't meet, so I'm on the insurance).

That's a good data point, thank you.

Yeah other owner operators I've talked to have mentioned 100 time in type + 12 month sim recurrent (in addition to said general time and turbine requirements, latter which I do meet well in excess). Some have suggested the time in type could be negotiated down, but honestly I'm approaching the question under the assumption my .mil experience doesn't matter all that much to insurers, and I'll have to grab some time in type somewhere before I can realistically hold myself out to contract work.

 

[Tarheelpilot]

Probably a question for the pro sites, don't have accounts on the non-121 ones yet. Any lurking contract pilot brain trust on here know what kind of time-in-type the market generally is asking for SP contract work in the aforementioned?

Trying to plan out post-.mil pivot, part-time work so far appears verbotem. Contract and part 142 jerbs look to be the only avenue for the schedules I want. I exceed CATMS mins for EMS, there's no t-prop providers in the area where we're thinking of relocating to (CLT/RDU/GSO band). Floater pool jobs appear 14/14, that's a nonstarter.

Oh, side question. KA vs PC12, which is one is the wider net for contract work? PM if you don't want to share details publicly. Cheers!

Do you have an unrestricted multi ATP?

 

[hindsight2020]

Do you have an unrestricted multi ATP?

yeah.

 

[jayhawk74]

hindsight2020
Since you are coming from the military do you have a Commercial SEL or a single engine ATP? I'm asking because I know may pilots that came from the military with only a multi ATP. Obviously to fly the PC-12 you will need a single engine rating.

 

[Tarheelpilot]

yeah.

Is a sim instructor job something of interest?

 

[hindsight2020]

hindsight2020
Since you are coming from the military do you have a Commercial SEL or a single engine ATP? I'm asking because I know may pilots that came from the military with only a multi ATP. Obviously to fly the PC-12 you will need a single engine rating.

A fair assumption indeed, but I'm not your typical "mil" guy. I actually did the alphabet thru cfii (PPL, IR, CPL-SE, CFI-A, CFI-I) via part 61 before I ever set foot in the military. But yes to your question, I do retain commercial single engine privileges from my part 61 days.

Is a sim instructor job something of interest?

I subdued that angle on purpose to not derail my original question about the contract flying. Am I thrilled about the option? Not really. But yes, pt 142 (or usaf equivalent) is in all reality, the most likely outcome here. The rest is just unresolved vocational crisis/navel-gazing on my part.

The sim schedules do match my household needs at that time (high schooler in the house), so credit where credit is due. I have direct experience doing the console job as part of my flight evaluator roles in the military (line check airman equivalent in the military), so the environment is not foreign to me.

Lastly, I do like the fact over on that side, part-time roles are available. So the potential to be able to carve out some time for the occassional flying gig is there.

 

[Tarheelpilot]

A fair assumption indeed, but I'm not your typical "mil" guy. I actually did the alphabet thru cfii (PPL, IR, CPL-SE, CFI-A, CFI-I) via part 61 before I ever set foot in the military. But yes to your question, I do retain commercial single engine privileges from my part 61 days.


I subdued that angle on purpose to not derail my original question about the contract flying. Am I thrilled about the option? Not really. But yes, pt 142 (or usaf equivalent) is in all reality, the most likely outcome here. The rest is just unresolved vocational crisis/navel-gazing on my part.

The sim schedules do match my household needs at that time (high schooler in the house), so credit where credit is due. I have direct experience doing the console job as part of my flight evaluator roles in the military (line check airman equivalent in the military), so the environment is not foreign to me.

Lastly, I do like the fact over on that side, part-time roles are available. So the potential to be able to carve out some time for the occassional flying gig is there.

Check the PMs

 

[flyingron]

Don't think sport pilots can fly a pilatypus.