Instrument helicopter to inst fixed wing
- Thread starter tfitch03
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The PTS around page 1-vii lists the tasks for the additional instrument rating add-on ride.
61.65(a)(7) doesn't require you to retake the written.
61.65(d)(1) says you need 10 hours of your XC time to be in an airplane (probably you have this).
61.65(d)(2) says you need 15 hours of instruction by a CFI with an instrument airplane rating. However, it doesn't say those 15 hours have to be in an airplane, just the three hours of checkride prep in the two months before the ride.
So a literal reading of reg presuming your CFI for your helo training held an airplane instructor rating:
10 hours of XC (not necessarily IFR) flight in airplanes
3 hours instruction in preparation of your checkride (within 2 calendar months).
61.65(a)(7) doesn't require you to retake the written.
61.65(d)(1) says you need 10 hours of your XC time to be in an airplane (probably you have this).
61.65(d)(2) says you need 15 hours of instruction by a CFI with an instrument airplane rating. However, it doesn't say those 15 hours have to be in an airplane, just the three hours of checkride prep in the two months before the ride.
So a literal reading of reg presuming your CFI for your helo training held an airplane instructor rating:
10 hours of XC (not necessarily IFR) flight in airplanes
3 hours instruction in preparation of your checkride (within 2 calendar months).
poadeleted20
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Stratobee's description is a bit jumbled.
No written required for an additional instrument rating in another category. Minimum 15 hours of instrument flight training in an airplane from an instrument-airplane instructor (yes, 15 hours in an airplane; the fact that your helo instrument instructor also held an airplane rating too doesn't count). Pared-down practical test (see the Additional Rating Task Table in the Instrument PTS).
There are some other details of flight time in 14 CFR 61.65(d), but you can do those in conjunction with the 15 hours of training. I've done a few of these, and my only word of advice based on those is to make sure you don't go forward on the yoke when you start your missed approach -- translational lift is not necessary in an airplane.
No written required for an additional instrument rating in another category. Minimum 15 hours of instrument flight training in an airplane from an instrument-airplane instructor (yes, 15 hours in an airplane; the fact that your helo instrument instructor also held an airplane rating too doesn't count). Pared-down practical test (see the Additional Rating Task Table in the Instrument PTS).
There are some other details of flight time in 14 CFR 61.65(d), but you can do those in conjunction with the 15 hours of training. I've done a few of these, and my only word of advice based on those is to make sure you don't go forward on the yoke when you start your missed approach -- translational lift is not necessary in an airplane.
tfitch03
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Thanks guys. That is really good news.
One follow up question, if I receive my instruction in a tail wheel, and plan on using that plane for my check ride, do my CFII and FAA evaluator have to be tail wheel endorsed?
One follow up question, if I receive my instruction in a tail wheel, and plan on using that plane for my check ride, do my CFII and FAA evaluator have to be tail wheel endorsed?
poadeleted20
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Since your instructor has to be PIC for the required long IFR XC, yes, your instructor must be TW qualified (endorsed or, like me, grandfathered). The examiner isn't PIC on the practical test, so it's not an issue there, but I've yet to see a DPE who isn't TW qualified. Just make sure you are.
RotorAndWing
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Translational lift occurs at 15-25 knots. I seriously doubt any instrument helicopter flies an approach that slow, usually between 60 to 80.
And to miss in a helicopter requires 1) raising the collective and 2) making a slight adjustment of the cyclic.
tfitch03
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Excellent! Thanks for the info. Now to find a DPE close to Dallas.
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Velocity173
Translational lift occurs at 15-25 knots. I seriously doubt any instrument helicopter flies an approach that slow, usually between 60 to 80.
And to miss in a helicopter requires 1) raising the collective and 2) making a slight adjustment of the cyclic.
Yep, I can't see a RW guy pushing forward yoke on missed in a FW as a habit. In helos I maintain 100 kts (non copter) for approach. For missed, increase collective for climb and adjust cyclic to maintain 100 kts. There's a slight bit of forward cyclic to counter the increased downwash on the tail but I'd say it's negligible. Obviously going through ETL requires forward cyclic to keep from climbing and also counter blow back but that wouldn't apply for missed.
I've heard stories of RW guys having problems with left pedal on takeoff as well but they'd have to be pretty dense in order to do that. I think the only problem I could see RW guys having in transitioning to FW is maybe getting slow on final. Even then, that would be a quick cure.
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RotorAndWing
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Rotor wing guys are far more aware of yaw than the fixed wing types. The left pedal on TO is a myth. If a rotor wing guy has been flying US type helicopters and jumps into a European one the first pick up is a non event as he recognizes yaw and corrects.
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I agree. Although I've yet to fly a helicopter that spins the "wrong way" to test that on myself.
poadeleted20
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I had two helo-airplane IR trainees who were not getting the nose up on the missed, and both said they thought this was the problem -- negative training transfer, and all that. Worth storing for future use with helo-airplane transitions, I think.Translational lift occurs at 15-25 knots. I seriously doubt any instrument helicopter flies an approach that slow, usually between 60 to 80.
And to miss in a helicopter requires 1) raising the collective and 2) making a slight adjustment of the cyclic.
RotorAndWing
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I think they had other problems. Instruments are instruments be it fixed wing or rotor wing.
A climb is recognizable on either machine regardless of pitch. Airspeed, VSI, altimeter, all that jazz.
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Lindberg
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Carol Walker.
tfitch03
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I know her and have been renting her planes for a while now. That is good thinking.
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Possibly some Somatogravic illusion???
I think they're just used to pulling in collective and climbing out in level or even in a nose low attitude vs applying throttle and pitching to a nose high attitude in a FW.
poadeleted20
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It is. But the muscle memory for the initial hand/arm movements upon the mental decision to execute a missed may take some work to break. Laws of Primacy and Exercise at work.
poadeleted20
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Bingo. Once we figured out why the first one was doing that (which took a couple of flights), he was able to fix it quickly. Second one I saw it, mentioned the issue right away, and the problem disappeared.