Installation Question: Fuel Flow Monitor

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flygirl34q

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I'm in the process of unpacking my goodies from Airventure... taking a computer break every now and then because there is so much that I brought home... but I won a fuel flow monitor in the prize raffle that the POS (Piper Owner Society) had on our bus trip to Airventure on Monday and now I'm wondering how many AMUs it is going to cost me to install it in my airplane. I do have an available space in my panel for it, but unfortunately, the prize did not include shop time at my favorite mechanic's! :eek: I have a '77 Archer II.

I also won a pair of red safety caps to go over each fuel tank filler port to prevent water contamination... but I think I can figure out how to install those! :)
 
Would you please provide some make and model info on the system you won? Congratulations by the way!
 
Congrats on your prize.

Your Society really needs a name change to get a better acronym:eek:...


Chris
 
LOL... believe it or not, that feedback has been put into the suggestion box before, Chris! :crazy: But, you know... sometimes the name really does fit from time to time. :dunno:

http://www.aerospacelogic.com/

Here is the company website. And here:

http://www.forinstruments.com/store/index.php?dispatch=products.view&product_id=56

is a link to what I have. I've never heard of this company before, so was curious about the installation before I got all excited about having something other than the stock fuel gauges I have in my Archer. If the cost is going to be outrageous, I could always try to sell this on E-bay. I have an e-mail in to my mechanic, but haven;t gotten a response back from him as of yet.
 
Lynn,

We have been selling (amongst other products) fuel level instruments since 2000 and have thousands of them installed worldwide.

What you have is definitely a fuel level instrument and not a fuel flow. If either you or your mechanic have any questions please feel free to call our office or contact us by email.

The instrument you have is one of our new generation 200 Series. One of the things we worked hard at was reducing the install time (cost). Here are a few notes that may help you:

1. It is a condition of the STC that the existing fuel level instruments be removed or disabled. This is usually a pretty simple task.

2. The physical installation in the panel is pretty simple requiring four screws to secure the instrument in place and a six wire connection. This portion should not take more than an hour.

3. Finally the instrument needs to be calibrated to match your tanks and senders. This is the area that is a day/night difference from our older products and, for your aircraft should not take more that an hour per tank. FYI, one of our compliance test aircraft was a PA28 and the calibration took under 25 minutes per tank, however the people performing the install had done this many times before so I would not consider this to be the norm for everyone.

4. Then there is the paperwork. As this instrument is STC'd as a primary replacement you simply need to have a 337 submitted.

Any questions please feel free to ask! All the best with your descision.
 
Lynn I'd love to hear a PIREP if you do decide to have this installed. The gauges in my Cherokee 6 are awful. I don't even look at them, which bugs my wife. She did some research and found that the most common reason for GA accidents is fuel starvation/exhaustion. That brought up discussions about fuel totalizes etc.

A 4 tank gauge from Aero logic would fit in the budget and they are calibrated as opposed to the ones currently in the panel.
 
Wow... thanks for the info, Shane! I'm still in the process of unpacking from the show and the FL202 is still in its box in my hangar. I'll most likely wait to do the install until my next annual when everything is apart anyway to avoid extra downtime... but I'll save your contact info for my mechanic if he has any questions about it. A couple of hours labor isn't too bad really and it will be nice to know more exactly how much fuel is left in each tank. The stock fuel gauges I have currently from Piper are, as everyone already knows, only really accurate when the tanks are "FULL" and "EMPTY". :)

PIREP (and photos!) to follow when I get it in and working!
 
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flygirl34q said:
Wow... thanks for the info, Shane! I'm still in the process of unpacking from the show and the FL202 is still in its box in my hangar. I'll most likely wait to do the install until my next annual when everything is apart anyway to avoid extra downtime... but I'll save your contact info for my mechanic if he has any questions about it. A couple of hours labor isn't too bad really and it will be nice to know more exactly how much fuel is left in each tank. The stock fuel gauges I have currently from Piper are, as everyone already knows, only really accurate when the tanks are "FULL" and "EMPTY". :)

PIREP (and photos!) to follow when I get it in and working!
Click to expand...
I was pretty surprised to discover during all my Gastons flying that the stock gauges in the PA-28-180 I had were actually pretty damn accurate.
 
jesse said:
I was pretty surprised to discover during all my Gastons flying that the stock gauges in the PA-28-180 I had were actually pretty damn accurate.
Click to expand...

The 4 :wink2: stock fuel gauges in my Cherokee are pretty accurate, too.
 
The one on the J3 Cub is very accurate, too. Simple to replace, as well.

-Rich
 
The problem with my PA28 fuel gauges is the senders, not the gauges. They have/had dead spots. Pulling them and cleaning them fixed one and improved the other. If this gadget uses the old senders, it wouldn't help me.
 
Mine are all out of whack. At the tabs I have one that reads 20 gal and the other reads just over 10. I've never had them full but I suspect full and empty are the only two times they're even close. I'd sure like to have more accurate gauges, it would be nice info to have in addition to keeping track with a timer.
 
I had fun on a perfect weather day today... it was even better temperature-wise at about 80 degrees than it has been lately... and I went to meet a friend for lunch in Indiana and also find out a little more about what my options were for that Aerospace Logic fuel level instrument that is still sitting in its box in my hangar. Turns out that it will take about 1 and 1/2 AMU's to install my gizmo or about 15-20 hours of shop time. Ugggh... not exactly the answer I was wanting to hear. :( Apparently, it's the calibration process that is time-consuming, but necessary... and at the hourly rates they charge, it adds up quickly. But, on a related note... I also am now in the posession of an actual fuel flow monitor instrument from JPI and I got it for free because it came out of another pilot's panel who was upgrading to an EDM 800 and he was kind enough to give the one he used to have in there to me. Cool, huh?? Guess it sometimes pays to walk around the airport hangars just to see what is going on! :) Of course, there still is the install thing... and I will probably wait until my next annual to even consider it. Blah... everything in aviation costs so much! :0
 
flygirl34q said:
I had fun on a perfect weather day today... it was even better temperature-wise at about 80 degrees than it has been lately... and I went to meet a friend for lunch in Indiana and also find out a little more about what my options were for that Aerospace Logic fuel level instrument that is still sitting in its box in my hangar. Turns out that it will take about 1 and 1/2 AMU's to install my gizmo or about 15-20 hours of shop time. Ugggh... not exactly the answer I was wanting to hear. :( Apparently, it's the calibration process that is time-consuming, but necessary... and at the hourly rates they charge, it adds up quickly. But, on a related note... I also am now in the posession of an actual fuel flow monitor instrument from JPI and I got it for free because it came out of another pilot's panel who was upgrading to an EDM 800 and he was kind enough to give the one he used to have in there to me. Cool, huh?? Guess it sometimes pays to walk around the airport hangars just to see what is going on! :) Of course, there still is the install thing... and I will probably wait until my next annual to even consider it. Blah... everything in aviation costs so much! :0
Click to expand...

First of all, I'm surprised that an extensive calibration is actually required for your fuel gauge. Most OEM gauges are "calibrated" with nothing more than a two point check (full and empty) and I doubt that more is required here even though an elaborate procedure may be noted in the installation instructions. I suggest you call the manufacture's tech support and ask to what extent the detailed calibration is needed to complete a legal installation.

Second, if you need (or want) to have the gauge read as accurate as possible, I suspect that you could perform that portion of the installation yourself (possibly with the help of a friend) under the supervision of the installing shop. Most of that effort will be nothing more than filling the tank a bit at a time and noting the gauge reading, certainly anyone who's filled a tank before can handle. If the shop you contacted won't agree to that, find one that will. This really shouldn't require more than an hour or two of a mechanic's time.
 
I own a new still in the box ALI fuel level gauge for our Aztec. The only reason it isn't installed is indeed the extensive calibration method of draining the bladders, then filling them 1 gallon at a time, rinse, lather, repeat, while calibrating the instrument. Also, you really need to have your sending units overhauled/calibrated before bothering to install the instrument. A friend of mine with a C185 on amphib floats went through this process three times before he was satisfied. Every time I feel up to it and pull the gauge out of box, I read through the calibration process and that's all it takes to put it away.
 
COFlyBoy said:
Lynn I'd love to hear a PIREP if you do decide to have this installed. The gauges in my Cherokee 6 are awful. I don't even look at them, which bugs my wife. She did some research and found that the most common reason for GA accidents is fuel starvation/exhaustion. That brought up discussions about fuel totalizes etc.

A 4 tank gauge from Aero logic would fit in the budget and they are calibrated as opposed to the ones currently in the panel.
Click to expand...

But since the existing fuel senders are used, will this really provide more accurate information on fuel quantity?
 
murphey said:
But since the existing fuel senders are used, will this really provide more accurate information on fuel quantity?
Click to expand...

I would think so, as long as the senders are working. These digital gauges can be calibrated with the senders in your tank, so as long as the sender is consistent it should be better than the uncalibrated analog stock gauges.

That said, on our return from Yellowstone last week the right main fuel gauge stopped at 15 gallons, and I ran that sucker to zero. My wife noticed the fuel pressure drop, and I got the tanks switched before the engine even hiccupped. The tank is coming off this month and the sender is going to be fixed or replaced.
 
Hi Tim... and yes, I won a fuel level instrument from Aerospace Logic on the POS (Piper Owner Society) fly-in/bus trip to Airventure this year. There were many donated prizes from the vendors that advertise in PIPERS magazine and everyone had a chance to win one of them. Next year, I have to suggest that the prize also include installation costs at one's favorite avionics shop because wow... :eek:. I think I need to PM Aerospace Logic's Shane and ask him where he is located since he posted earlier about that calibration process being around an hour or less per tank for mechanics familiar with the process. Even our mechanics are sometimes behind the learning curve when doing something new, I guess!

And my husband is a very different sort of pilot, sadly enough. :( He really doesn't enjoy going to Oshkosh and tags along because I want to do it. He doesn't like the camping, the heat, the crowds, the walking around, and he doesn't even want to fly into KOSH because he thinks there are too many other pilots flying in there who are accidents waiting to happen. I have not camped for the past two years and we have stayed in a hotel because of him! I suppose it is a small compromise to get him to go to the show with me. :(
 
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Ok guys and gals lets clear up a few things. The fuel instrument discussed here is the new generation FL202 NOT the FL-100. There is no comparison between the two.

The new generation FL202 uses a completely different calibration procedure where most tanks can be calibrated in under one hour! So for two tanks, two hours. Anything over this and you either have some serious problems with your existing aircraft systems or have someone performing the task who has no idea of what to do. In fact, the process of calibration has been so simplified that the only instruction in the manual is to follow the on screen instructions displayed on the instrument.

We installed one of these in a test PA28-161 as part of our STC compliance program. Time to calibrate BOTH tanks? Under one hour. Yes, that's right, for BOTH.

Now this is all based on the existing systems in your aircraft being in a serviceable condition (note, not perfect). The FL202 instrument will work with senders that have less then 10% dead-spot areas. Now if you need to pull a tank and replace a sender that is another issue.

We are actively evaluating local fly-ins (within 200nm of CYHM) to demonstrate this. Conditions apply, but all you need is a licensed FAA IA or A&P who is willing to supervise and sign off your aircraft (Canadian AME cannot sign off a US registered aircraft or we would do that for you too). Everything is free, we only ask that you confirm your experience in writing.

Interested? Feel free to contact us:
http://www.forinstruments.com/store/index.php?dispatch=pages.view&page_id=1


On a related note, we keep getting panel picture requests. Here is a test PA28 panel that we did late 2009.
http://www.forinstruments.com/store/index.php?dispatch=pages.view&page_id=38


Any questions or comments, just ask!
 
Sell it or trade it in on a proper fuel flow gauge which will give you accurate info.
 
So... does anyone here know of an aviation gathering or fly-in preferably in the Cleveland/Toledo/Sandusky, OH areas or perhaps Detroit, MI?? :fcross: I have heard back from Shane and it just so happens that I can get my FL202 installed for FREE by Aerospace Logic IF I can supply a mechanic to sign it off AND the location is within 200 miles of Hamilton, Ontario, Canada. But, it has to be somewhere where there are going to be people to watch the process for Aerospace Logic's advertising purposes. And then I also have to write a story about the experience after it's done. :idea: If I had a Beech Bonanza, I'd be all set... there is going to be an install event in Buffalo, NY next month, but unfortunately, they are being very exclusive... Bo drivers only. :(
 
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