I know I know, don't fix it if it isn't broken

Timbeck2

Final Approach
Joined
Nov 4, 2015
Messages
9,161
Location
Vail, Arizona
Display Name

Display name:
Timbeck2
...but over the three years I've owned my airplane various things have been replaced or added to my panel. The avionics guy I use replaces or installs as necessary new Klixon circuit breakers because he likes them and has convinced me to like them too. So what I have are the new Klixon and the old ones that still work but at least on a few of them, the number has faded so you can barely make out the amperage. The Klixon can be pulled, the old ones are flush. I don't want to replace them all at one pop but eventually I'd like the panel to be all one type of breaker so every time I place an order for parts and supplies, I think I'll add a circuit breaker to the order.

Am I just being overly anal retentive or is it a good idea or I should just fly the thing and not worry about it? Flame on!

edit: I forgot to mention that I need experience in avionics installation and all things electrical in order to fulfill my resume' in order to sit for the A&P written and practical. Plus it gives me the option of pulling a breaker rather than shutting off the master if I smell smoke.
 
Last edited:
Replace ‘em if you like ‘em.

The originals are pretty much crap on Cessnas. Don’t know about yours. They’re also recessed so you can’t pull them.

Makes you think twice when the alternator’s 50A one pops and you decide if you really want to push it back in or not. It starts burning, you can’t yank it back out. All you can do is reach for the master and maybe the fire extinguisher.

Cessna of course, knows they’re crap, so they put a limitation on resetting that one once. That way you can only start the first fire... :)
 
I think Piper and Cessna used the same type if not the same breaker. So yes, I have the ones that are recessed flush with the panel and can't pull them.
 
Yeah, not a fan. We haven’t replaced all of ours but our new avionics came with new/better ones.

If we ever do a nice flat metal panel and made it pretty, the old breakers would find their way to a dumpster.
 
Recently replaced the old style ones with new ones after realizing that even if I am on fire, I can’t pull them. .5k AMU




















The next week I had to change the alternator and the ammeter. So... there is that. Not related to changing the breakers, but things break right after an optional upgrade
 
Dude, you already made a stupid financial decision by owning a plane. Just go ahead and replace the rest of the breakers and don’t sweat it. It’s pennies on the dollar in the grand scheme. So no, you’re not anal. You’re asking us? That’s even funnier.

No, I’m not kidding. Trying to be funny, yes, but the message is the same. Do it.
 
"Not related to changing the breakers, but things break right after an optional upgrade
emoji38.png
"


True. A lot of the time with older aircraft, messing around with the old wiring can cause more problems than what you started with.
 
True. A lot of the time with older aircraft, messing around with the old wiring can cause more problems than what you started with.
I must say I disagree with that logic. You have old breakers that you can not cycle, only reset. Newer breakers that you can pull and isolate a circuit are far superior than the original equipment. You will be able to inspect the connections and clean corrosion or any wiring that shows age.

I'm very happy with the changes I have done to my buss panel....:)
 
Recently replaced the old style ones with new ones after realizing that even if I am on fire, I can’t pull them.
.5k AMU...

That seems awfully expensive.
For that price might have been easier to just buy a brand new Piper. ;)
 
Lots of things we do because they feel good, not because there will be some great functional difference. Nothing horrible about that.
150 hours a year of looking down at a tidy, pretty bank of CBs has some value.
Might bump resale value a tad, too.
 
Plus it gives me the option of pulling a breaker rather than shutting off the master if I smell smoke.

I think the way that would work is, you flip the master/alt switches off, then pull all the breakers. (you likely won’t know which circuit is making heat, so you wont just reach out & pull the offending breaker)
Then, one thing on at a time, starting with the master. Wait. Then on with whatever one you think is most essential. Wait. Stop once you have only those things necessary for a safe landing.
Thoughts?
 
Recently replaced the old style ones with new ones after realizing that even if I am on fire, I can’t pull them. .5k AMU
Let's see; that works to about $500,000, doesn't it.
edit: I see GRG55 already commented on that.
 
I like to look at a row of switches that have uniformity. But that's just the way I am. I think you'll feel better after all breakers match or you wouldn't be asking.
 
...Stop once you have only those things necessary for a safe landing.
Thoughts?

This.

Maybe depends on situation and the specific airplane?

An inflight fire is, imo, the nightmare scenario. And electrical has always seemed to me the top potential culprit. So over the years have tried to think it through on each plane I've owned.

Even when I was flying VFR only I kept a little battery powered portable GPS and comm radio on board and ready. Flying VFR no need to risk turning any of the circuits back on in the Piper singles (manual flaps, fixed gear, except the Arrow). VFR with electric retractable gear and/or flaps a wee bit more involved.

IFR, another matter entirely. Still have the battery powered GPS (iPad now) and radio. Hydraulic gear and flaps driven by dual engine driven pumps on my twin gives some optionality. Still running the vac/electric steam gauge panel (maybe there's something +'ve to be said for that over all glass?)

Have only ever had one breaker pop out on me in flight. Aztec autopilot when the roll server failed. The mental debate about the risk of resetting it at the time was interesting.
 
Last edited:
Replace them all at the same time. If you crawl under there and see how they're connected, you'll see that they (usually) have a bus bar across the whole row of breakers, to feed them, and to replace one you often have to disconnect a bunch of the others to shift the bus bar out of the way to remove the breaker. That makes replacing one a lot of work, and replacing ten breakers therefore takes less than ten times the labor of replacing one.

Pilots rub the numbers off the breaker buttons by running a finger across them to check for any popped ones during the post-start or runup checks. Eyeball them instead and save the printing.
 
Am I just being overly anal retentive or is it a good idea or I should just fly the thing and not worry about it? Flame on!

True. A lot of the time with older aircraft, messing around with the old wiring can cause more problems than what you started with.

While this may be true, I also like the idea of being able to clearly pull things off-line if needed. I say go for it. Report back if you open Pandora's Box so I can edit my response to don't do it!

Loosely related, the avionics guy that added my G5 HSI said it's getting pretty bad back there after all the years of piecemeal upgrading. I told him I'd like to eventually have new panels cut and clean up things on the panel and behind it. Asked him how long he'd guess it'd take. He laughed and said a long time. Wish I was an A&P and avionics technician. :)
 
While this may be true, I also like the idea of being able to clearly pull things off-line if needed. I say go for it. Report back if you open Pandora's Box so I can edit my response to don't do it!

Loosely related, the avionics guy that added my G5 HSI said it's getting pretty bad back there after all the years of piecemeal upgrading. I told him I'd like to eventually have new panels cut and clean up things on the panel and behind it. Asked him how long he'd guess it'd take. He laughed and said a long time. Wish I was an A&P and avionics technician. :)

Having done owner assist on my ILS, DME and relocating my transponder and adding Nulites, fuel guages and volt/amp gauge I found that a lot of the wiring looked to be original to the plane and it was brittle and had cracks in the insulation. Moving that wire around caused more cracks and eventually replacement. Project creep is a real thing. Avionics takes a LOT of time in building harnesses, soldering, shrink wrap (with the cool stuff that you can print out what the wire is going to) and not to mention being a contortionist working underneath the dash. Avionics guys earn their money for sure.
 
Back
Top