I am going to find out, today, just how dangerous the Cirrus really is

woodstock

woodstock

Final Approach
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My old CFI bought a new Cirrus. He offered to take me for a spin.

If you don't hear from me by evening, check the online news sources and alert my family.

By the way, my CFI has always had the coolest planes. Two Diamond Stars in succession, and then the Cirrus. Not sure what he had before the Diamonds. I wonder if he still gets the same tax breaks as before.
 
Here's hoping you don't find out first-hand.:wink2:
 
You will enjoy it. But ask to try to move it around on the ramp by yourself. Educational.

Dan
 
Jim Logajan said:
A NEW Cirrus? Or just new to him? And here I thought CFI income made them all paupers.
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I think it was a month old. The previous owner decided he didn't want it, after he had spent ~20K on upgrade (fancy wheel pants, and the lights are some kind of major upgrade, can't remember what he said they were).

My CFI has a Decathlon, too. Which also has a lot of fancy stuff in it.

His last two airplanes were Diamonds - the latest an XLS. He gets a new plane every time the old one depreciates down to nothing.
 
Anyway, we are back. That is a lot of plane. I haven't been inside a small plane in roughly 4 years, if memory serves. Wow, four years.

My CFI looked at this like a new discovery flight and I was surprised to find myself sitting left seat. I am surprised at how much I've forgotten, then again, I think even if I were fresh on the 172 my head would still be spinning trying to keep track of things. I had my head WAY inside the cockpit for most of the ride which isn't good. I don't really recall much of what we passed over - things happen REALLY fast in that plane and I've never been left seat on a glass panel before either so it wasn't like I knew instinctively where to look, either (so where the hell is that ball, anyway?). Plus the stick is totally different, and so on. Interesting.

We went to a towered airport (which was my bane even when I was flying regularly!). Beautiful day. Calm winds, decent viz but some haze.

I was also surprised at the number of people getting their private done in the Cirrus. Yes, it's been a while since I've flown. His school only has Cirri, Diamonds, and Arrow, a Decathlon, and a few others, none of which were Cessnas. BUSY as all get out. His plane flew 55 hours last month - his first month of ownership!

It's a beautiful plane. Red on top - shiny, sparkly red. It's fully tricked out, so whatever the SR20s go for, fully tricked. Plus the guy who sold it to him had just spent a buttload of money on fancier pants and lights. The last guy had it hardly any time at all.
 
MachFly said:
No one said it can't do it, it was just not tested for it.
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I think it would be more accurate to say "it was just not fully tested" for spins, and also not authorized to be spun intentionally. In any event, information posted on the internet by Cirrus' VP-Engineering (and later removed) said it passed all the spin tests it did, but when they got the exemption for the chute to sub for the spin test requirement, they stopped testing. How far the testing got is not something Cirrus has not discussed publicly.
 
Dan Thomas said:
You will enjoy it. But ask to try to move it around on the ramp by yourself. Educational.

Dan
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Why???? They are heavy to move by hand but with a tug, not especially a challenge. No worry about hitting turn limits on the nose wheel. Responds more quickly to nose wheel angle when backing up than most.
 
Graueradler said:
Why???? They are heavy to move by hand but with a tug, not especially a challenge. No worry about hitting turn limits on the nose wheel. Responds more quickly to nose wheel angle when backing up than most.
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Whats your trick to move one with a tug that had a nose wheel pant. ?:dunno:
 
Forgot to mention some total bonehead turned LEFT out of the pattern to exit. As we were on the 45 trying to enter the pattern. He wasnt doing a pattern he was exiting. had we not seen him and climbed, blam. He went right under us. Right under.
 
woodstock said:
Forgot to mention some total bonehead turned LEFT out of the pattern to exit. As we were on the 45 trying to enter the pattern. He wasnt doing a pattern he was exiting. had we not seen him and climbed, blam. He went right under us. Right under.
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:eek:

Times like that would make support the idea of a parachute for the airplane.

... but didn't your CFI transmit "ATITAPA"?

:D
 
What was irritating is that I made several calls as we approached. Pretty damn clear what we were doing and whe we were.
 
Most glass displays incorporate the ball function into the sky-pointer triangle at the top of the attitude display. When sliced horizontally, the big triangle becomes a small triangle sitting atop a trapezoid-shaped piece that moves laterally to approximate inclinometer position. So instead of stepping on the ball, the pilot steps on the zoid to maintain coordinated flight.
 
woodstock said:
Forgot to mention some total bonehead turned LEFT out of the pattern to exit. As we were on the 45 trying to enter the pattern. He wasnt doing a pattern he was exiting. had we not seen him and climbed, blam. He went right under us. Right under.
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Ummm you can turn left out of the pattern if ya want.
 
Not typical procedure at my airport. Probably due to adiz.

ps. if you want to exit, left, you continue the pattern and then just keep going - instead of turning base you continue on. Exiting the pattern the way he did was weird and dangerous. A lot of people from the west come in on the 45 exactly where we did (come from west, head east around airport and then the 45), and, the proximity to restricted airspace is such that you don't want to be where he appeared to be heading. We're boxed in at my airport. He basically cut off anyone who was entering the 45 - and I made several calls previous to that to announce our position.
 
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woodstock said:
What was irritating is that I made several calls as we approached. Pretty damn clear what we were doing and whe we were.
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Sometimes it just don't pay... good thing you were both looking outside (and not fixated on the runway). Somehow I doubt the other pilot was looking outside very much.
 
Let me translate this for you...

"Keep the cheese on the cracker."


wabower said:
Most glass displays incorporate the ball function into the sky-pointer triangle at the top of the attitude display. When sliced horizontally, the big triangle becomes a small triangle sitting atop a trapezoid-shaped piece that moves laterally to approximate inclinometer position. So instead of stepping on the ball, the pilot steps on the zoid to maintain coordinated flight.
Click to expand...
 
Kelvin said:
Let me translate this for you...

"Keep the cheese on the cracker."
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Here's a picture. It's the thing labeled "TC". The bottom part of the triangle moves just like the ball would so you "step on" the part that's sticking out rather than stepping on the ball.

PFD-information.jpg
 
Graueradler said:
Why???? They are heavy to move by hand but with a tug, not especially a challenge. No worry about hitting turn limits on the nose wheel. Responds more quickly to nose wheel angle when backing up than most.
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Do the Grumman and RV have stops on the castering nosewheel to prevent it getting into the prop arc? The Cirrus does, and it has a LOT of caster displacement; the wheel axle is a long way behind the caster pivot. With one hand on the towbar and the other pushing on the prop, you have to exert a lot of towbar pressure to keep the thing steering right as you back it up into your spot or away from the pumps or whatever. If someone helps by pushing on one leading edge, it becomes a real fight between you and that nosewheel as the assymetrical thrust tries to turn it the wrong way.

And then there's the weight: the SR20 is 2100 lbs empty or so, plus fuel, on little 5" tires. It does not want to roll easily.

Anyone can use a tug. Is there a tug everywhere? And try backing one up with a tug; when one wheel encounters any obstruction that nosewheel skids sideways and the whole airplane starts off doing its own thing. So much weight on such tiny wheels.

Dan
 
Dan Thomas said:
Anyone can use a tug. Is there a tug everywhere? And try backing one up with a tug; when one wheel encounters any obstruction that nosewheel skids sideways and the whole airplane starts off doing its own thing. So much weight on such tiny wheels.
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The local SR22 turbo owner bought a little electric tug for getting the plane in and out. It's really not the smallest one I've seen, but it does seem like he struggles with it a bit. It certainly is not elegant to use.
 
woodstock said:
Not typical procedure at my airport. Probably due to adiz.

ps. if you want to exit, left, you continue the pattern and then just keep going - instead of turning base you continue on. Exiting the pattern the way he did was weird and dangerous. A lot of people from the west come in on the 45 exactly where we did (come from west, head east around airport and then the 45), and, the proximity to restricted airspace is such that you don't want to be where he appeared to be heading. We're boxed in at my airport. He basically cut off anyone who was entering the 45 - and I made several calls previous to that to announce our position.
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I don't quite visualize whether the left turn was NE or SW. I'm also not clear whether he was IFR or VFR.

If he was IFR and headed NE, then chances are he had a clearance direct to WOOLY & IAD worked him through their arrival/departure stream.

If IFR and SW, the clearance may have been to LDN.

If VFR, then it does raise some questions.
 
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