High Altitude and iPad

jsstevens

jsstevens

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jsstevens
I was watching a video on ForeFlight. In it the speaker mentioned using it at 11,400 ft. to show that Apple's 10,000 ft limitation is not valid. Does anybody know what they (Apple) are concerned about? Right now I'm flying a C-172 in Florida so I'm not to concerned about it now, but I have hopes of moving into more capable traveling (not pressurized) machines some day.

John
 
Not only will it work fine at 11,000 feet but IIRC they did test it for rapid decompression at 40k feet and had no problems there.
 
rainsux said:
I suspect that the primary issue is cooling.
Click to expand...


Ah yes I have noticed that my iphone will overheat at very high altitude if i'm not careful. No more throwing it up on top of the panel.

Never had a problem with the ipad or iphone in my lap though.
 
Don't know what Apple is worried about but I routinely use Foreflight at cabin altitudes greater than 10,000'. Haven't seen a problem yet. I was above 12,500 (but below 14,000) for a little less than 30 minutes on each of my last two flights and the Ipad worked just fine the whole time. Each flight was at least 1.25 hours above 10,000. Of course the density altitudes were somewhat lower since it's winter. Didn't bother to calculate those. It wasn't really abnormally warm anyway.

Of course, one person's experience does not mean the Ipad will always function above 10,000.
 
Ground level at some places where people live is above 10,000 MSL. They have the same phones and computers and electronic stuff galore that people at sea level have.
 
These guys ran one up to 100,000' and then dropped it.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/ipad-dropped-from-19-miles-up-the-edges-of-space-and-survives/
iPad-Dropped-from-space.jpg


Altitude is a serious issue with hard drives, as the heads ride on an air cushion.

I can't think of issues other than maybe temperature and the plain fact that the in-house reliability testing only went to 10K. I personally wouldn't worry about it with an iPad. A laptop with a hard drive, absolutely.

There are a bunch of forums that have touched this one.

https://discussions.apple.com/thread/2613460?start=0&tstart=0
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=921387
 
LVS to ICT in my 182 at 11,500' the whole way. iPad never skipped a beat on my yoke.
 
Long term use (hours at high altitude) MIGHT have a cooling issue, but IIRC there's no active cooling in an iPad, is there?

No other issues.
 
I was under the impression that the iPad does NOT use rotating disk but SSD (flash drives, like your thumb drives) instead. The reason Apple claims 10K is that most floating head drives don't work that well above that altitude, if at all. SSD has no similar limitation. Apple didn't see any reason to test above 10K because commercial airliners & biz jets are pressurized to 8K.

As I've mentioned on POA before - the Mars rovers use SSD. Consider that altitude limitation.
 
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I have not had altitude issues but mine did lock up on a 107 degree day coming out of Dallas last summer.....temp could have been higher in the cockpit of the 182....I was sweating bullets, 4900 foot density altitude at gross...ugh!
 
There have been numerous reports of temperature related shutdowns. Specs say it can be "operated" at up to 95 degrees F, and "nonoperational" (stored) up to 113 degrees F.
There was a class-action lawsuit about this, but it was turned down. I've seen the "your iPad needs to cool down" a few times... but we're in Phoenix.
Tim
 
There was a previous thread about the iPad heating up and failing if left sitting in the sun, either up on the glare shield or on the CP seat. Not sure how the altitude would factor, unless the less dense air at altitude does not conduct the heat away from the unit as efficiently as at lower altitudes.

I've cruised at 11,500, 9,500 and 8,500 with no problems.
 
BillTIZ said:
There was a previous thread about the iPad heating up and failing if left sitting in the sun, either up on the glare shield or on the CP seat.
Click to expand...

This is third hand information I heard from Jeppesen but when EJM was starting their iPad/EFB project they spoke directly with Apple regarding the overheating issue. Apple said it is called "solar flare" and only occurs when the suns rays are 90 degrees perpendicular or thereabouts to the display/screen. If you tilt it a little so the display is not nearly perpendicular to the sun this issue goes away. FWIW.
 
It's an LCD display, is it not? So at very low pressures, liquids tend to boil off a bit.... one might think that prolonged exposure would boil some of the "L"CD off?
 
bbchien said:
It's an LCD display, is it not? So at very low pressures, liquids tend to boil off a bit.... one might think that prolonged exposure would boil some of the "L"CD off?
Click to expand...
The "liquid" part of a LCD is well sealed and nothing is going to boil off. I'm pretty certain the only reason there's a 10000ft (3000meter) altitude limit is because that's a "standard" limitation for consumer electronics. I'm pretty sure an iPad would work in outer space (the 3G connection might be a bit weak) if it was possible to operate a touch screen out there.
 
gismo said:
The "liquid" part of a LCD is well sealed and nothing is going to boil off. I'm pretty certain the only reason there's a 10000ft (3000meter) altitude limit is because that's a "standard" limitation for consumer electronics. I'm pretty sure an iPad would work in outer space (the 3G connection might be a bit weak) if it was possible to operate a touch screen out there.
Click to expand...

This man's got it. Many of the internal components will be spec'ed at 10k ft so that's what Apple slaps on the whole product since they don't want to go to the expense and trouble of verifying that it will work at higher altitudes / lower pressures. It's true that the thinner air will affect cooling, and it'll probably be a bit more susceptible to overheating in the flight levels than it would under the same sunlight conditions at sea level, but if you keep it out of the sun it will be okay.

Taken to the limit, electronics that operate in vacuum often do have substantial difficulties with cooling, to the extent that the designers of some satellites have found it more economical to pressurize the avionics compartment than to use other methods of mitigating the thermal problems. But half the standard air density is miles better than no air at all.
 
dell30rb said:
Not only will it work fine at 11,000 feet but IIRC they did test it for rapid decompression at 40k feet and had no problems there.
Click to expand...


Oooh! I hope I never have to take advantage of it's ability to survive rapid decompression!
 
A guy named Vick, at www.BackCountryPilots.org uses his I-Pad
At 29,000 ft cabin altitude for 6 plus hours at a time.
Don't make the same mistake a lot of the people on that forum did
And assume 29,000 ft cabin altitude was a mistake, it's not,
He flies U-2's.
Dave
 
murphey said:
I was under the impression that the iPad does NOT use rotating disk but SSD (flash drives, like your thumb drives) instead. The reason Apple claims 10K is that most floating head drives don't work that well above that altitude, if at all. SSD has no similar limitation. Apple didn't see any reason to test above 10K because commercial airliners & biz jets are pressurized to 8K.

As I've mentioned on POA before - the Mars rovers use SSD. Consider that altitude limitation.
Click to expand...

Exactly what I was going to say. There is no HD in the iPad or iPhone. There's not reason it shouldn't work at high altitude.
 
Add another variable to the iPad...

If it's completely discharged and you plug it into a charging cable above 10K, the additional heat of charging plus a little direct sunlight, and wimpy thin air cooling, it'll shut down.

Start with it charged or nearly charged and plugged in, no problems usually other than the aforementioned direct sunlight heating issue.

Two sources of significant heat in an iPad. Everyone forgets the internal one.

I try not to charge and fly at the same time.
 
Here is mine on a commercial flight using the internal GPS.
 

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> cooling

Mine over-temp'd & shutdown on a sunny 76F day, when laying face-up on the glareshield. The cabin doors were open.

>> It's an LCD display, is it not?

iPads use IPS displays. LCD is to IPS, what piston is to turbine.
 
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denverpilot said:
Add another variable to the iPad...

If it's completely discharged and you plug it into a charging cable above 10K, the additional heat of charging plus a little direct sunlight, and wimpy thin air cooling, it'll shut down.

Start with it charged or nearly charged and plugged in, no problems usually other than the aforementioned direct sunlight heating issue.

Two sources of significant heat in an iPad. Everyone forgets the internal one.

I try not to charge and fly at the same time.
Click to expand...

We use them in the Gulfstream. We keep them plugged into a power outlet the entire time normally. Once in a while I will use it unplugged. I have never had any issues with the iPad in charge mode while being used at the same time. The cabin altitudes are normally between 6000-7000 feet.
 
LearDriver said:
We use them in the Gulfstream. We keep them plugged into a power outlet the entire time normally. Once in a while I will use it unplugged. I have never had any issues with the iPad in charge mode while being used at the same time. The cabin altitudes are normally between 6000-7000 feet.
Click to expand...

Heck, my house is almost at 6000'... if I couldn't charge it there... :hairraise:
 
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