Grayslake Ice landing

[jpflys]

Looks like a 150 on TV:

February 17, 2009

FROM STNG WIRE REPORTS
No one was injured when a small airplane landed on the ice of Grays Lake early Tuesday evening in north suburban Grayslake.
The single-engine plane began experiencing engine problems and was attempting to land at nearby Campbell Airport when the pilot apparently determined it would not make it to the airport, according to Grayslake Fire Capt. Peter Nowak.
The aircraft landed about 4:30 a.m. on the ice near Route 120 and Lake Street. There were two people aboard, the pilot and one passenger.
"The ice is pretty solid," Nowak said.
Neither person suffered any injuries and the plane sustained no damage, Nowak said.
Emergency crews are no longer on the scene but the pilot is waiting for a mechanic to determine if the plane can be flown off the ice

 

[mikea]

Looks like a 150 on TV:

February 17, 2009

FROM STNG WIRE REPORTS
No one was injured when a small airplane landed on the ice of Grays Lake early Tuesday evening in north suburban Grayslake.
The single-engine plane began experiencing engine problems and was attempting to land at nearby Campbell Airport when the pilot apparently determined it would not make it to the airport, according to Grayslake Fire Capt. Peter Nowak.
The aircraft landed about 4:30 a.m. on the ice near Route 120 and Lake Street. There were two people aboard, the pilot and one passenger.
"The ice is pretty solid," Nowak said.
Neither person suffered any injuries and the plane sustained no damage, Nowak said.
Emergency crews are no longer on the scene but the pilot is waiting for a mechanic to determine if the plane can be flown off the ice

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? This is out my window.

I had no idea.

 

[flyingcheesehead]

ARE YOU KIDDING ME? This is out my window.

I think I heard it take off this morning!

I had no idea.

When I saw the subject, I thought "Mike actually flew today?"

Then I saw it was a 150. Mike wouldn't fit in a 150 any better than I would.

Then I wondered if Mike had some pilot buddy coming to visit him, since this pretty much right across the street from his house! (Mike, how far down is Lake Street?)

Good decision on the part of the pilot.

 

[jpflys]

Mike, watch 7 at ten, Jerry Taft commented "they should fly it off before it melts"

 

[mikea]

When I saw the subject, I thought "Mike actually flew today?"

Then I saw it was a 150. Mike wouldn't fit in a 150 any better than I would.

Then I wondered if Mike had some pilot buddy coming to visit him, since this pretty much right across the street from his house! (Mike, how far down is Lake Street?)

Good decision on the part of the pilot.

Lake Street is the nearest crossstreet. I can watch the traffic light change from my back window and deck.

Yep. Only about 1 1/2 miles to the runway.

So now I realize that the lake is plenty long to land on.

I wouldn't walk on that ice, much less land on it. It was 50 degrees F today.

 

[mikea]

I think I would have seen that. It either took off or sank.

http://www.pioneerlocal.com/grayslake/news/1435923,gr-landing-021709-s1.article

BTW, I did hear a siren at around 4:30PM. I was talking to a co-worker who heard it and thought they were coming for me. I had the shades down so I didn't see anything.

 

[mikea]

Looks like a 150 on TV:
...

It's a 747! N747KA.

There is a great article:

They finally made the "Hero Pilot" connection to Sully. This one didn't sink (yet)!

Pilot Chesley "Sully" Sullenberger recently gained fame for making an emergency landing of his US Airways jet on the Hudson River instead of trying to reach a New York-area airport.

Perhaps it wasn't as dramatic, but the pilot of a one-engine airplane owned by a flight school decided against landing at a small strip in Round Lake Park and touched down on frozen Gray's Lake in the namesake village after engine trouble developed Tuesday.

http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=272841&src=44#storycomments

with great comments! :

posted by choppedliver on Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:23 PM

Good thing it didnt land on round lake, it would probably be on blocks with the tires and engine missing by now....and the teenagers would be drinking alcohol inside of it...

That is very true, BTW.

AFAIK, it's still there. I'll look. We've had 1/4 mi vis with rain and snow today. I wouldn't want to even fly the few miles to Campbell.

So the ice is wet and possibly melting!

 

[ReverendSlappy]

posted by choppedliver on Tue Feb 17, 2009 8:23 PM

Good thing it didnt land on round lake, it would probably be on blocks with the tires and engine missing by now....and the teenagers would be drinking alcohol inside of it...

BWAHAHAHAHAH!! It's funny because it's true!

 

[wildwobby]

I was the last to fly the plane before this incident. It's palwaukee flyer's.

Scary.

 

[ScottM]

I was the last to fly the plane before this incident. It's palwaukee flyer's.

Scary.

Friendly edit.



Any word on what caused the engine problem?

 

[wildwobby]

Friendly edit.



Any word on what caused the engine problem?

Haven't talked to anyone yet. I will share with you when I know.

 

[N801BH]

Geez,,, With an N number like that I would have thought it belonged to Kalitta Air for one of their 747 freighters..

 

[Trapper John]

Geez,,, With an N number like that I would have thought it belonged to Kalitta Air for one of their 747 freighters..

Kalitta's N-numbers tend to end in CK.

Trapper John

 

[flyingcheesehead]

I was the last to fly the plane before this incident. It's palwaukee flyer's.

Scary.

Any word on what caused the engine problem?

I think it must have been Obama's TFR!

 

[mikea]

It's still there. I spotted it (a lot easier in the daytime.)

It's a bit north of the corner, sorta in the eastmost tip of the lake.

 

[ilxlr8]

This craft has a history of engine failure. Well, anyways, that is what the media would say.

Click on the link and read the information under the first picture.

http://members.lycos.co.uk/jacktasker/genaviation.html

 

[ScottM]

This craft has a history of engine failure. Well, anyways, that is what the media would say.l

They certainly could, even though I'll bet the two events are unrelated.

 

[mikea]

This craft has a history of engine failure. Well, anyways, that is what the media would say.

Click on the link and read the information under the first picture.

http://members.lycos.co.uk/jacktasker/genaviation.html

It was repainted since then. You'd think they may have worked on the engine, too.

 

[ScottM]

It was repainted since then. You'd think they must may have worked on the engine, too.

You but do you really think the press would know or even care about that fact?

 

[mikea]

On the first TV reports they said, "A small plane landed on a pond..."

I dunno where I envision the line between "pond" and "lake" is, but I think Gray's Lake is clearly on the "lake" side.

We got ice and snow last might so the lake has a new layer of rough ice and snow. The plane has to have a layer of hard crud on it, too.

 

[ScottM]

On the first TV reports they said, "A small plane landed on a pond..."

I dunno where I envision the line between "pond" and "lake" is, but I think Grays Lake is clearly on the "lake" side.

We got ice and snow last might so the lake has a new layer of rough ice and snow. The plane has to have a layer of hard crud on it, too.

Funny I have been seen in Coast Guard uniform people ask me "what coast do we have to guard in Illinois". I point out that Lake Michigan is a pretty big coast, but they tell me when they here coast they think ocean. I guess it is all relative.

 

[wildwobby]

From what I have heard: A cylinder was misfiring causing the engine to run rough. I don't think it ever quit though. It sounds as if the plane could of made campbell.... but went for the lake instead.

The plane was "unwinged" and towed back

 

[flyingcheesehead]

From what I have heard: A cylinder was misfiring causing the engine to run rough. I don't think it ever quit though. It sounds as if the plane could of made campbell.... but went for the lake instead.

Interesting.

If it was developing enough power, I'd have tried to climb while circling over the lake, until I had enough altitude to have glide range to either Campbell or the lake, and then gone for the airport.

 

[Witmo]

If a valve had stuck, he could have caused more damage by throttling up and trying to climb. I had a valve come loose and the stem came through the head. The engine would have shaken itself apart if I hadn't decreased RPM and landed at the nearest airport even though I knew that airport had no maintenance. I must say I thought at the time I could have continued another five miles to an airport that had a mechanic. I'm glad I didn't try as the parts rattling around could have gotten past the piston into the crankcase and trashed the entire engine.

I'd say he made the right choice--didn't hurt himself or bend the airplane--good job!

 

[flyingcheesehead]

If a valve had stuck, he could have caused more damage by throttling up and trying to climb. I had a valve come loose and the stem came through the head. The engine would have shaken itself apart if I hadn't decreased RPM and landed at the nearest airport even though I knew that airport had no maintenance. I must say I thought at the time I could have continued another five miles to an airport that had a mechanic. I'm glad I didn't try as the parts rattling around could have gotten past the piston into the crankcase and trashed the entire engine.

I'd say he made the right choice--didn't hurt himself or bend the airplane--good job!

If it gets to that point, sure, shut it down - But it's a rental. I don't care if the engine turns itself into a pile of aluminum and steel dust in the process, I'm going to get every bit of potential energy I can out of it to give myself more options, and go from there.

 

[ScottM]

Mike is it still there? It is going to get above freezing for several days this week and may make that current parking spot, um, soft.

 

[gismo]

If it gets to that point, sure, shut it down - But it's a rental. I don't care if the engine turns itself into a pile of aluminum and steel dust in the process, I'm going to get every bit of potential energy I can out of it to give myself more options, and go from there.

If a con rod breaks there's a good chance that the engine will shake badly enough to diminish your ability to control the airplane so unless a climb is needed to reach survivable terrain you might be a lot better off reducing power. That also may provide the opportunity to increase power later in the emergency landing should you need to stretch things a bit. IOW there's no clear answer to the issue of power management after a significant engine problem develops.

 

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

If it gets to that point, sure, shut it down - But it's a rental. I don't care if the engine turns itself into a pile of aluminum and steel dust in the process, I'm going to get every bit of potential energy I can out of it to give myself more options, and go from there.

If it's just the engine. Fine. But if the roughness is being caused by something else (say a broken prop) there is a non-zero probibilty that the engine can be shaken loose from the mounts. That results in enough of a Cg problem that you won't be able to maintain control.

A frozen lake sounds like a decent choice to me. How much of a better option do you need?

 

[gprellwitz]

Wasn't it a student pilot? I think he did a good job, especially since he probably didn't have all the knowledge collectively represented on this board.

 

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

Wasn't it a student pilot? I think he did a good job, especially since he probably didn't have all the knowledge collectively represented on this board.

Per a newspaper article:

Two people were aboard, the pilot and one passenger

So, it's either not a student or it's a student about to get into big trouble...

But in any case, better decision making than a Student pilot I read about in an NTSB report that ran out of gas on final, turned away from the airport, and bailed out (really). Oh- yes he had a 'chute.

 

[gprellwitz]

Per a newspaper article:


So, it's either not a student or it's a student about to get into big trouble...

But in any case, better decision making than a Student pilot I read about in an NTSB report that ran out of gas on final, turned away from the airport, and bailed out (really). Oh- yes he had a 'chute.

Sounds like I misremembered something (or one of the reporters go it wrong, I don't know which is more likely!) Thanks!

 

[flyingcheesehead]

If it's just the engine. Fine. But if the roughness is being caused by something else (say a broken prop) there is a non-zero probibilty that the engine can be shaken loose from the mounts. That results in enough of a Cg problem that you won't be able to maintain control.

It's not that hard to tell the difference between *roughness* in the engine itself, and *vibration* caused by a prop issue. One, you hear more (especially with an ANR headset), the other you feel more. Even on our two Archers, I can tell you which one has the rougher engine, and which one needs its prop balanced.

A frozen lake sounds like a decent choice to me. How much of a better option do you need?

A frozen lake is certainly one of the best options for an emergency landing in many situations. In fact, I asked that on my intro flight (with a 20K+ hour DPE) as we were passing over a white, frozen Lake Mendota.

Two concerns with frozen lakes, though: One is how much snow is on the lake, and how soft. You may dig in and flip over. The other, and much more pertinent in this case, is "How thick is the ice?" Things have been melting like crazy up here until the snowfall we got this weekend, and if the plane goes through the ice, you're in a world of hurt: Potential drowning if you can't find or get through the hole, and even if you do, a probable death from hypothermia unless you find someone who is home within a few minutes.

So, again, if the engine isn't shaking itself crazy, I'm gonna try to get something out of it. I'm not second-guessing this pilot at all because I wasn't in the plane with them and I don't know what their particular symptoms were. It may well have been that in their particular situation it was simply one cylinder not firing and with two aboard a 152 that may have reduced their power enough that they weren't able to climb anyway, in which case the lake was their best bet.

 

[mikea]

Mike is it still there? It is going to get above freezing for several days this week and may make that current parking spot, um, soft.

They towed it out. The party pooper police cheif wouldn't let them fly it out, after the FAA said they coudlnt' outlaw it. (Where have we heard THAT before?)

The owner of the plane wanted to fly it off the lake, but authorities deemed the maneuver too dangerous, considering the close proximity the plane was to homes in the area, McCutheon said.

Police later contacted the FAA to determine if such a move was possible under the current conditions. "We were told that the pilot could fly the plane off the ice, but we did not want to take any chances," McCutheon said.


http://www.pioneerlocal.com/grayslake/news/1439668,gr-plane-021909-s1.article

...
So, it's either not a student or it's a student about to get into big trouble...

According to Grayslake police Cmdr. Matt McCutheon, the Cessna 150 instructional flight carrying two people originated at Chicago Executive Airport in Wheeling.

Maybe not and maybe uh-oh:

Grayslake police Operations Cmdr. Matt McCutcheon said Wednesday initial plans were for the plane to be flown off the ice. He said police didn't endorse the idea.

"We had some concerns because they wanted to repair the plane and fly it out," McCutcheon said. "We were concerned about that because there are homes around the lake."

Authorities said the pilot and a 17-year-old passenger, both from Des Plaines, were uninjured after the plane made the emergency landing on the ice toward the middle of Gray's Lake. The pilot opted for the ice over Campbell Airport in Round Lake Park, about two miles southwest of the lake.

Grayslake police, the FAA and Palatine Flyers declined to identify the pilot and passenger.

Cory said the incident is under FAA investigation. She said the FAA is looking at various aspects under its jurisdiction, such as the pilot's certification and whether flight rules were followed.

http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=273180

 

[Dave Krall CFII]

Simple engine roughness can instantly escalate into severe engine roughness causing mount failure &/or prop failure and consiquent insurmountable aft CG problems. Sounds like the lake was the prudent choice, no visible harm done.