GPS/LPV Approaches

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GarmAspen

Filing Flight Plan
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GarmAspen
New member with a few questions pertaining to GPS approaches. I am looking to update my panel from ILS/NDB capable hardware -- yeah I know, what took you so long? Er, money... :confused:

I am looking at the Garmin GTN radios and I am trying to understand what is required to certify the equipment to fly all GPS type approaches. I have found reference on the web indicating the equipment requires flight testing and dual GPS installations (for LPV). But little as to what that means.

Can someone set me straight? I want to understand what I need to do with respect to working with the avionics shops and what additional requirements that need to be met. Example: do I really need 2 GPS WAAS capable units to fly a LPV approach? Any help would be appreciated.
 
Dual GPS is *NOT* required for anything. A flight test (you must fly a GPS approach) is required as part of any IFR GPS installation. In my case I brought another Navion pilot along to actually fly the thing while me and the avionics installer mashed the buttons on the GPS.
 
flyingron said:
Dual GPS is *NOT* required for anything. A flight test (you must fly a GPS approach) is required as part of any IFR GPS installation. In my case I brought another Navion pilot along to actually fly the thing while me and the avionics installer mashed the buttons on the GPS.
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Thanks for the reply to my question. What sort of documentation is required to verify the installation via the flight test? Avionics logbook entry? Who signs?
 
A single GTN-650 will work for just about everything out there.
 
I thought flight testing went away with the WAAS Garmin's as a part of the STC. ???
 
Yes, you just put the the fact you tested it on such-and-such approach and it worked normally on the stuff attached to the 337.
 
Garm, I am sure there are some here like John Collins and others that can give book, chapter and verse. However, whatever shop you use will know what is required for an approach approved GPS installation. There is paperwork required and the installation has to meet certain criteria as to location and so on. Any descent shop will have all the particulars. But as has been stated you do not need two GPS's.
 
flyingron said:
Dual GPS is *NOT* required for anything. A flight test (you must fly a GPS approach) is required as part of any IFR GPS installation. In my case I brought another Navion pilot along to actually fly the thing while me and the avionics installer mashed the buttons on the GPS.
Click to expand...

Well, they are for RNP AR. :rofl:
 
brywd said:
I thought flight testing went away with the WAAS Garmin's as a part of the STC. ???
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Nope. This is covered in the Garmin Installation Manual. The system, once installed, must be flight tested according to Garmin's instructions and completion of the flight test documented in the 337 (and, IIRC the installation log entry) before the system may be used for IFR operations. The test isn't all that complicated (requires flying like 2-3 GPS approaches and takes less than an hour), but it must be done.
 
Ron Levy said:
Nope. This is covered in the Garmin Installation Manual. The system, once installed, must be flight tested according to Garmin's instructions and completion of the flight test documented in the 337 (and, IIRC the installation log entry) before the system may be used for IFR operations. The test isn't all that complicated (requires flying like 2-3 GPS approaches and takes less than an hour), but it must be done.
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Thanks for the reply. I have been obtaining quotes on the equipment and getting inconsistent answers to the questions I posed here. I suspect the requirement for dual GPS units came as a result of that particular shop wanting to sell me two units. P.T. Barnum may be right, but I'm not one of them.

Do you know if the Garmin installation manual is available online? I would like to read the requirements myself.
 
Yes. Google the words GTN650 and "Installation Manual". You'll find it on a non-Garmin site as a PDF.
 
The following is quoted from the GTN AFMS Limitations section. Depending on the type of aircraft and the intended operations, one or two GPS units are required. For most of us with a single engine aircraft, only a single GPS is required. For those that require a separate soutce of VHF navigation, this is your Nav receiver and the GTN650/750 include one. If you are using your aircraft for remote or oceanic operations, then two GPS units are required for the larger aircraft.

Single engine piston aircraft under 6,000 lbs maximum takeoff weight:
Required Equipment for IFR operations: Single GTN Navigator

Single engine turbine aircraft or multi-engine piston aircraft under 6,000 lbs
maximum takeoff weight:

Required Equipment for IFR operations: Single GTN Navigator plus a second
source of GPS navigation or a separate source of VHF navigation. Operation in remote or oceanic operation requires two sources of GPS navigation.

Aircraft over 6,000 lbs maximum takeoff weight:
Required Equipment for IFR operations: Single GTN Navigator plus a second
source of GPS navigation or a separate source of VHF navigation.
Operation in remote or oceanic operation requires two sources of GPS navigation.
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flyingron said:
Yes. Google the words GTN650 and "Installation Manual". You'll find it on a non-Garmin site as a PDF.
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Thank you! I will take some time to read up on it. Whole new world for me...
 
John Collins said:
The following is quoted from the GTN AFMS Limitations section. Depending on the type of aircraft and the intended operations, one or two GPS units are required. For most of us with a single engine aircraft, only a single GPS is required. For those that require a separate soutce of VHF navigation, this is your Nav receiver and the GTN650/750 include one. If you are using your aircraft for remote or oceanic operations, then two GPS units are required for the larger aircraft.
Click to expand...

Thanks John. Would flying to the Bahamas be considered "oceanic operations"? Could explain why 1 shop felt I needed two.
 
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