Getting behind the airplane

Kaye

Kaye

Line Up and Wait
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Apr 14, 2005
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iPlaneless
Took this week off so I could schedule back-to-back days learning to fly instruments with the new panel…G500/430W. Today started off with low fog, and had to wait until about noonish for JYO to get above minimums. But once it started clearing, it moved out fast, and by the time we were on our way, our destination, HGR, was VFR.

I tried a coupled ILS for the first time to see how the old and new equipment work together (yes, I’m part of the old equipment and it showed). End result…..I got behind the airplane. And I missed the glide slope. Silly me, I went into an immediate chase, but of course the airplane wasn’t configured correctly (remember, I’m behind). Soon, the CFI is tapping the airspeed. Even tho I was right at gear extension speed, I raised the nose, slowed 10 kt, and lowered the gear. My mind was racing as to my next actions when I noticed my hand still resting on the gear lever….good habit! As that’s when I took note the nose gear light wasn’t on…..ah, s***! I raised the gear, slow a little more, and try again…no light. Pushed the test button, light works. Ah, s***! Raised the gear, told tower I had a problem and was breaking off the approach. Thank goodness we’re VFR.

And because we’re VFR, my CFI is being a brat! He’s watching the scenery, TOTALLY ignoring me! I level out, lose a little more speed, and try again…I think I was in denial…still no light. Finally gave up, put the plane back in autopilot, asked the CFI if he would mind watching for traffic, pulled out the checklist, and set everything up….airspeed, flaps, check breaker…..and lower the gear lever one more time (hey, it’s on the check list). Success!!!!!!!

Landed, picked up my clearance back to JYO, uneventful GPS approach back. Even tho I got beat up for getting behind the airplane (I deserved the beating), I did get kudos for managing the gear problem. I think speed with descent played a factor, but not sure. I now need to sit back and think what I would have done in the same situation, but in IMC.
 
When I started flying the 310 I had to go from flying the KLN94/KX155A to learning the 530, plus a different HSI for both and a different panel setup (and having hundreds of hours in the Aztec). Despite having minor familiarity with the 530, it did take me a couple of times to get used to it. This stuff happens, it was good that you got some good practice with it first.

If you really want to have fun, come on up to MHT and we'll go flying. ;)
 
Okay, something's missing for me here. "Check breaker" and then the gear comes down? So your CFI was being a TOTAL bra^H^H^H I mean CFI and popped the breaker on you? I hope that was it, because otherwise I wouldn't be too eager to fly back to home base with an undiagnosed problem like that, and for sure if I did it would stay VFR, with the gear left down the whole way.
 
Kaye, he pulled the breaker on you and then was coy.
You and he need to have a talk. That stuff is NOT productive when your plate overfloweth.
 
bbchien said:
Kaye, he pulled the breaker on you and then was coy.
You and he need to have a talk. That stuff is NOT productive when your plate overfloweth.
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I note your qualification "when your plate overfloweth." Can I infer that it is productive when the pilot has the basics down?

And Kaye, you never clearly stated whether the CFI pulled the breaker (though it sure sounds like it to me [edit: or did until Ron pointed out "nose gear"]) or if you actually had an intermittent equipment failure.
 
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No, the CFI did not pull the breaker....he can't reach it. They're on the side wall next to my left leg.

As for him being a "brat"...it was VFR, I needed to work through it myself. We didn't have an emergency...yet...and I needed to settle myself down, get the airplane in a safe mode to work the problem.

My CFI regularly works in the scenario based training. But I've had myself in a close emergency situation traveling with the husband, and thank goodness for the training, but it's just not the same as the real thing. My reaction of "disbelief" is just plain annoying and unsettling. So I keep up the regular training sessions.
 
azure said:
Okay, something's missing for me here. "Check breaker" and then the gear comes down?
Click to expand...

Yep, you're right. Lever-down, check breaker, flaps, airspeed, lever up. By that time, I basically had myself setup based on memory, and when I reviewed the checklist, and item 1 was gear lever down, I followed the checklist....and was rewarded. :)
 
gprellwitz said:
And Kaye, you never clearly stated whether the CFI pulled the breaker (though it sure sounds like it to me [edit: or did until Ron pointed out "nose gear"]) or if you actually had an intermittent equipment failure.
Click to expand...

It was an intermittent failure, and I've let the owner know.
 
bbchien said:
Kaye, he pulled the breaker on you and then was coy.
You and he need to have a talk. That stuff is NOT productive when your plate overfloweth.
Click to expand...
No, he didn't - you wouldn't get two out of three greens with the breaker pulled on a Trinidad.

And the CFI is VERY good at letting/making you be PIC as if he weren't there, until you ask for his help. Essentially he lets you decide if you want to use him as a crew resource or not. I think this is a good way to work with accomplished pilots.
 
TMetzinger said:
No, he didn't - you wouldn't get two out of three greens with the breaker pulled on a Trinidad.

And the CFI is VERY good at letting/making you be PIC as if he weren't there, until you ask for his help. Essentially he lets you decide if you want to use him as a crew resource or not. I think this is a good way to work with accomplished pilots.
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Tim,

Ray won't help me when I ask, so I've quit asking....well he would in an emergency, we go over that in preflight. Back in a day long ago, I asked too often. That's when he became a lump in the right seat cause I wasn't doing enough of my own thinking. Now if I want help, I look over at him, and if he's looking out the window, I know I won't get a response....the dirtbag. :D
 
Kaye said:
Tim,

Ray won't help me when I ask, so I've quit asking....well he would in an emergency, we go over that in preflight. Back in a day long ago, I asked too often. That's when he became a lump in the right seat cause I wasn't doing enough of my own thinking. Now if I want help, I look over at him, and if he's looking out the window, I know I won't get a response....the dirtbag. :D
Click to expand...

My instructor had a similar technique. It was basically keep me from breaking anything, and otherwise only help if it was clear that I was overloaded and not handling it well. I put the 172 into a slight spin during private training, was correcting for it but got scared, and said "Help?" "Oh, you want me to do something? You're doing fine."

It worked well for me. :)
 
Kaye said:
My reaction of "disbelief" is just plain annoying and unsettling.
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I think you are being too hard on yourself. The reaction of disbelief is pretty normal, I think. What you really want to be careful of is acting too quickly, without thinking it through, and making the situation worse.
 
Mari's right... With the exception of engine failure, fire, or smoke in the cockpit, I can't think of any other emergency in a nonpressurized single that doesn't leave you time to think about it. And it's much better to be slow and thorough than fast and miss something.

I remember being told way back when that the first thing to do when a patient codes is to take your own pulse. Let the adrenaline wash over you and THEN go work the problem(s).

I've noticed that the change in season can sometimes bring about these kinds of issues in retracts - the colder temps affect the clearances and switches that got actuated in warm weather don't quite get it in the cold.
 
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