Get your airspeed up before you try to climb!

Saw that, I also wonder whether he had an aft CG problem. Certainly had directional control issues, may have been prevented from aborting takeoff b/c he was aimed directly at people on the ground.

Just tragic.
 
SCCutler said:
Saw that, I also wonder whether he had an aft CG problem. Certainly had directional control issues, may have been prevented from aborting takeoff b/c he was aimed directly at people on the ground.

Just tragic.
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I was wondering the same thing about aft CG, but it is so hard to get a 182 beyond aft CG (not impossible, but real hard) I think that is unlikely. Looked like a classic short field takeoff that got out of sorts (notice the crab after liftoff?) where the pilot could not get the nose down due to people or huts in front of him.

Just my $.02
 
NC Pilot said:
I was wondering the same thing about aft CG, but it is so hard to get a 182 beyond aft CG (not impossible, but real hard) I think that is unlikely. Looked like a classic short field takeoff that got out of sorts (notice the crab after liftoff?) where the pilot could not get the nose down due to people or huts in front of him.

Just my $.02
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That was my take as well. He held the nose up but it seemed like two things happened: he seems to have lost directional control, and he looked like he was trying to fly out of GE without enough airspeed.
 
It certainly looked like he had a lot of stuff and weight in the back of the plane.

Looks like a real tragedy too. That's really sad.
 
If the pilot had maintained the centerline of the runway, that might not have happened. That s*cks.
 
JRitt said:
It looks like he might have had 20deg of flaps also
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On a 182 that is standard short field technique, or at least it is on mine.
 
A few observations.

1) Seemed like they were In an urgent situation to begin with. I heard some one crying before they even closed the doors on the plane.

2) Looked like some sort of medical flight as they were loading in a cooler and had what appeared to be an O2 or other compressed gas tanks in the back which could have added to and aft CG situation.

3) Someone here must speak spanish! How bout a translation.
 
AdamZ said:
3) Someone here must speak spanish! How bout a translation.
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I speak a little spanish, but it's pretty hard to understand. From what I understood, they really didn't give much information. just that a patient was being transported, and the doctor was preparing the plane for the flight. Then everything went bad. The plane went off course, lost control and "fell." "in an instant, it exploded." The mother, the child, and the doctor were killed, and the pilot is fighting for his life.....typical coverage of a GA accident:rolleyes:

Anyway, I've been browsing this site for a while and found it very helpful. Right now I'm training for my ppl in Norwood, MA, and I have just under 40 hours, but I'll have to wait a bit longer to get my license because I'm still 16.

Maybe someone knows a little more spanish than I do??...:D
 
AdamZ said:
2) Looked like some sort of medical flight as they were loading in a cooler and had what appeared to be an O2 or other compressed gas tanks in the back which could have added to and aft CG situation.
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Yeah a BIG O2 tank is what my initial thoughts were.

That and "What the hell are those people doing in FRONT of the plane taking off..."
 
wenglish said:
Anyway, I've been browsing this site for a while and found it very helpful. Right now I'm training for my ppl in Norwood, MA, and I have just under 40 hours, but I'll have to wait a bit longer to get my license because I'm still 16.
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Will, Not to get off topic. But Welcome to POA I'm sure you will find your time here worthwhile.
 
I watched the video and wondered if it might have been a control-lock problem. Not necessarily the standard lock left in place, but something inhibiting control movement. It just doesn't seem like there was much flying going on.

Dan
 
Dan Smith said:
It just doesn't seem like there was much flying going on.
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All that yawing to try and hold runway centerline wasn't helping (yaw=lots of drag). And, I didn't see any coordinated control inputs when he was trying to get back to centerline. (ailerons looked neutral throughout the takeoff)
 
The resolution is just too low to really tell - I tried to get a hard look at the elevator - it looked to me like they were up which would indicate back pressure on the yoke, but its too hard to be certain.

What a damn shame.
 
A tragedy.

Monday morning QBing from the video is not terrifically useful. But with that said, it looked to me like, despite being pretty out of control getting off the ground, it might have been salvageable. It was SO nose high once it was up, that I assume it simply stalled near the limit of the camera's vision. If he could have gently banked back towards the "runway" while getting the nose down... Maybe? Of course, it MAY have been so tail heavy that there was no way to get the nose down. In which case, the flight was probably doomed from the get go.

Jim G
 
All speculation, but might have been one of those newbie thoughts of trying to back to go up in desperation.
 
To quote the guy who did my primary instruction: "You -can- trade airspeed for altitude, but you first must have something to trade."


NC Pilot said:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZWC2XJYgcJU

It looks like the pilot yanked the Cessna off the ground, probably over gross, then never lowered the nose to pick up the airspeed he needed to climb.

Tragic.
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Just a thought...maybe the pilot didn't set the trim properly and had a full-aft trim configuration ?
That might explain the incomprehensible nose-high attitude (instead of lowering the nose to gain some airspeed)...
 
Armageddon Aviator said:
Just a thought...maybe the pilot didn't set the trim properly and had a full-aft trim configuration ?
That might explain the incomprehensible nose-high attitude (instead of lowering the nose to gain some airspeed)...
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Or aft CG or both, or poor piloting skills, or.........
 
Anthony said:
Or aft CG or both, or poor piloting skills, or.........
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I'm going to take back my cirticism of this pilot until the report (if any there) comes out. Who knows, maybe an engine problem caused it to not develop full power...any number of things. Sad for the families.
 
another thought comes to mind: perhaps the disdraught woman in the right front seat freaked out and interfered with control inputs. notice how badly out of coordination the a/c was at liftoff. it veered right, not left (as one might imagine with poor pilot technique) and was crossed up with left rudder and right wing down. didn't notice much wind either, so i doubt it was a x-wind problem.

another thought is high DA. much of columbia is high plains and it might have been a high/hot/heavy combination.

pretty sad any way you slice it. :(
 
trombair said:
another thought comes to mind: perhaps the disdraught woman in the right front seat freaked out and interfered with control inputs. :(
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:dunno: Possible too.
 
smigaldi said:
Possible but more likely a combo fo the high DA, overloaded well past max gross.... all equals a tragedy.
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Just like when you start looking at the accident reports. One problem can be dealt with. It's when they start to add up that you REALLY get in trouble. (ie. new pilot, at night, bad weather, loaded under-powered aircraft, over water, tired, stressed, and left the lucky rabbits foot at home...)
 
BTW do we know where this flight occured? It would be worth following the investigation, if any takes place. I guess that depends on the country in question.
 
Greebo said:
BTW do we know where this flight occured? It would be worth following the investigation, if any takes place. I guess that depends on the country in question.
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Columbia

The video was presented by Noticas RCN, a news segment from Canal RCN of Colombia

The plane was operated by Patrulla Aérea Colombiana (Colombian Air Patrol), a non-profit organization that helps people with medical assistance on remote places of Colombia.

There was 4 people on board: The pilot and chief of medical staff, another doctor, a little boy recently operated, and the mother of the boy. Just the pilot survived, but he has burnings on 95% of his body and is fighting for his life.

May all they rest in peace. Added on March 21, 2006, 08:19 PM by supersomondoco
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AirBaker said:
Just like when you start looking at the accident reports. One problem can be dealt with. It's when they start to add up that you REALLY get in trouble. (ie. new pilot, at night, bad weather, loaded under-powered aircraft, over water, tired, stressed, and left the lucky rabbits foot at home...)
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I think this may have been said but that O2 cylinder weighs a lot on it own. It is like a person. The pilot should have said no to one of the parents, even though they are grieving safety has to come first. Trying to be nice may have ended up getting them killed.
 
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