Franklin Engines

[BurtM]

I posted a while back about my partnership. Just in case we go our separate ways, there are a couple of planes I'm interested in and they tend to be powered by Franklin engines.

First is the older Maule M-4. Seems to me to be like a Pacer on steroids. Some have Continental IO-360s, others have the 220 HP Franklin

Second is the Stinson 108. They have a smaller (165 HP?) Franklin as far as I can tell.

I also have seen C170s and maybe even some 175s that were converted to Franklins probably many years ago.

I know that the original Franklin Co. went out of business years and years ago and that someone transferred manufacture of the Franklin to Poland. But from what I can gather, the Poland thing ended some time ago when some big company bought some other company, or some such thing.

I've read about some new company in either NC or SC buying out the regular sources of Franklin parts and intending to manufacture new Franklin engines. Is that for real?

I don't want to buy something and rely upon a yet to be proven new company. I also don't want to get stuck with an orphan engine where I can't buy a good crank or case halves if something goes really wrong. Buying a yellow-tagged crank off eBay is not something I want to get into.

What's the real deal with these Franklins?

 

[Sac Arrow]

My guess is a Franklin can be had if you have enough Benjamins.

 

[BiffJ]

I guess you just have to decide if you want to be chasing parts or flying. It seems the Franklins don't have much support anymore despite efforts to the contrary. I don't have much time behind them so maybe others have better info. I never had any issues with them as far as flying but I've replaced parts on lycomings and continentals and you will need parts for the franklin. If you can't get them you're screwed.

Frank

 

[Tom-D]

I posted a while back about my partnership. Just in case we go our separate ways, there are a couple of planes I'm interested in and they tend to be powered by Franklin engines.

First is the older Maule M-4. Seems to me to be like a Pacer on steroids. Some have Continental IO-360s, others have the 220 HP Franklin
See the TSDS for the engines for the M4. there are several engines listed that can be used up to and including the 0540 at 235 horse.

Second is the Stinson 108. They have a smaller (165 HP?) Franklin as far as I can tell.
They had two varieties of Franklin engines the 150 horse light case, and the 165 horse heavy case, stay away from the light cases. and they are the same engine only rated at different RPM,

I also have seen C170s and maybe even some 175s that were converted to Franklins probably many years ago.

No conversion needed, the Franklin was an alternate engine for the C-145-A

I know that the original Franklin Co. went out of business years and years ago and that someone transferred manufacture of the Franklin to Poland. But from what I can gather, the Poland thing ended some time ago when some big company bought some other company, or some such thing.

I've read about some new company in either NC or SC buying out the regular sources of Franklin parts and intending to manufacture new Franklin engines. Is that for real?

I don't want to buy something and rely upon a yet to be proven new company. I also don't want to get stuck with an orphan engine where I can't buy a good crank or case halves if something goes really wrong. Buying a yellow-tagged crank off eBay is not something I want to get into.

What's the real deal with these Franklins?

parts are the real problem with the old Franklin engines, I'd simply look at an STC upgrade for any aircraft that I would want to buy, then run the frank until you didn't trust it and then swap.

 

[BurtM]

I guess you just have to decide if you want to be chasing parts or flying. It seems the Franklins don't have much support anymore despite efforts to the contrary. I don't have much time behind them so maybe others have better info. I never had any issues with them as far as flying but I've replaced parts on lycomings and continentals and you will need parts for the franklin. If you can't get them you're screwed.

Frank

See, that's exactly the thing.

There are people out there that love their Franklin. But I would suspect they've never had to go crank-shopping, either.

But there are orphaned Continentals and Lycomings, too. There are a gazillion 172s still flying with O-300s, but you can't buy new cylinders from Continental, you have to buy Millenium brand or some such thing. But you're not going to get a new crank from Continental, either.

Just trying to get a feel for how likely it is that I'm going to end up scrapping a perfectly good AC for lack of an engine. Jet operators do it all the time, but their money's not coming out of their monthly discretionary fund, either.

 

[Tom-D]

See, that's exactly the thing.

There are people out there that love their Franklin. But I would suspect they've never had to go crank-shopping, either.

Cranks are an easy do, I have 3, I'll sell any of the 3 for $10K

But there are orphaned Continentals and Lycomings, too. There are a gazillion 172s still flying with O-300s, but you can't buy new cylinders from Continental,

Yes you can.

you have to buy Millenium brand or some such thing. But you're not going to get a new crank from Continental, either.

nope, you are right there.but we can grind to .010 under and fit to superior M10 bearings.

Just trying to get a feel for how likely it is that I'm going to end up scrapping a perfectly good AC for lack of an engine.

Never happen, that is what STCs are all about.


Jet operators do it all the time, but their money's not coming out of their monthly discretionary fund, either.

Before you buy any Franklin you check the logs, if it was rebuilt by the Franklin engine club run like the wind.

I know where there is a very nice flying C-170-B for sale with a Franklin 165 that I built that runs sweet, and it is for sale.

 

[BurtM]

Before you buy any Franklin you check the logs, if it was rebuilt by the Franklin engine club run like the wind.

I heard there was something about defective bearings associated with that deal, thanks for the warning.

Cranks are an easy do, I have 3, I'll sell any of the 3 for $10K

Is that all 3 for $ 10k or one for $3,333?

Anyhoo, if I have a Franklin with a bad case, can I send it to Divco in OK, who can magically fix any Lyc or Conti crankcase problem no matter what's wrong with it for an everyday working man's price?

 

[AdamZ]

I guess you just have to decide if you want to be chasing parts or flying. It seems the Franklins don't have much support anymore despite efforts to the contrary. I don't have much time behind them so maybe others have better info. I never had any issues with them as far as flying but I've replaced parts on lycomings and continentals and you will need parts for the franklin. If you can't get them you're screwed.

Frank

Exactly the reason I passed on a 175 I was seriously considering. Nice plane, but I saw all the guys on the 175 board and others scrounging for parts. For some thats fine but it just wasn't for me. Lots of those planes with orphaned parts are good planes and for the right owner can be a super deal.

 

[Tom-D]

Is that all 3 for $ 10k or one for $3,333?

Anyhoo, if I have a Franklin with a bad case, can I send it to Divco in OK, who can magically fix any Lyc or Conti crankcase problem no matter what's wrong with it for an everyday working man's price?
[/B][/COLOR]

Actually a Franklin Crank in good condition is worth more than $10K

I send the last case I had repaired to Chuck Ney. He ain't cheap, but he is the best.

I do not use Divco.

 

[NineThreeKilo]

Well as someone who flys a franklin engine in my personal plane, I havent had issues with it, had a few things I replaced over the years, no biggie (look up the Stinson group on yahoo), I've always been able to locate parts if needed, mine doesnt loose a drip of oil, smooth as silk.

I debated swapping a 540 in, however from what I gathered it takes the light feeling out of the bird on landing (one of the things I like), so I have no desire whatsoever to get rid of mine.


...of course your mileage may vary

 

[Skylane81E]

I've heard rumors that US made franklin engine parts are coming.

 

[Tim]

Before you buy any Franklin you check the logs, if it was rebuilt by the Franklin engine club run like the wind.

I know where there is a very nice flying C-170-B for sale with a Franklin 165 that I built that runs sweet, and it is for sale.

Oh hell I didn't know he was selling it!

 

[Tom-D]

Oh hell I didn't know he was selling it!

Last I knew, when I talked to him while he was enroute Ut.