Foreflight vs Garmin Aera 560

SixPapaCharlie

SixPapaCharlie

May the force be with you
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I barely know my 560. I have spent maybe 2 hours with it but I am not crazy at all about the interface and graphics.

Is there anything it will do that I cannot do with foreflight that might be of great value?
I am thinking of selling the 560 once I get the stratus setup but maybe some of you that know these devices much better can say "NO!!! you will be loosing this function that you are unaware of!"

I am looking at you @Ravioli I know you use one of these things or something similar.

I am guessing it does a lot but it looks like the Atari 2600 graphics so I find myself not wanting to look at it.
 
@SixPapaCharlie - I thought it was rigged to drive your autopilot. Can't do that with a tablet. That alone is worth it.

I have the 696 which is a bit larger. It drives the DG of my stand-by flight instruments.
 
Ravioli said:
@SixPapaCharlie - I thought it was rigged to drive your autopilot. Can't do that with a tablet. That alone is worth it.

I have the 696 which is a bit larger. It drives the DG of my stand-by flight instruments.
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It is not setup to do so but he said it would be simple to hook em up. I'm not sure if I care enough to have someone couple it unless it's super cheap to do
 
That is exactly why I kept my 500..
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
It is not setup to do so but he said it would be simple to hook em up. I'm not sure if I care enough to have someone couple it unless it's super cheap to do
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Yep. He's an airplane owner now. :)
 
jsstevens said:
Yep. He's an airplane owner now. :)
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Planes have a unique issue in that you have to have a MX do most stuff.
ON a car, you can try anything yourself.

No I have to add 8 hrs @100/hr to just about anything I want done.

no fair
 
SixPapaCharlie said:
Planes have a unique issue in that you have to have a MX do most stuff.
ON a car, you can try anything yourself.

No I have to add 8 hrs @100/hr to just about anything I want done.

no fair
Click to expand...

Oh I get it. And they're not exactly state of the art. In fact, they're mostly dirt simple. But as Gordon Baxter put it "Pulling off to the side of the road in a small airplane will get your name in the papers." So little things can bite you bad.

Anyway, you have a very nice looking plane and appear to be having a ball with it. Good on ya.

John
 
I have an Aera 510 front and center while I run Garmin Pilot on a tablet and also on an iPhone. Definitely overkill but the Aera (which includes XM radio only, I killed the weather in favor of free ADS-B) is and always has been a rock solid performer. Using GP on other devices nets me more overall information such as best runway to use, headwind versus xwind when using that runway, etc. In addition, the glare on my droid tablet makes it sometimes unreadable where I've never had that issue using the Aera.

Also, the GP apps occasionally crash, or the device needs rebooted. That has never happened on my Garmin. A week ago I called GP support because my iPhone 7 was constantly losing it's BT connectivity to the GDL39 on the glareshield. He's like "have you forgotten your BT connection, rebooted your phone and repaired?" I hadn't. DUH!
 
so, is it mine? let me know when to send dkpics. I mean, on top of the ones I already sent.
 
"Children of the Magenta" . . . . Why do you need (uncertified) handheld GPS to fly? Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware? Sure, it helps with situational awareness, especially if it shows weather, but you shouldn't try to get close to any weather you can't see without real-time input (Stormscope is real time; eyeballs out the window are related time; XM and ADS-B weather are not--the time stamp in the corner is when the update was transmitted, but it can be 10-15 minutes old by then).

And I'm no old timer flying since 4 way courses, I got my PPL in 2007. Apps on a tablet are nice to have, and fun to play with; they are great for preflight planning; but I'd never bet my life depending on one in the air . . . . Does "beta tester" ring any bells?
 
Hank S said:
"Children of the Magenta" . . . . Why do you need (uncertified) handheld GPS to fly? Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware? Sure, it helps with situational awareness, especially if it shows weather, but you shouldn't try to get close to any weather you can't see without real-time input (Stormscope is real time; eyeballs out the window are related time; XM and ADS-B weather are not--the time stamp in the corner is when the update was transmitted, but it can be 10-15 minutes old by then).

And I'm no old timer flying since 4 way courses, I got my PPL in 2007. Apps on a tablet are nice to have, and fun to play with; they are great for preflight planning; but I'd never bet my life depending on one in the air . . . . Does "beta tester" ring any bells?
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Yes, XM and ADS-B weather is delayed, but it is still super helpful to get the big picture and to see areas of precipitation. As long as one doesn't try to sneak through between thunderstorm cells, the delay is no factor. What about being able to receive updated METAR, TAF, Airmets and Sigmets while enroute? I don't think you get this with a stormscope.

We are (very) close to Class Bravo, the GPS certainly helps with not busting it. A little north us, the are also not too many distinct features in the landscape, which are useful for navigation, unless one wants to follow roads. Good luck, with finding this small airport, 300 nm north, in the middle of the woods, without a GPS. Yes, this would be a fun challenge, but what if one just want to get there?

What about being able to easily look up frequencies while enroute? Or if one decides to go paperless?
What if you have technical difficulties and have to find the closest airport NOW, possibly including runway length, wind conditions and frequencies? Many airports are pretty hard to find, particularly under stress. Most pilots would also have a very hard time finding their position on a sectional, once they are lost.

IMHO, it doesn't make much sense to believe that a paper chart and good old pilotage are the never failing magic bullet, while using an iPad and particularly a purpose made portable Garmin GPS for navigation is almost reckless.
 
For the average Aera user we don't navigate through the pages enough to be fluent. Say you're ducking under some weather and want to see where obstructions like towers are. Which unit is better? For me? The iPad and either Foreflight or Garmin Pilot is really simple to select obstacles. It's intuitive and quick and can be done in a stressful situation. On the Aera? Not even close. I have to fumble finger through the options to try to find what I'm looking for. Which has the better chance of being loaded with the latest chart updates? For me? The iDevice, without question. Mine get Foreflight and GP updates all the time. Some guys ask about the utility of iPhones with the pilot apps. I rarely carry my iPad but always have my iPhone. My iPhone 7+ screen is about the same size as the Aera but has much better definition for moving maps.
 
eman1200 said:
^^^ sigh, there's always one in the crowd........
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Make that two! My disdain for tablets is well documented. Dedicated aviation handhelds are the next best thing to paper.
 
Ravioli said:
Make that two! My disdain for tablets is well documented. Dedicated aviation handhelds are the next best thing to paper.
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Hardly. You do realize Hank S was speaking out against portables in general (tablets and other portable gps units).
 
Hank S said:
"Children of the Magenta" . . . . Why do you need (uncertified) handheld GPS to fly? Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware? Sure, it helps with situational awareness, especially if it shows weather, but you shouldn't try to get close to any weather you can't see without real-time input (Stormscope is real time; eyeballs out the window are related time; XM and ADS-B weather are not--the time stamp in the corner is when the update was transmitted, but it can be 10-15 minutes old by then).

And I'm no old timer flying since 4 way courses, I got my PPL in 2007. Apps on a tablet are nice to have, and fun to play with; they are great for preflight planning; but I'd never bet my life depending on one in the air . . . . Does "beta tester" ring any bells?
Click to expand...
Quite a broad brush you paint with.
 
Fearless Tower said:
Hardly. You do realize Hank S was speaking out against portables in general (tablets and other portable gps units).
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",,,Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware?..." and " Apps on a tablet are nice to have, and fun to play with..."

Yah, I agree with those statements.
 
Ravioli said:
",,,Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware?..." and " Apps on a tablet are nice to have, and fun to play with..."

Yah, I agree with those statements.
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A Garmin Aera is also non certified consumer grade hardware.
 
Don't like it? Don't buy it. Your personal unwillingness to adopt new technology doesn't mean it isn't good.
 
Fearless Tower said:
A Garmin Aera is also non certified consumer grade hardware.
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BUT... it is a dedicated aviation handheld and as I originally said "dedicated aviation handhelds are the next best thing to paper."

So, since this apparently was not clear, in rank order:
Paper
Dedicated aviation handheld
tablets and their associated "apps"
 
Whatever it is, it works better if its attached to the panel. IN the panel, always the same place, no chords in the cockpit. OK, maybe one neat one.
 
Ravioli said:
BUT... it is a dedicated aviation handheld and as I originally said "dedicated aviation handhelds are the next best thing to paper."

So, since this apparently was not clear, in rank order:
Paper
Dedicated aviation handheld
tablets and their associated "apps"
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You forgot "approved panel mounted GPS"
 
Hank S said:
You forgot "approved panel mounted GPS"
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Wasn't part of the discussion and certainly hasn't been "forgotten". I've got 430W in two planes and 430 in the third (WAAS upgrade and 2020 compliance planned for Q1 2018 on that one).
 
I would like the Garmin better if it used regular charts and not the goofy interface it has. For flight has charts that we're all used to seeing that represent what was on paper like the paper I learn to fly with so using the foreflight is just like using electronic paper. It's like paper 2.0. I could use pencil 1.0 and paper 1.0 and draw a line but then I have to use eraser 1.0 if I change my mind. With paper 2.0 and finger as pencil 2.0 I have more options so I'm still very old school I'm just using the 2.0 version of Old School.
 
Hank S said:
"Children of the Magenta" . . . . Why do you need (uncertified) handheld GPS to fly? Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware? Sure, it helps with situational awareness, especially if it shows weather, but you shouldn't try to get close to any weather you can't see without real-time input (Stormscope is real time; eyeballs out the window are related time; XM and ADS-B weather are not--the time stamp in the corner is when the update was transmitted, but it can be 10-15 minutes old by then).

And I'm no old timer flying since 4 way courses, I got my PPL in 2007. Apps on a tablet are nice to have, and fun to play with; they are great for preflight planning; but I'd never bet my life depending on one in the air . . . . Does "beta tester" ring any bells?
Click to expand...

If you do any serious long distance cross country, especially in the summer, and you try XM weather you won't keep making the silly statement about it you made above. Unless you happen to be fortunate enough to have weather radar and a Stormscope in your panel. ;)
 
Ravioli said:
Make that two! My disdain for tablets is well documented. Dedicated aviation handhelds are the next best thing to paper.
Click to expand...

Yes, and some people prefer raspberries over strawberries...
 
Based on what I have heard from others, the biggest downside to the iPad apps are 1)sometimes overheating and shutdown of the iPad, and 2) difficult to read in bright sunlight. The dedicated portables from Garmin don't suffer from these issues, but like you said, he screen is smaller and the charts look different. I think either option is okay, it just depends on what is more important to you. Personally, I use a Garmin portable and paper, just because that is what I prefer, not because I am a magenta line antagonist.
 
Hank S said:
"Children of the Magenta" . . . . Why do you need (uncertified) handheld GPS to fly? Especially on untested, consumer-grade hardware?
Click to expand...

I'll tell you exactly why...when I flew form Florida to CA having dang near real time weather at my fingertips on my Starus and iPad allowed me to divert and manage my flight path a helluv a lot more efficiently beyond my preflight planning for each leg. That technology easily saved me a full day of not being grounded waiting for various systems to pass and adjusting my route in real time as conditions were developing ahead.

Some us us actually travel with our planes and use them for things more mission critical than zipping around cow pastures in the middle of flatland America and having that technology makes travel a lot more efficient if applied properly.

Using technology does not meany you can ONLY use that technology...people make it sound like if you use a tablet all other skills are void and null. SMH.

But then again...if you have to ask your kids or grandkids for help with your phone...then yeah, probably not the technology for you.
 
GRG55 said:
If you do any serious long distance cross country, especially in the summer, and you try XM weather you won't keep making the silly statement about it you made above. Unless you happen to be fortunate enough to have weather radar and a Stormscope in your panel. ;)
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Exactly. I use XM and ADS-B weather to avoid the nasty stuff....I don't use it to pick my way through widespread t-storms.
 
I use both, Aera 560 and Foreflight. Aera can run on ship's power, iPad...not so much. Aera is quick and easy, especially finding "nearest" ARTCC, FSS, airports with wx, VOR, NDB (yes, I still use/like ADF), etc. and it won't overheat. Foreflight/iPad is great for navigating and seeing wx, but the battery can die on a long xc or it will overheat at the worst time.
 
The big reason to keep the Aera is panel redundancy. If you have it on when you are flying in IMC or IMC like conditions and you suddenly lose your panel, the Aera may be your last chance. An iPad really can't serve that purpose unless you have it mounted, Stratused and ready to go. If it's in your lap, it's going to be too late. Same thing if for some reason one of your instruments starts lying to you (e.g. a pitot failure). You'll at least have GPS ground speed on the Aera in your scan. If you don't need or want the redundancy than an iPad is way more useful.

This conversation about XM in the cockpit is ridiculous. Unless you are a VFR only pilot the cost of flying with satellite weather is so low now that you'd be a fool to fly without it. I have onboard weather, Stormscope and XM in my plane. It's suicidal to go near convection without onboard weather unless 100% VMC but at the same time I use XM all the time in the air to figure out if and when I need to go around stuff, to watch weather develop and see what my destination is looking like.
 
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