Ford's Liberators

gkainz

gkainz

Final Approach
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Greg Kainz
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got this in an email today.
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B-24 Liberators Ford was building for the ARMY at the rate of one every 55 MINUTES!! A little bit of history for aviation buffs.This was BEFORE Pearl Harbor!

Ford's B-24 Bomber Plant at Willow Run, Mich. Henry Ford was determined that he could mass produce bombers just as he had done with cars. He built the Willow Run assembly plant and proved it.

It was the world's largest building under one roof. This film will absolutely blow you away - one B-24 every 55 minutes.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/iKlt6rNciTo?rel=0.
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But it was Sept 1942 before the first plane rolled off the line, and it wasn't until 1944 that the line really started rolling. There was even a congressional investigation into it in 1943.
 
That's where my mom worked during the war.
 
I have a book called Willow Run-Colossus of American Industry. The plant and airport construction facts and figures are astounding. It took just three months to install hundreds of miles of clay pipe subsoil drain systems and pour over seven miles of runways and taxiways.

The entire scheme from farmland to bombers flying away dozens at a time is fascinating.

It's a really good book.

http://www.amazon.com/Willow-Run-Colossus-American-Industry/dp/0964720531
 
My uncle bailed out of one over polesti thru the nose gear door, along with the pilot. Just after they jumped, it blew up. They were the only ones that made it. He spent a year as a POW, went on to fly in RB50s , B47s, B52s, mountain home and Barksdale. Retired as light col. Did 33 years total.
 
It was amazing how these industry's changed over and built everything from radial engines to bombers, fighters, etc. Harry Truman, then a senator, took it upon himself to tour many of these factory's and found a lot of graft and corruption, stealing from the tax payer, on and on. He was so successful that Roosevelt claimed later that he had ordered it done. See if you can find a senator today who will do this at any supplier, especially at the F35 debacle. They are all on the take big time.
 
gkainz said:
got this in an email today.
----------------------------------------
B-24 Liberators Ford was building for the ARMY at the rate of one every 55 MINUTES!! A little bit of history for aviation buffs.This was BEFORE Pearl Harbor!

Ford's B-24 Bomber Plant at Willow Run, Mich. Henry Ford was determined that he could mass produce bombers just as he had done with cars. He built the Willow Run assembly plant and proved it.

It was the world's largest building under one roof. This film will absolutely blow you away - one B-24 every 55 minutes.

http://www.youtube.com/embed/iKlt6rNciTo?rel=0.
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Really liked it. Thanks for posting.
 
Another fun thing to investigate are the Liberty ships. At peak production, it took only 42 days on average to build these 440ft cargo ships. Between the differenct shipyards, three a day were coming off the production lines.

American manufacturing might won WWII. Where are we now? Doesn't look good. :(
 
Bill Jennings said:
American manufacturing might won WWII. Where are we now? Doesn't look good. :(
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We've come a long way....in the wrong direction. I was just commenting this week at one of our dry dock maintenance meetings as the contractors pointed fingers and hemmed and hawed over repairs needed for our 5 year boiler inspection....YORKTOWN would never have made it to the Battle of Midway under our current maintenance system.
 
The video hypes "one out the door every 55 minutes" or similar, but I'm curious - anyone know total build time from start to out the door once they were in full production mode?
 
gkainz said:
The video hypes "one out the door every 55 minutes" or similar, but I'm curious - anyone know total build time from start to out the door once they were in full production mode?
Click to expand...

My guess from looking at the stations in the plant is 4-5 days to assemble.
 
You can't send millions of jobs overseas and expect to maintain this type of know how. This was in many cases , father teaching son how to do a specific job. The chain is broken. The Chinese even make our uniforms!
 
Bill Jennings said:
Another fun thing to investigate are the Liberty ships. At peak production, it took only 42 days on average to build these 440ft cargo ships. Between the differenct shipyards, three a day were coming off the production lines.

American manufacturing might won WWII. Where are we now? Doesn't look good. :(
Click to expand...

The Liberty ships were also the basis for escort carriers (CVE). I know that the CASABLANCA class were built on the hulls of "Kaiser's Koffins" (my grandfather was aboard one), and possibly others.
 
SoloEqs said:
The Liberty ships were also the basis for escort carriers (CVE). I know that the CASABLANCA class were built on the hulls of "Kaiser's Koffins" (my grandfather was aboard one), and possibly others.
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Cool, I will investigate further, I've not heard or read of these baby carriers and their roles in the war.
 
Bill Jennings said:
Cool, I will investigate further, I've not heard or read of these baby carriers and their roles in the war.
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Try find Dan Gallery's book, U-505. He commanded an escort carrier during the first capture of an enemy warship since the War of 1812.

He was glad his carrier was assigned to the Atlantic instead of the Pacific; in the war against Japan, his ship would have been used mostly to transport airplanes for the big carriers. In the Atlantic, he commanded an antisubmarine task group centered around his ship, USS Guadalcanal.

Writes well, too....

Ron Wanttaja
 
Speaking of Liberty Ships - "Action in the North Atlantic" is a real hoot.

According to the (propaganda) movie the Liberty ship was fast, maneuverable, comfortable, and capable of taking on the Luftwaffe and sinking submarines that would pass up a whole convoy of tankers and other ships just to get the Liberty ship...

 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
Speaking of Liberty Ships - "Action in the North Atlantic" is a real hoot.

According to the (propaganda) movie the Liberty ship was fast, maneuverable, comfortable, and capable of taking on the Luftwaffe and sinking submarines that would pass up a whole convoy of tankers and other ships just to get the Liberty ship...

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8-10 kts is fast? :dunno:
 
Henning said:
Way back I ran with a guy who ran one during the war, said it was 11kts at flank speed, typically the convoys would make between 6 & 10 kts depending on conditions.
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That's one slow boat to Blighty.
 
Liberty ships were built very quickly ( henry kaiser)hence some notable failures. Some came apart in rough seas in the North Atlantic due to poor welds which is how they were held together. If I remember correctly, after the war most were pretty quickly scrapped. Henry was thought to be a genius , made big money, and after the war tried building cars. The kaiser- Fraziers were a disaster. Partly due to the big three making it difficult for him to get raw products, etc.
 
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Jimmy cooper said:
Liberty ships were built very quickly ( henry kaiser)hence some notable failures. Some came apart in rough seas in the North Atlantic due to poor welds which is how they were held together. If I remember correctly, after the war most were pretty quickly scrapped. Henry was thought to be a genius , made big money, and after the war tried building cars. The kaiser- Fraziers were a disaster. Partly due to the big three making it difficult for him to get raw products, etc.
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However, the health insurance company he built for his shipyards still exists today as Kaiser Permanente.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Liberty ships were built very quickly ( henry kaiser)hence some notable failures. Some came apart in rough seas in the North Atlantic due to poor welds which is how they were held together. If I remember correctly, after the war most were pretty quickly scrapped. Henry was thought to be a genius , made big money, and after the war tried building cars. The kaiser- Fraziers were a disaster. Partly due to the big three making it difficult for him to get raw products, etc.
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As a former merchant mariner, I can say that much of what you just posted is simply untrue.

First, the earlier structural failures were not due to welds, but square edges on hatch comings. Very similar to the structural issues with the British Comet airliners in their early days where stress was pinpointed at the corners of square windows. As the ship flexed at sea, the stress was concentrated at the square hatch corners and that is where the structural failures were occurring. They later modified the hatch comings with rounded edges to better distribute the stress.

Second, they most definitely did not quickly scrap them after the war. Like military aircraft, surplus liberty ships and T2 tankers were in abundance and were sold cheap to anyone who wanted to start up a shipping company. This actually seriously set back the US Flag merchant marine because we were largely using these old tubs well into the 60s and even 70s whereas most other seagoing nations had to rebuild their merchant fleets from scratch after the war.
 
Fearless Tower said:
As a former merchant mariner, I can say that much of what you just posted is simply untrue.

First, the earlier structural failures were not due to welds, but square edges on hatch comings. Very similar to the structural issues with the British Comet airliners in their early days where stress was pinpointed at the corners of square windows. As the ship flexed at sea, the stress was concentrated at the square hatch corners and that is where the structural failures were occurring. They later modified the hatch comings with rounded edges to better distribute the stress.

Second, they most definitely did not quickly scrap them after the war. Like military aircraft, surplus liberty ships and T2 tankers were in abundance and were sold cheap to anyone who wanted to start up a shipping company. This actually seriously set back the US Flag merchant marine because we were largely using these old tubs well into the 60s and even 70s whereas most other seagoing nations had to rebuild their merchant fleets from scratch after the war.
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Aristotle Onasis made his fortune with old T-2s.
 
Excerpt from janes I read years ago. What bearing building ships -cars verses an insurance company has to do with it escapes me. I doubt onnasis was much of a safety freak or for that matter any third rate shipping company. I was aware that hatch covers brought down the Edmund Fitzgerald but not the liberty ships. They were an emergency answer to the Germans sinking so many ships with u boats. Not meant for long time use, cheaply built. For the purpose they were built, they worked.
 
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Henning said:
Aristotle Onasis made his fortune with old T-2s.
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I didn't say no one made money with them, just that as a whole, it set back the US a Flag fleet in comparison with the rest of the world.

There was at least one US Flag shipping company that was still running some T2s in 2000. Knew a few guys that sailed with them. Pretty sure the Coast Guard shut them down shortly after.
 
Fearless Tower said:
I didn't say no one made money with them, just that as a whole, it set back the US a Flag fleet in comparison with the rest of the world.

There was at least one US Flag shipping company that was still running some T2s in 2000. Knew a few guys that sailed with them. Pretty sure the Coast Guard shut them down shortly after.
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I wasn't arguing the point, just pointing out one of the instruments of making it so.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
Excerpt from janes I read years ago. What bearing building ships -cars verses an insurance company has to do with it escapes me. I doubt onnasis was much of a safety freak or for that matter any third rate shipping company.
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You brought up Kaiser's future business acumen in a questionable light and pointed out a failure, I pointed out a success.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
He was better at selling fear than building cars that's for sure.
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Fear is the greatest selling tool ever, its been selling religion for thousands of years, its the main marketing tool of government and the military industrial complex today. It's the basis of everything in our economy.
 
Jimmy cooper said:
He was better at selling fear than building cars that's for sure.
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Everybody has their successes and failures. Obviously for Kaiser, cars was not his.

Henry Ford was great at mass production, but as a human being, he was a real a-hole.
 
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