Flying with big boys. Plus, few Class C questions

Meanee

Line Up and Wait
Joined
Aug 28, 2011
Messages
521
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Display Name

Display name:
Meanee
About a week ago, I did my required night cross country. A very nice experience, I must say. More stable air, easier to spot planes and airports. Practiced VOR to VOR hopping.

Most of my training is done in uncontrolled airport right under New York's Class B. So, I generally avoid talking to NY Approach.

My 2nd landing (1st was a fuel stop) was at KABE. It's a Class C airport. I flew there few times before with my CFI and things were easy. 20nm outside establish squawk and radar contact, airport in sight - switch to tower (with Approach directing me to). This time it was a little bit different.

About 20nm away, I listened to current ATIS at KABE, and wrote down the information. Switched to approach control, announced myself. Approach gave me a squawk code, and I continued in. While on the same frequency as approach, I heard another aircraft. Callsign was "Charter 1234" (don't remember the numbers, but it's not important. My previous experience with KABE tells me it's probably a CRJ or some sort of a bizjet. So, I heard that Charter requested runway 6. VFR runway 24 was in use and winds were 300/10. Approach had me doing somewhat of a holding pattern, and asked me to report Airbus in sight. That was the charter aircraft. First time I am sharing the same airspace with something of that size. I was asked to switch over to tower, got cleared for the option on 24 and was cautioned about wake turbulence. Did a touch and go, and off I went to my 3rd landing.

So here are the observations, and few questions.
First, approach never told me "Radar Contact". When I asked my CFI if I should give them a polite reminder, he said that it's not necessary. I could assume that radar contact was established and I am ok to enter the Class C. If there was a problem, he would turn me away. Was he correct? I was under assumption that Class C requires permission from approach

The Airbus requested runway 6 and to my knowledge, did not change that intention. Tower cautioned me about wake turbulence. My instructor was certain that Airbus landed on 24. It was hard to see him once he was mixed together with city lights, but I am sure he kept his original intention of landing on 6. But in that case, wake turbulence should not matter much on approach, while CFI told me to stay to the right of the runway, to let the wind push wake turbulence away.

And the last thing. I was told by tower to proceed on course and contact departure when I took off. I thought that it means that I should keep my current course until told otherwise. And my CFI told me that I should go to the left, towards my next checkpoint.

So... any insights? I trust my CFI, but I would like to hear from others.
 
Hmmm, some questions are easy.

For Charlie airspace, once atc uses your call sign in response to your call then you are okay entering their airspace unless they specifically tell you to stay away. Atc does have to be the controlling agency ( approach instead of center in most if not all cases). Radar contact is not required.

For on course, once you hear that then you should do whatever it is you told them you were going to do.

As for what the 'bus did and what you should have done, I have no idea.

Kinda fun to go to the big airport every now and then, isn't it? :)
 
Last edited:
I thought that it means that I should keep my current course until told otherwise
If they want you to keep your current course after taking off, you'll be instructed "maintain runway heading until (altitude or advised)". In your case, "proceed on course" means for you to start YOUR course. You also could have been told "resume own navigation".
 
I was under assumption that Class C requires permission from approach (....)

The Airbus requested runway 6 and to my knowledge, did not change that intention. Tower cautioned me about wake turbulence. My instructor was certain that Airbus landed on 24. It was hard to see him once he was mixed together with city lights, but I am sure he kept his original intention of landing on 6. But in that case, wake turbulence should not matter much on approach, while CFI told me to stay to the right of the runway, to let the wind push wake turbulence away.

And the last thing. I was told by tower to proceed on course and contact departure when I took off. I thought that it means that I should keep my current course until told otherwise. And my CFI told me that I should go to the left, towards my next checkpoint.

1. Franken is right: once you hear your callsign, you are ok to go into Charlie, there is no clearance. Note though, they may ask you "remain clear of Charlie". It's infrequent, but it does happen. If that occurs, the expected behaviour is to circle. If you start skirting, you may run into someone else who's skirting too.

2. I do not have enough detail, but if, for example, you were vectored for a downwing entry on 24 and Airbus went straight-in on 6, you can cross his track. Hard to say without being there.

3. Again, Mike and your CFI were correct.

I learned to fly at KABQ which is Class C and also Kirtland AFB. It's quite fun (except CH-47s, those are dangerous). For some reason I did not have issues like yours, but I always was confused by new instructions. One day tower instructed me to back-taxi on the busiest runway. That was unnerving. Landing ahead of overtaking airliners is also a bit concerning, and happens often.
 
Actually, I was given a Straight In, while Airbus was coming in from my right. In order to land, he should've been on right base when I spotted him. Or left base for 6. Anyway, I did stay to the right of the runway since my CFI was a PIC for that flight.
 
Back
Top