Flu Shot

Ron Levy said:
Did you get it from a health professional? If so, you'll have to report the visit including the reason. If you gave it to yourself from a RiteAid DIY Flu Shot Kit, then no, you don't.
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Walk-in free shots at Kaiser. The lady giving the shot was quite professional about it. I could hardly feel it. :D
 
Old Geek said:
Walk-in free shots at Kaiser. The lady giving the shot was quite professional about it. I could hardly feel it. :D
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I'm pretty sure the "lady giving the shot" was a "health professional" as the FAA defines that term in the instructions on the 8500-8, so make sure you make a record of that event and have her name to put down on the next medical application.
 
Geico266 said:
Report them to who? :dunno:

If you guys say the FAA on your next medical I am gonna hunt you down and slap some sense into you, and drink your beer. :yes:
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Well, if you want to omit a visit to a health professional within the preceding three years on your next medical application, you go right ahead. But do so knowing that you are lying on that application and if the FAA finds out, you can lose all your FAA certificates.

You would also be most unwise to try to drink my beer. :nono:
 
I thought this was for SERIOUS medical problems. Not a freaking flu shot. I also think you guys are giving the FAA to much info.
Maybe I should tell them next time I wipe my A_ _ to.
 
I wouldn't remember it long enough to write it down, let alone long enough to report it. I don't know how many flu shots, shingles shots, international travel shots and other such inoculations I've received since 1957, but have a pretty good idea how many have ever made it to any FAA form. If questioned, my answer would start with YGBSM.
 
Oh crap... I got by balls clipped.
I better hurry and call the FAA and tell them I am now shooting blanks.
 
Ron Levy said:
Well, if you want to omit a visit to a health professional within the preceding three years on your next medical application, you go right ahead. But do so knowing that you are lying on that application and if the FAA finds out, you can lose all your FAA certificates.

You would also be most unwise to try to drink my beer. :nono:
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Crowne? :dunno: :lol:

You guys cannot be serious reporting you got a flu shot on your FAA medical application. If they ever attempted to pull my certs for a flu shot I got at Walmart I would have all of them fired quicker that you could spit.
 
Geico266 said:
Crowne? :dunno: :lol:

You guys cannot be serious reporting you got a flu shot on your FAA medical application. If they ever attempted to pull my certs for a flu shot I got at Walmart I would have all of them fired quicker that you could spit.
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I'm guessing you've been drinking too much of someone else's beer. Come back in the morning.
 
First Medical: "Pulled head out of ass. Went flying."

Further medicals: "Previously reported, no change."
 
I guess getting a random breathalyzer and P-test associated with work as a pilot is a visit to a health professional too. :D
 
I think I'll just keep a log of every time I head home to see the Mrs. I get to log a visit with a healthcare professional just about every night. ;)
 
Ron Levy said:
Well, it is a reportable surgical procedure. But having read your posts in the past, I am well aware that you consider the FAR's advisory at best.
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I follow the rules. I am current on everything as a pilot. I am not a a_ _ kisser though. Sounds like you are. My medical examiner even told me not to write stuff down unless its major. Like heart problems. People don't write down when they go to the clinic for a sore throat. Maybe you do? I don't know?
 
Ron Levy said:
Well, if you want to omit a visit to a health professional within the preceding three years on your next medical application, you go right ahead. But do so knowing that you are lying on that application and if the FAA finds out, you can lose all your FAA certificates.

You would also be most unwise to try to drink my beer. :nono:
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A few moments of research would have shown that your assertion is without solid foundation, as this document claims immunizations are not reportable:

http://www.leftseat.com/AME/immunizations_and_flying.htm

There is also the simple issue that there may be no written patient records for flu shots.

Lastly, if the FAA did try to go after pilot certificates for failures to report flu shots, they'd simply be digging their own political grave. The rest of the medical establishment would hopefully skewer them.
 
Thank you Jim! :happydance:

A breath of common sense to those who think they get "brownie points" from the FAA by reporting every sneeze they write down on the FAA medical form. Flu shots? Really? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

I was treated for an ingrown toe over the summer and guess what! I'm not gonna report it either. :yikes: :rofl::rofl::rofl:

:mad2::mad2::mad2:

Report a flu shot? Really? You guys have done that? Please tell my this was a joke. :dunno:

Looking at it another way..... Do you really think the medical examiners in the FAA would look favorably on pilots who avoid medical treatment so they don't have to report it? :nono:

Gentlemen and women, let's use a little common sense here. :dunno:

Report the big stuff, leave the rest off.
 
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I'm with ya!
I am not reporting my clipped balls either. LOL!
I can fly my Pitts just fine without them.
 
Here's my question:

If you go into a pharmacy for a flu shot, do you carefully examine the credentials of whomever shows up with the syringe in order to properly report the event to the FAA, or just assume they know what they're doing and roll up your sleeve like you've done a hundred times before?
 
wabower said:
Here's my question:

If you go into a pharmacy for a flu shot, do you carefully examine the credentials of whomever shows up with the syringe in order to properly report the event to the FAA, or just assume they know what they're doing and roll up your sleeve like you've done a hundred times before?
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We are doomed. :mad2:



:rofl:


:idea:


:rofl:
 
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pigpenracing said:
I follow the rules. I am current on everything as a pilot. I am not a a_ _ kisser though. Sounds like you are. My medical examiner even told me not to write stuff down unless its major. Like heart problems. People don't write down when they go to the clinic for a sore throat. Maybe you do? I don't know?
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If you're taking that advice from your medical examiner, then you don't follow the rules. The rules are clear -- every visit to a health professional must be reported with only the specific exceptions noted in the instructions. Your medical examiner is setting you up for a fall and you are not very prudent if you accept verbal advice from someone with no authority to change the rules over written FAA instructions.
 
I just went through this with Dr.B. Routine visits for physicals do not need to be reported and multiple visits to the same doctor for same treatment or cause can be be grouped. The FAA is more concerned with the underlying conditions that you may have, not if you are healthy.
 
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Jim Logajan said:
A few moments of research would have shown that your assertion is without solid foundation, as this document claims immunizations are not reportable:

http://www.leftseat.com/AME/immunizations_and_flying.htm
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Easy for them to say, but they are not the FAA, and visits for immunizations are not among the exclusions in the instructions on block 19 on the current ("GG") version of FAA Form 8500-8.
There is also the simple issue that there may be no written patient records for flu shots.
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I'm not a medical practitioner, but I believe records must be kept on who gets vaccination so if there are batch issues they can find the recipient.

Lastly, if the FAA did try to go after pilot certificates for failures to report flu shots, they'd simply be digging their own political grave. The rest of the medical establishment would hopefully skewer them.
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That's fantasy, but personally, I think the biggest issue would be that they'd start digging to see what else you had failed to mention, and that's a dark hole into which you don't want to fall.
 
wabower said:
I wouldn't remember it long enough to write it down, let alone long enough to report it. I don't know how many flu shots, shingles shots, international travel shots and other such inoculations I've received since 1957, but have a pretty good idea how many have ever made it to any FAA form. If questioned, my answer would start with YGBSM.
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Precisely.
 
Marauder said:
I just went through this with Dr.B. Routine visits for physicals do not need to be reported and multiple visits to the same doctor for same treatment or cause can be be grouped.
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That's straight out of the instructions for the 8500-8, but a vaccination is not listed as a "routine physical examination."

Y'all do what you want. The rules are clear. Violate them at your own risk.

:bye:
 
Ron Levy said:
That's straight out of the instructions for the 8500-8, but a vaccination is not listed as a "routine physical examination."

Y'all do what you want. The rules are clear. Violate them at your own risk.

:bye:
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Unfortunately the rules are not clear and not even for the AMEs. If they were, we wouldn't be having this discussion. I think this is why the SI process can take so long. What one AME thinks doesn't need reported, the FAA does. Ask two AMEs exactly what should be reported for a condition and you will get three answers, the two AME answers and the FAA's. I know this for a fact.

The FAA's intent is to make sure you are healthy to fly. But like every enforcing body, they have the final authority on determining the rules. Our challenge is, even for the experts, is to interpret them and do so correctly or otherwise face the consequence.
 
Ron Levy said:
That's straight out of the instructions for the 8500-8, but a vaccination is not listed as a "routine physical examination."

Y'all do what you want. The rules are clear. Violate them at your own risk.

:bye:
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Form 8500-8 is not a regulation. It never has been. It may have been written in an attempt to satisfy regulations, but you are making the mistake of thinking it is regulatory and must be literally satisfied.

You need to produce the regulation(s) outside form 8500-8 that supports the information demands it makes of pilots.
 
Ron Levy said:
That's fantasy, but personally, I think the biggest issue would be that they'd start digging to see what else you had failed to mention, and that's a dark hole into which you don't want to fall.
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Your point is taken Ron, but you are way out on a limb on this one. Give it a rest. Holding the FAA out as a snooping, spying secret agency will only serve to scare those who don't know what the reality is. The only time they are gonna dig into your records is if there is an incident, and only a >1% chance of that as a PPL, and probably because you are dead. AND they would need to subpoena your health records after having convinced a federal administrative judge that LAWS were broken. If what they find is that you left off a flu shot the judge is gonna have someone's butt in a sling. ;)
 
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denverpilot said:
That came out funny! LOL.
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It is funny. I said it tongue in cheek, but there is some truth to it. If you report a condition to an AME/FAA that you had since your last medical, you will spend more time on that condition's current status than the fact that you gained 90 pounds and made the blood pressure cutoff by a couple of diastolic points.
 
Jim Logajan said:
Form 8500-8 is not a regulation. It never has been. It may have been written in an attempt to satisfy regulations, but you are making the mistake of thinking it is regulatory and must be literally satisfied.

You need to produce the regulation(s) outside form 8500-8 that supports the information demands it makes of pilots.
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My last sentence was written too fast and is unclear even to me. Second try: Find the statutes or regulations that require pilots to answer each of the form 8500-8 questions.

If form 8500-8 were itself regulatory, the FAA would be required by statute to issue NPRMs whenever its questions were updated.
 
This is a Aeromedical Certification Division.....yawner......yawner......such a tempest in a teapot.
 
Jim Logajan said:
My last sentence was written too fast and is unclear even to me. Second try: Find the statutes or regulations that require pilots to answer each of the form 8500-8 questions.
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That one's easy as pie.

§67.4

An applicant for first-, second- and third-class medical certification must:

(a) Apply on a form and in a manner prescribed by the Administrator;
 
Old Geek said:
Glad to see you back, Bruce.

What do you think? Report a flu shot (assuming no ill reactions) or not?
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I CANNOT imagine an aeromedical problem that would relate to a flu shot, other than about a 1:12,000,000 chance of some Guillian Barre. An if you got that, it would appear under "Neurologist visit" or "Hospitalization".

What a yawner. AT some point the agnecy has to leave a bit of discretion at the designee level.... yawn....
 
alaskaflyer said:
That one's easy as pie.

§67.4

An applicant for first-, second- and third-class medical certification must:

(a) Apply on a form and in a manner prescribed by the Administrator;
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Nice find - thank you. Do you think the form becomes an extension of the regulations subject to the NPRM process? Consider if it isn't subject; what prevents the administrator from adding all sorts of "health related" questions, such as:

sexual preference, how many calories you have consumed in the last 30 days, how often and in what manner you exercise, the time and dates of the last 5 headaches you've had, and how often you floss.
 
Jim Logajan said:
Nice find - thank you. Do you think the form becomes an extension of the regulations subject to the NPRM process? Consider if it isn't subject; what prevents the administrator from adding all sorts of "health related" questions, such as:

sexual preference, how many calories you have consumed in the last 30 days, how often and in what manner you exercise, the time and dates of the last 5 headaches you've had, and how often you floss.
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Yer silly, Jim.

The authority of the Federal Air Surgeon is that he can grant certificates to person who are not completely healthy in spite of disease states "on best medical advice".

So I really think that all this is just ginning up trash. "The tragedy of the commons".

In fact, Gender dysphoria disorder is a special issuance. It is a psychiatric condition related to the neuroses. If he wanted to ask about that, he would. But he expects that we in the field, will.

This is a very politically correct administration, like Clinton's. The direction is, "The sex of the airman /airwoman is whatever the airman/ airwoman declares it to be".

....another of the reasons why I think at times I waste my time trying to help pilots at this site.
 
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