flight time sharing in LA (KCPM)

bavreze

bavreze

Pre-Flight
Joined
Jun 3, 2015
Messages
42
Location
Los Angeles
Display Name
bavareze
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KCPM
Hi. I need 3 hrs simulated instrument by the end of this month.

so I need another pilot who needs a few hours and has at least PPL to fly together.

Either Mooney M20C or C172M, $100/hr - we split that cost

I can fly locally or cross country.

310 384 7428 or PM

thanks!
 
You're not too likely to get any takers if you ask someone to pay for the privilege of being your safety pilot. The safety pilot is doing you a favor.
 
I see nothing wrong with it, asking for someone to split costs 50/50 and shotgun hours ain't anything new and it's a great way to build hours for less money.

Someone helps him get some hood time, he helps someone get some PIC/mooney/cross country/whatever time.

If I needed some hours or was local Id be game for something like this.

So you're bacically paying $50hr for mooney time, yeah what a horrible deal :rolleyes:
 
James331 said:
I see nothing wrong with it, asking for someone to split costs 50/50 and shotgun hours ain't anything new and it's a great way to build hours for less money.

Someone helps him get some hood time, he helps someone get some PIC/mooney/cross country/whatever time.

If I needed some hours or was local Id be game for something like this.
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Agreed. Seems to be a pretty normal way to build hours.
 
To each their own, I guess. Every time I've asked for a safety pilot I've never thought to split costs. I hope the OP finds somebody.
 
KaiGywer said:
Agreed. Seems to be a pretty normal way to build hours.
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mr_happyland said:
To each their own, I guess. Every time I've asked for a safety pilot I've never thought to split costs. I hope the OP finds somebody.
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I've heard of people doing it together to build hours. In that case it works.

Like mr_happyland though, when I've done it the safety pilot doesn't pay. They are doing the other pilot a favor. I have swapped off safety pilot duties with another pilot. Sometimes in the same plane, sometimes in different planes.
 
wayne said:
I've heard of people doing it together to build hours. In that case it works.

Like mr_happyland though, when I've done it the safety pilot doesn't pay. They are doing the other pilot a favor. I have swapped off safety pilot duties with another pilot. Sometimes in the same plane, sometimes in different planes.
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I've done the same thing, and it makes sense when changing seats halfway through.

I've never asked any safety pilot to pay anything unless we switch seats (then, he pays for his left seat time, I pay for mine). I've been asked a couple of times, but I've declined. PIC time in the left seat is considerably more valuable.

"Mooney time" is fake if the PIC just sits in the right seat looking for traffic, and doesn't take off or land. There are also often insurance and rental rules prohibitions against assigning PIC to the right seat, especially if the right seat is not checked out in the airplane.
 
MAKG1 said:
I've done the same thing, and it makes sense when changing seats halfway through.

I've never asked any safety pilot to pay anything unless we switch seats (then, he pays for his left seat time, I pay for mine). I've been asked a couple of times, but I've declined. PIC time in the left seat is considerably more valuable.

"Mooney time" is fake if the PIC just sits in the right seat looking for traffic, and doesn't take off or land. There are also often insurance and rental rules prohibitions against assigning PIC to the right seat, especially if the right seat is not checked out in the airplane.
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PIC time in the right seat being less valuable, that's fake lol!

Mooney time could be of value if you're in the market for a mooney or need to log XX hours for your insurance.

End of the day as far as employers are concerned, no one ever asked me what seat I was in when I logged time, there are times I will fly my 185 from the right seat depending on the docking situation, guess that flight was less valuable as the one I flew on the way back in the left seat.

You're gaining PIC hours being a saftey pilot, if you're building hours this has a value, and paying HALF is a great arrangement for both parties.

I logged quite a few saftey pilot hours and vise versa when I was building that first 250. Helped me and my friend considerably.
 
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James331 said:
PIC time in the right seat being less valuable, that's fake lol!

Mooney time could be of value if you're in the market for a mooney or need to log XX hours for your insurance.

End of the day as far as employers are concerned, no one ever asked me what seat I was in when I logged time, there are times I will fly my 185 from the right seat depending on the docking situation, guess that flight was less valuable as the one I flew on the way back in the left seat.

You're gaining PIC hours being a saftey pilot, if you're building hours this has a value, and paying HALF is a great arrangement for both parties.

I logged quite a few saftey pilot hours and vise versa when I was building my that first 250. Helped me and my friend considerably.
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Yes, that's right. PIC time logged while just watching for traffic involves less skill than PIC time logged while actually flying, especially with takeoffs and landings.

It's legal -- sometimes. It's still fake. No one ever asked YOU. If something goes wrong, you can bet it will be asked who was acting PIC. Not authorized will be a BIG problem. And logging like this involves accepting responsibility for the real PIC's screw ups. That's what it means to act as PIC. That should not be done lightly.
 
MAKG1 said:
Yes, that's right. PIC time logged while just watching for traffic involves less skill than PIC time logged while actually flying, especially with takeoffs and landings.

It's legal -- sometimes. It's still fake. No one ever asked YOU. If something goes wrong, you can bet it will be asked who was acting PIC. Not authorized will be a BIG problem. And logging like this involves accepting responsibility for the real PIC's screw ups. That's what it means to act as PIC. That should not be done lightly.
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So you don't log time when you're on autopilot I take it?
 
Since everyone love to debate compensation - If the safety pilot is logging the time, and not paying fair share of costs, isn't that considered compensation? Seems they have to pay half...
 
MAKG1 said:
Umm, you know as well as I do that using an autopilot isn't as simple as pushing a button and arriving at a destination. Got any more red herrings?
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Nor is being a safety pilot, especially if you're playing ATC for the guy and handling the comms.
 
James331 said:
Nor is being a safety pilot, especially if you're playing ATC for the guy and handling the comms.
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Being safety pilot requires no knowledge of aircraft systems, no pilot skills, and polishes nothing that you might need to demonstrate time for. That's why it's fake. Legal under some circumstances, yes, but nowhere near equivalent to real PIC time. The ability to act as ATC or handle comms is useful, but is not a requirement to be safety pilot. All that is needed is a valid medical and appropriate rating.

In a practical sense, being a safety pilot on a 182 does not require a high performance endorsement, but logging it as PIC does. What exactly is the difference?

Are you really claiming this is anything but a legal scam to get around an insurance requirement? 'Cause that doesn't pass the sniff test.
 
ok....however the industry does not agree with you.
 
MAKG1 said:
I've done the same thing, and it makes sense when changing seats halfway through.

I've never asked any safety pilot to pay anything unless we switch seats (then, he pays for his left seat time, I pay for mine). I've been asked a couple of times, but I've declined. PIC time in the left seat is considerably more valuable.

"Mooney time" is fake if the PIC just sits in the right seat looking for traffic, and doesn't take off or land. There are also often insurance and rental rules prohibitions against assigning PIC to the right seat, especially if the right seat is not checked out in the airplane.
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Just don't get caught in the logging morass:

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/agc/pol_adjudication/agc200/interpretations/data/interps/2009/Louis%20Glenn.pdf

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/agc/pol_adjudication/agc200/interpretations/data/in terps/2009/Hilliard.pdf

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/agc/pol_adjudication/agc200/interpretations/data/interps/2009/Van%20Zanen.pdf

In short:
1) Unless the aircraft requires more than one pilot for the ENTIRE flight then only one pilot can log cross country time and only if he or she is the sole manipulator for the ENTIRE flight.
2) A repositioning flight is acceptable to allow the pilot to setup a subsequent flight as a cross country flight.
_

Bob Gardner
 
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