Flight review - when is it due?

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe

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I'm sure everyone here except me understands this completely....

no person may act as pilot in command of an aircraft unless, since the beginning of the 24th calendar month before the month in which that pilot acts as pilot in command,
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I think this means that if I got a review July 1, 2010, then I am good until July 31 2012.

If we assume the current calendar month is July, the first calendar month before the current month would be June, the second May... the 12th and 24th would be July and the July before. I think.

And, if July is the 24th calendar month before the current month, and I had a review was done sometime in that July, I'm good to go for the rest of July.

Eh?

If I got that straight, then all I need to do is find an instructor that want's to do a flight review in a homebuilt LSA taildragger...

(Why can't they write this stuff so it is easy to understand? FORTRAN would be nice. Or even C. Heck, even assembly would be an improvement.)
 
To make the review last as long as possible, wouldn't it make sense to schedule the review for Aug. 1st?

Ryan
 
RyanShort1 said:
To make the review last as long as possible, wouldn't it make sense to schedule the review for Aug. 1st?

Ryan
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If my understanding is correct, that would be true. But I just want to be sure I've got 'til some time in July to find an instructor.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
I'm sure everyone here except me understands this completely....
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I wouldn't be too sure about that. Otherwise, it wouldn't have been on the written...or it was back when I took the written many moons ago. And I thought you were right until I read the requirement a few times over.

Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
I think this means that if I got a review July 1, 2010, then I am good until July 31 2012.
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"c) Except as provided in paragraphs (d), (e), and (g) of this section, no person may act as pilot in command of an aircraft unless, since the beginning of the 24th calendar month before the month in which that pilot acts as pilot in command, that person has—"

If I'm reading this right if your last review was July 1, 2010 you should be good until the end of August, 2012. The key words are "24th calendar month before the month"....essentially we're looking at 25 months inclusive.

Huh. It's been too long since I've taken the written and I recall needing the review every 2 years, and this question was even on the written and I'm pretty sure the answer wasn't 25 months inclusive back then. But still, after reading this for the last several minutes I'm not sure where my logic is flawed.
 
Gerhardt said:
If I'm reading this right if your last review was July 1, 2010 you should be good until the end of August, 2012. The key words are "24th calendar month before the month"....essentially we're looking at 25 months inclusive.
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Strange wording in this reg. It looks like it was amended in August 2009. I always thought a flight review was a 24-calendar month event but the way the updated reg reads makes it sound like a 25-calendar month event.
 
Geoffrey is reading it correctly; Gerhardt is not. This is explained in detail in the preamble to the Final Rule of the last major Part 61 change.
 
Here is a recent interpretation that also confirms the flight review is a 24-calendar month event.

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org.../interpretations/data/interps/2012/Harvey.pdf

This makes sense because if you think about it, to act as PIC on August 1, 2012 you must have completed a flight review "since the beginning of the 24th calendar month before" which would be July 31, 2012 at the very latest (assuming your last BFR was in July 2010).
 
HPNPilot1200 said:
Here is a recent interpretation that also confirms the flight review is a 24-calendar month event.

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org.../interpretations/data/interps/2012/Harvey.pdf

This makes sense because if you think about it, to act as PIC on August 1, 2012 you must have completed a flight review "since the beginning of the 24th calendar month before" which would be July 31, 2012 at the very latest (assuming your last BFR was in July 2010).
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If you want to act as PIC on Aug 1 2012, "the beginning of the 24th calendar month before" would be Aug 1 2010, not July 31 2012.
 
Gerhardt said:
If I'm reading this right if your last review was July 1, 2010 you should be good until the end of August, 2012. The key words are "24th calendar month before the month"....essentially we're looking at 25 months inclusive.
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It's not your reading that's wrong, it's your counting.

When the current date is in August, 2012, then the first calendar month before the current month is July, 2012, and you just keep on counting like that until you get to 24:

Number of Month Before

  1. July 2012
  2. June 2012
  3. May 2012
  4. April 2012
  5. March 2012
  6. February 2012
  7. January 2012
  8. December 2011
  9. November 2011
  10. October 2011
  11. September 2011
  12. August 2011
  13. July 2011
  14. June 2011
  15. May 2011
  16. April 2011
  17. March 2011
  18. February 2011
  19. January 2011
  20. December 2010
  21. November 2010
  22. October 2010
  23. September 2010
  24. August 2010

So if your last flight review took place on July 31, 2010 or before, then you cannot fly as PIC in August 2012.

This thread is very timely for me, because I was just about to sit down and figure out whether I need a flight review this month or next month!
 
Ron Levy said:
If you want to act as PIC on Aug 1 2012, "the beginning of the 24th calendar month before" would be Aug 1 2010, not July 31 2012.
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Oops, my bad. That's what I meant. Not sure how I pulled July 31, 2012 out of it... thanks for the correction. :redface:
 
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RyanShort1 said:
To make the review last as long as possible, wouldn't it make sense to schedule the review for Aug. 1st?
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No, technically the very longest would be four hours or so before you next needed to be PIC. Say, ten years hence. Or whenever.

(I love finding programmer's bad assumptions in their code. GRIN!)

BFRs are not mandatory. You can lapse for as long as you like. ;)
 
The actual flight review interval, and how to use it to determine your personal deadline, is pretty simple and straightforward... it's the FAA explanation that's not.
The problem, as with a lot of FAR-speak, is that they are so hung up on phrasing everything "no person shall... (thou shalt not?)" that it gets overly wordy and "legalese".
They can't just say "Acting PIC privileges expire after the end of the 24th calendar month since the airman's last review, including the month in which the last review took place."
And of course they have created even more confusion by now insisting that this review, which is due every two years basically, is not a biannual flight review. :mad2:
 
Palmpilot said:
It's not your reading that's wrong, it's your counting.
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Thanks for the remedial counting lesson, it helped. This was one of those things I had to step away from and come back to later and it all makes sense. It is 25 months inclusive, so a flight review August 1, 2010 would take you through the end of August 2012.
 
Gerhardt said:
Thanks for the remedial counting lesson, it helped. This was one of those things I had to step away from and come back to later and it all makes sense. It is 25 months inclusive, so a flight review August 1, 2010 would take you through the end of August 2012.
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Exactly. Just like the rules for annual inspections and medical exams, the
FAA recognized that making you schedule the exact same date for the event or end up doing them more often than once per N years would be PITA. As a result for something that's required every 2 years you get a whole month to get it done without losing out on available flight time.
 
Thanks for bringing this topic. It caused me to consider asking one of the CFIs I'd flown with recently to grant the endorsement, notwithstanding the fact that I have 11 more FAA months before its required of me to do a review.
 
rottydaddy said:
And of course they have created even more confusion by now insisting that this review, which is due every two years basically, is not a biannual flight review. :mad2:
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Thank goodness. Biannual would be twice a year. I prefer to get them biennial style every two years.
:rofl:
 
RyanShort1 said:
To make the review last as long as possible, wouldn't it make sense to schedule the review for Aug. 1st?

Ryan
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correct me if wrong but if you do this, you won't be able to log the BFR as PIC
 
raider said:
correct me if wrong but if you do this, you won't be able to log the BFR as PIC
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If it's past the due date for the review, you can't log as acting PIC. In other words, the other pilot has to be qualified for the aircraft and not overdue for their review. That makes them the acting PIC. But you don't need a current review, or even a current medical, to log "plain" PIC time under those circumstances.
 
rottydaddy said:
If it's past the due date for the review, you can't log as acting PIC. In other words, the other pilot has to be qualified for the aircraft and not overdue for their review. That makes them the acting PIC. But you don't need a current review, or even a current medical, to log "plain" PIC time under those circumstances.
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...where "plain" PIC = "sole manipulator of the controls" PIC.
 
now there's a 'plain' and 'acting' PIC?? i've seen many other debates on PIC interpretations. i was surprised when i found out none of my training hours counted as PIC. i guess it's what an organization deems necessary - PIC or just total time?
 
raider said:
now there's a 'plain' and 'acting' PIC?? i've seen many other debates on PIC interpretations. i was surprised when i found out none of my training hours counted as PIC. i guess it's what an organization deems necessary - PIC or just total time?
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When it comes to hiring pilots, there's nothing that says an aviation employer cannot apply stricter requirements than the FAA does.
 
I got my flight review done today. Now I'm good for any trips that I might take in July.
 
Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe said:
I'm sure everyone here except me understands this completely....
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The topic "when is it due" leads me to ask this because it might be among the things people are confused about.

A FR is really never "due" in the sense that you certificate will become invalid. You can go 30 years without getting a flight review, so long as you have one within 24 calendar months before you act as PIC again.
 
midlifeflyer said:
The topic "when is it due" leads me to ask this because it might be among the things people are confused about.
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Ok, should have said: when does my ability to act as PIC expire?

[quote[A FR is really never "due" in the sense that you certificate will become invalid. You can go 30 years without getting a flight review, so long as you have one within 24 calendar months before you act as PIC again.[/QUOTE]

That's what I did.
 
I have never had a BFR.
 
Thank goodness, I was starting to be upset I got the checkride on the 28th day of the month. Now I'm not worried.
 
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