Flight Design insolvency

I think they overextended with the C4 production and moving facilities from Ukraine to Taiwan. This should ultimately be a good thing.
 
Time will tell,many companies go through re-organization ,and survive. This could turn out to be a good thing. Hopefully they will continue with the C4.
 
Here's a twist... FD USA has announced a new model, the CTLSi 2020, showing their resolve to get past the reorganization and get back to business. There is also a new production partner, AeroJones, and planes already rolling of fthe production line.
Find the info at ByDanJohnson.com.
 
CT4ME said:
Here's a twist... FD USA has announced a new model, the CTLSi 2020, showing their resolve to get past the reorganization and get back to business. There is also a new production partner, AeroJones, and planes already rolling of fthe production line.
Find the info at ByDanJohnson.com.
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As a customer of FD USA, I can say they have been A #1 in my service needs, professional and courteous . My brother bought a new CTLSi 3 Mo. ago and is very happy with it. I think anybody that deals with FD USA will have Zero problems with the transition.

Cheers
 
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JeffDG said:
Probably the Bernath class action pushed them over the edge. :devil:
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FD Germany is in reorganization , as far as I know FD USA is doing just fine. They have contracts with the part suppliers, AeroJones for air frames, Rotax USA for engines. There should be no disruptions in the US.

Cheers
 
ralarcon said:
FD Germany is in reorganization , as far as I know FD USA is doing just fine. They have contracts with the part suppliers, AeroJones for air frames, Rotax USA for engines. There should be no disruptions in the US.

Cheers
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I was joking.

The judge laughed that suit out of court on a preliminary motion-to-dismiss.
 
frfly172 said:
Time will tell,many companies go through re-organization ,and survive. This could turn out to be a good thing. Hopefully they will continue with the C4.
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Insolvency proceedings in germany are historically a bit more serious than chapter 11 restructuring in the US. It is quite common that companies get split or assets sold off by the trustee.

I hope they pull through. Sounds like they took a risk by setting up production in the frontier areas and got caught up in geopolitical developments they had no control over.
 
weilke said:
Insolvency proceedings in germany are historically a bit more serious than chapter 11 restructuring in the US. It is quite common that companies get split or assets sold off by the trustee.

I hope they pull through. Sounds like they took a risk by setting up production in the frontier areas and got caught up in geopolitical developments they had no control over.
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Perhaps this might be useful ;


http://www.bydanjohnson.com/

Cheers
 
ralarcon said:
As a customer of FD USA, I can say they have been A #1 in my service needs, professional and courteous . My brother bought a new CTLSi 3 Mo. ago and is very happy with it. I think anybody that deals with FD USA will have Zero problems with the transition.

Cheers
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Tom Peghiny at FD USA is a top-notch professional. His commitment to his customers and the FD brand is well known to those who've dealt with him.

I'm not terribly worried about the fate of US operations.
 
ralarcon said:
Perhaps this might be useful ;


http://www.bydanjohnson.com/

Cheers
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It is nice that the CEO is still optimistic, however if the trustee finds that the liabilities exceed the assets, by law he has to dissolve the company in a way that maximizes return to the creditors (in order of priority). Doesn't matter whether company management believes that there is a pot of gold just around the corner.
 
weilke said:
It is nice that the CEO is still optimistic, however if the trustee finds that the liabilities exceed the assets, by law he has to dissolve the company in a way that maximizes return to the creditors (in order of priority). Doesn't matter whether company management believes that there is a pot of gold just around the corner.
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Nope, FD USA is a separate company from FD Gmbh. As long as FD USA can source parts and airframes (which they have suppliers for currently), they will still be able to continue US operations, sales, and support.
 
bullwinkle said:
Nope, FD USA is a separate company from FD Gmbh. As long as FD USA can source parts and airframes (which they have suppliers for currently), they will still be able to continue US operations, sales, and support.
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And nothing I said contradicts that.

Does FD USA hold the ASTM paperwork and IP to offer completed planes for sale or do they rely on licenses from FD GmbH ?
 
bullwinkle said:
Nope, FD USA is a separate company from FD Gmbh. As long as FD USA can source parts and airframes (which they have suppliers for currently), they will still be able to continue US operations, sales, and support.
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Ironically, this setup originally was established to isolate FD from liability of the notoriously litiguous U.S. market (hello USS Dan Yorktown). Now it suddenly came useful for American customers, while litigation by European customers drove FD into receivership. Oh the irony. And if people hear about the lack of support and start asking realistic prices for 1000-hour CTSWs, it's great for me personally. I'm not paying $75k for one of those. For $40k, I may consider it.
 
weilke said:
And nothing I said contradicts that.

Does FD USA hold the ASTM paperwork and IP to offer completed planes for sale or do they rely on licenses from FD GmbH ?
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AeroJones of Taiwan does, is my understanding. A direct supplier of FD USA. They are the world supplier of air frames now.

Cheers
 
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I had the opportunity to fly the CTLSi 323CT down at Spruce Creek a couple of years ago and it was a great, and fun plane to fly. That was the plane I was going to order and own but then I ended up just doing my PPL and not sport.

If it were just me flying around I'd buy one in a heartbeat..
 
EminiTrader said:
I had the opportunity to fly the CTLSi 323CT down at Spruce Creek a couple of years ago and it was a great, and fun plane to fly. That was the plane I was going to order and own but then I ended up just doing my PPL and not sport.

If it were just me flying around I'd buy one in a heartbeat..
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I love mine. I'm addicted to flying in it. (CTLS)

Cheers
 
Sadly, my head ends either behind the forward carry-through or behind it. So I end doing the craning motion back and forth as I get tired of either of the extremes. But it's a great airplane in the class and a market leader for a good reason.
 
ralarcon said:
AeroJones of Taiwan does, is my understanding. A direct supplier of FD USA. They are the world supplier of air frames now.

Cheers
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With a insolvency, those licensing rights and patents may end up in the portfolio of a local savings and loan or some other high ranking creditor. As the Thielert bankruptcy demonstrated, the attorneys who run the process at that point just look at how they can squeeze the maximum revenue out of the captive user base. Sustainability, brand loyalty etc. are secondary considerations.
 
weilke said:
With a insolvency, those licensing rights and patents may end up in the portfolio of a local savings and loan or some other high ranking creditor. As the Thielert bankruptcy demonstrated, the attorneys who run the process at that point just look at how they can squeeze the maximum revenue out of the captive user base. Sustainability, brand loyalty etc. are secondary considerations.
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Not a lawyer(disclaimer) , do not know, but AeroJones is an independent Taiwanese Co. not influenced by German Law. Rights were negotiated independently, for world wide manufacture. Not a subsidiary of FD Gmbh. Rights were sold and bought and it is a done deal.

Cheers
 
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Well, I hope they do well. Their C4 looks to be an excellent plane by the numbers.
 
> "Tom Peghiny just posted his side of the story over on CTFlier.com"

That name rings a bell. I've got no interest in these Tupperware planes but Tom Peghiny holds some world class hang gliding records if I'm not mistaken. Dan Johnson also comes out of the hang gliding world from way back - that guy in fact has had his fingers in so many pies it's hard to believe it's only one person.
 
"I've got no interest in these Tupperware planes but Tom Peghiny holds some world class hang gliding records"

Says the guy who has never flown one !

Cheers
 
Ha. How wrong you are. I not only have flown one but actually own two of them. A Phoenix 6D and a Falcon 4. I'm not current since my enthusiasm for them has waned, along with my wish to own a Lear 23 and be friends with Tuesday Weld. I never came close to getting as serious about it as people like Tom Peghiny, but I have flown one. Many times.
 
Unit74 said:
Wheres the cliff notes of the suit?
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Dodo lands with empty tank. Fuel farm closed for the day. Dodo thinks: its only a 12 min flight to other airport and I have 15min of fuel in the empty tank, so I am a-ok. Dodo takes off, crashes, breaks plane in two. Dodo sues manufacturer under a number of novel legal theories.
 
IIRC He also had an aileron collapse issue a year before the crash. He posted pictures and it looked pretty impressive. Again, my memory may be faulty, but I seem to recall that the threatened to sue them even back then. I do not remember if FD USA fixed his aileron for free or if they made him to buy the part. That case seemed pretty legit and came down to the difference of opinion if it was a defect or he somehow got a drain hole plugged.

These aileron collapses are known to happen once in a while, although very infrequently. I feel like I'm getting very deep into rumor-mongering, but they have something with water getting into the structure and getting some kind of foam wet. When enough of it gets wet, it either freezes or loses strength and then you can see the surface of the aileron caving inward. Personally I wasn't too concerned because if you let water pool in an aluminum or wooden airplane, bad things happen there too.

He flies an RV-12 currently and apparently is pretty happy with Van, or at any rate there wasn't a lawsuit yet.
 
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