FLABOB and Aztec pattern

Tantalum

Tantalum

Final Approach
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San_Diego_Pilot
Hey Guys,
FLABOB has been on my "go to" list since I've lived in Southern California but so far haven't made it there yet

I love unique airports and enjoy AVX, SZP, Kern, Columbia, Agua Dulce (L70), etc., for that bit of challenge. FLABOB with the 700' pattern sounds fun, and given its history, the cafe, and being the first EAA chapter looks like a fun Saturday destination

So.. anything to note for someone who would be going in with a heavier twin, like an Aztec?

Does the 700' pattern still apply? I seem to recall @Fearless Tower flies a proper big twin and unless I'm crazy his prior posts suggest he's been into FLABOB and the socal area

Of all the YouTube vids I could find none had twins.. all overshoot the turn.. and the DC-3 vids suspiciously seem to cut out the downwind to base portion of the flight (hmm...)

Any insight, let me know!
 
NealRomeoGolf said:
I'll be the dumb one. What the heck is FLABOB?
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It took me way too much Googling to figure it out too originally. KRIR

https://www.flabobairport.org/

When I moved here people kept saying "have you been to FLABOB? No?! you have to go to FLABOB"

Apparently it's named after two guys.. Flavio and Bob. One of the oldest airports in California and EAA's Chapter #001
 
KRIR - "Riverside - Roubidoux"

Every time I go in there it's a ghost town. Local area is a wasteland.

Fun sport with an Aztec. If you wanted to purchase some gang-banger's pitbull for use in your next dogfight, probably no finer place for it. :D
 
schmookeeg said:
KRIR - "Riverside - Roubidoux"
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now it makes sense; thanks

schmookeeg said:
Every time I go in there it's a ghost town. Local area is a wasteland
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that's a bummer, their cafe is open and I was under the impression that "every day is a fly in" but I've fallen for crap marketing before. Any suggestions for something else fun with a good cafe? I haven't been to Cable, that could be fun. All the others I can think of I've been to a bunch.
 
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“Heavier twin like an Aztec?” :rofl:

There was the time I had a 10 mile final in a Navajo at 100 ft, but that’s another story...

I have no knowledge of the local airport but keep in mind circling mins (another discussion) for many approaches are under 700’ AGL. By itself, no issues, just fly the plane well.
 
Why is 700' a problem in an Aztec?
 
EdFred said:
Why is 700' a problem in an Aztec?
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It ought not be. But I figured I'd ask if there's local tips about this place. Otherwise I'm going in there at 700' as the TPA says.

Ted said:
keep in mind circling mins (another discussion) for many approaches are under 700’ AGL
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Good point. SMX is 600 and I've done that circle to land a few times. Loads of fun haha

Ted said:
Heavier twin like an Aztec
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Yeah in reading it again sounds ridiculous :oops: But it is heavier than the duchess I did the ME on!
 
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Tantalum said:
Yeah in reading it again sounds ridiculous :oops: But it is heavier than the duchess I did the ME on!
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Don't feel bad - there's always something bigger. I was on an MD-11 jumpseat a few weeks back and while taxiing into the alley we had to pause momentarily for a 757 connected to a tug to get pulled out of the way. The captain made the joke: "Someone get that light twin the hell out of here!"

Flabob is awesome, btw. You'll enjoy it.
 
kayoh190 said:
Flabob is awesome, btw. You'll enjoy it.
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Thanks! I'm looking forward to it. Hopefully this coming weekend

kayoh190 said:
Someone get that light twin the hell out of here!
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hahah! Don't they even use the "heavy" call sign? 9/10 planes that land at SAN now are Southwest 737s.. BOORING. So when the FedEx 767, 757, and A300 come in each night they're a sight to behold. Look huge. We used to get the BA 777 (and before that the 747) and HA A330 in, those looked awesome blasting over Little Italy but haven't seen them since pandemic

PS, MD-11 is one of my favorite planes. Long time ago we took a trip to Europe on a KLM MD-11.. such a beast of a plane. No pics but that middle engine towering above the wide body fuselage makes the plane look massive
 
Tantalum said:
Hey Guys,
FLABOB has been on my "go to" list since I've lived in Southern California but so far haven't made it there yet

I love unique airports and enjoy AVX, SZP, Kern, Columbia, Agua Dulce (L70), etc., for that bit of challenge. FLABOB with the 700' pattern sounds fun, and given its history, the cafe, and being the first EAA chapter looks like a fun Saturday destination

So.. anything to note for someone who would be going in with a heavier twin, like an Aztec?

Does the 700' pattern still apply? I seem to recall @Fearless Tower flies a proper big twin and unless I'm crazy his prior posts suggest he's been into FLABOB and the socal area

Of all the YouTube vids I could find none had twins.. all overshoot the turn.. and the DC-3 vids suspiciously seem to cut out the downwind to base portion of the flight (hmm...)

Any insight, let me know!
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Have you called anyone there? They have phone numbers. https://www.flabobairport.org/ You might find out that ‘goin around the mountain’ at the night TPA is typical for faster airplanes there in the day time.
 
Tantalum said:
PS, MD-11 is one of my favorite planes. Long time ago we took a trip to Europe on a KLM MD-11.. such a beast of a plane. No pics but that middle engine towering above the wide body fuselage makes the plane look massive
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[thread drift]

We got a tour of the Orbis MD-10 Flying Eye Hospital a couple of years ago. Very impressive. Brought back memories of when I was watching the prototype DC-10s in flight test at LGB in 1971.







[/thread drift]
 
Tantalum said:
now it makes sense; thanks


that's a bummer, their cafe is open and I was under the impression that "every day is a fly in" but I've fallen for crap marketing before. Any suggestions for something else fun with a good cafe? I haven't been to Cable, that could be fun. All the others I can think of I've been to a bunch.
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While I'm spewing trivia, RAL is "Riverside - Arlington" -- I assume March AFB got there first, and that's why they snagged KRIV. :D

I used to go to coastal spots to get out of the Inland Empire. Camarillo for example. I don't even know what airport cafes are still open -- I heard Flo's at CNO was closing? I think CCB's cafe went away also?

I wish there was a reliable source for that info. Airnav used to be it, until they got greedy and hid non-paying listings.
 
Pilawt said:
[/thread drift]
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It wouldn't be PoA without it! Great pics, tri jets are cool, whether L1011, 727, TU-154, DC-10, MD-11, etc.

schmookeeg said:
I wish there was a reliable source for that info
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Even more frustrating is some of these places now only exists on Facebook.. and without Facebook I'm "in the dark" .. the Foreflight comments are hit or miss.

schmookeeg said:
While I'm spewing trivia, RAL is "Riverside - Arlington" -- I assume March AFB got there first, and that's why they snagged KRIV
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This must be why RAMONA is not KRMN but the inverse, KRNM.. you have no idea how many times I've punched KRMN into the Garmin only to be puzzled at an airport thousands of miles away.
 
This must be why RAMONA is not KRMN but the inverse, KRNM.. you have no idea how many times I've punched KRMN into the Garmin only to be puzzled at an airport thousands of miles away.[/QUOTE]

Lol. I’ve never done that, yeah right. I literally call Ramona, Ranoma. Been doin it so long I do it in normal conversation. Another one that gets me is Scappoose, SPB and San Luis Obispo, SBP. I have lived near and flown into both.
 
schmookeeg said:
While I'm spewing trivia, RAL is "Riverside - Arlington" -- I assume March AFB got there first, and that's why they snagged KRIV. :D

I used to go to coastal spots to get out of the Inland Empire. Camarillo for example. I don't even know what airport cafes are still open -- I heard Flo's at CNO was closing? I think CCB's cafe went away also?

I wish there was a reliable source for that info. Airnav used to be it, until they got greedy and hid non-paying listings.
Click to expand...

Flo’s and Maniac Mike’s probably got shut down by the American Heart Society.:D
 
I just spent the weekend flying out of FLABOB a with a friend that as a Mooney based there. There is at least one DC-3 (bigger twin) and a bunch Beech 18 style twins based there. As for the a patten my friend who also just recently started flying out of there said the locals told him the day time pattern is normally fly directly at the Cross at 700ft until you are sure you are going to Crap you pants, and then turn base. After doing it a few times I would add when turning base you are showing the spectators on top of the hill the bottom of your aircraft. and don’t expect it to be a standard rate turn to base, it will require a more normal (for me) 30 degree bank turn or better. You can help by not turning full 90 degree base about a 45 degree base turn will get you further away from the runway and help you get down better but will require a good 30 degrees or more bank turn for about a 135 degree turn to final. With the Mooney it pretty much requires being power off to get down to the runway. Disclaimer are at this point I have only done it a few times so far.
My friend also said he was advised that if you are uncomfortable with the recommended 700 foot pattern approach inside the hill, the local pilots have told him to just fly a 1000 foot pattern and overfly or fly around the hill and make a long final. I think they recommend the 700 foot pattern because the fly a lot of Cub/Champ style aircraft out of there and don’t want to normally be doing the large pattern flying around the hill requires.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
 
The restaurant appeared to be open, but sign said outdoor dining only. Didn’t check it out this time, went to French Valley and Hemet instead for Lunch.

Brian
 
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brcase said:
I just spent the weekend flying out of FLABOB a with a friend that as a Mooney based there. There is at least one DC-3 (bigger twin) and a bunch Beech 18 style twins based there. As for the a patten my friend who also just recently started flying out of there said the locals told him the day time pattern is normally fly directly at the Cross at 700ft until you are sure you are going to Crap you pants, and then turn base. After doing it a few times I would add when turning base you are showing the spectators on top of the hill the bottom of your aircraft. and don’t expect it to be a standard rate turn to base, it will require a more normal (for me) 30 degree bank turn or better. You can help by not turning full 90 degree base about a 45 degree base turn will get you further away from the runway and help you get down better but will require a good 30 degrees or more bank turn for about a 135 degree turn to final. With the Mooney it pretty much requires being power off to get down to the runway. Disclaimer are at this point I have only done it a few times so far.
My friend also said he was advised that if you are uncomfortable with the recommended 700 foot pattern approach inside the hill, the local pilots have told him to just fly a 1000 foot pattern and overfly or fly around the hill and make a long final. I think they recommend the 700 foot pattern because the fly a lot of Cub/Champ style aircraft out of there and don’t want to normally be doing the large pattern flying around the hill requires.

Brian
CFIIG/ASEL
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Awesome! Thanks.
 
I flew out of RIR in a 400-series Cessna once and it was no biggie. There weren't very many houses surrounding it back then, though...
 
luvflyin said:
Another one that gets me is Scappoose, SPB and San Luis Obispo, SBP. I have lived near and flown into both.
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Then there's my former home field, VUO, Pearson Field in Vancouver WA. Six or seven years ago the identifier was misprinted as a more-logical "VOU" on the sectional chart. I contacted NOS to let them know and they issued a correction in the Chart Supplement.
 
Ah, Flabob. The approach where you fly directly towards the mountain, turn just in time, fly in between the mobile homes and make sure all the homeless are off the runway. Yes f you come back to your plane not on blocks and rims stolen it was a good day.

I Departed there once at night when the airport had no power. That was fun.
 
..well FLABOB is off for the weekend..

as it turns out they're repaving the runway! so now to find somewhere else to go

Santa Paula is next on the agenda, with their 2,665' runway that'll be on the shorter side!
 
..or it looks like Cable's Cafe "Maniac Mike" is open so maybe go there instead..!
 
Pilawt said:
I know a guy who based his Turbo Aztec at Fallbrook (L18) and its 2160'-long hilltop runway.
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There's a guy with a great no frills flying YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwSBBEy12WH25eAonqyCeiw/videos
He has a couple good Aztec clips on there, truly a remarkably rugged plane

I'm still "green" with twins (~50 hrs) so ramping up with caution. The runway at AVX is 3K and I have no issues *coasting* off the second taxiway there with virtually no need for brakes.. but the jump from 3K to around 2K is not insignificant!

It's less the landing I'm worried about, I'm good at getting it on the numbers. More the takeoff and that potential 1/10000000 chance of the engine out at that super critical section. Not too many options off the departure end of either runway at SZP
 
You should definitely go there when you have a chance. I've been there a few times just driving thru (when my son was at UC Riverside) and flew in once. Was truly intimidated by the cross and the hill when on left downwind for 24...but gutted it out and was just fine. Don't really remember how I transitioned thru the KRAL Delta so it prob wasn't a deal at all. I do remember contacting SOCAL on departure but not sure if I called KRAL first.

The airport has a nice charm and I enjoyed just walking around. When I flew in, I walked thru the neighborhood to the main strip to catch a bus to UCR. There was no charge for parking because they want people to fly in (at the time). Despite what some may think, the neighborhood has charm as well. (Just because poorer people live there, it doesn't mean its bad).
 
Maniac Mike's at Cable is doing well! They had a fire there about 1.5 years ago, but they redid the inside and put in a large patio area. If you fly in from the north for Runway 24, enter on extended left crosswind over the 06 numbers.

Have you been to Hemet-Ryan? Bambi's Hangar One Cafe is wonderful in that high-cholesterol throwback kind of way. Go over to CalFire on the field and check out the OV-10 Bronco and the converted torpedo-bomber firefighting planes. Take the tour and make sure to buy a T-shirt to support our firefighters.

Hemet's also good in that there's typically a lot less traffic in the pattern than Cable or French Valley.
 
All the flying around the various patches and I've not made it to FLABOB either. If folks are going, let me know and I'll join! I'm in a light sport, but i'll make sure to float down the runway to fit-in. :p

Hemet-Ryan's Hangar One cafe is delightful, but flying in, I've had to go around more than once due to traffic. I've learned to announce my downwind entry (teardrop) over the reservoir...

Now, if i can ever find Fallbrook... tried twice and couldn't visually see the field. Might try a third time (third time's the charm?) :p
 
rtk11 said:
All the flying around the various patches and I've not made it to FLABOB either. If folks are going, let me know and I'll join! I'm in a light sport, but i'll make sure to float down the runway to fit-in
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Rgbeard said:
Let me know when you're going, and a "HEAVY" Turbo Lance might join.
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Will do! They're repaving the runway now so it looks like they're down for the count at least through June 4.. probably can plan for one of their "third Saturday" display days?

rtk11 said:
Hemet-Ryan's Hangar One cafe is delightful
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I've been three times now and each time the cafe is closed! And it's always just for the one day I'm there, per their note on the door! It's cool spot though, I like coming in over the damn.. it's a quick hope over over to French Valley from there for lunch

rtk11 said:
Now, if i can ever find Fallbrook
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It hides, but it's in the patch of grass and white buildings. It's a cool spot and not nearly as daunting as people make it seem.. short runway but there's no terrain off the departure end
 
Tantalum said:
(Fallbrook)
It hides, but it's in the patch of grass and white buildings. It's a cool spot and not nearly as daunting as people make it seem.. short runway but there's no terrain off the departure end
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It's a little disconcerting after you land and taxi back to take off and a crowd has gathered in the parking lot to see if you'll make it.
 
Tantalum said:
Will do! They're repaving the runway now so it looks like they're down for the count at least through June 4.. probably can plan for one of their "third Saturday" display days?
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Let me know - I'm good for a visit there, KMT, F70... I'm always in if food is involved. :p

Tantalum said:
It hides, but it's in the patch of grass and white buildings. It's a cool spot and not nearly as daunting as people make it seem.. short runway but there's no terrain off the departure end
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I'll try again. First time was my cross country solo and I swore up/down/sideways I could see that I was over the airport per the charts, but I couldn't see it! Second time was late last year and the clouds built-up quickly along the coast, so I decided against flying into Oceanside (KOKB) and tried looking for Fallbrook, but I couldn't visually identify it through the gaps in the clouds. I'll try again... I need to get more seat time this year before flying out to Page, AZ for a gathering of pilots there in October. (Arranged the the CT Fliers group and forum)
 
rtk11 said:
Let me know - I'm good for a visit there, KMT, F70... I'm always in if food is involved. :p



I'll try again. First time was my cross country solo and I swore up/down/sideways I could see that I was over the airport per the charts, but I couldn't see it! Second time was late last year and the clouds built-up quickly along the coast, so I decided against flying into Oceanside (KOKB) and tried looking for Fallbrook, but I couldn't visually identify it through the gaps in the clouds. I'll try again... I need to get more seat time this year before flying out to Page, AZ for a gathering of pilots there in October. (Arranged the the CT Fliers group and forum)
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It is easy to miss and because the airport itself is on sort of hilly terrain it doesn't naturally stand out as a big flat area.. I generally cheat with the GPS to set myself up for the 45 downwind and then suddenly see it a few miles out
 
Tantalum said:
It is easy to miss and because the airport itself is on sort of hilly terrain it doesn't naturally stand out as a big flat area.. I generally cheat with the GPS to set myself up for the 45 downwind and then suddenly see it a few miles out
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You're a better GPS citizen than I am. I usually aim for 3 mile final and try to sneak in a straight-in. I find it easier to spot runways that way, even if it annoys the locals a bit... :D
 
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