First time twin owner

Do they want an EAB or a Certificated plane.

310s are a dime a dozen and that makes them a good choice.

Is the buyer multi rated or will the plane be used for learning? If so the centerline may not be the way to go.
 
Wow, this surprised me on the Defiant: "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] 165 kts at 18 gal/hr", my 310 does better.

It would depend on what the guy wants the plane for. If he wants to tinker with something, the Defiant would be cool. If he wants to fly places reliably, I'd probably send him to the 310.
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When I make it to first time twin buyer, I will probably lean toward a twin Comanche in nice condition, and neither of the two you propose.
 
alfadog said:
When I make it to first time twin buyer, I will probably lean toward a twin Comanche in nice condition, and neither of the two you propose.
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I bought a turbo'd Travelair for my first plane, great flying plane, economical, it's another one to put on the list.
 
The twin market is in the dumps. There are some great deals, but there also are a lot of planes which have been neglected for several years.

It doesn't really matter which twin you get for the first one -- they all will perform okay. The reality is that the prices of twins will most likely continue to drop as the price of fuel increases.

That being said, buying quality may be the best way to go. Also, buy with the full understanding that the plane you buy may be worth exactly zero in a few years. When enough of them are being parted out, there won't be any value in the parts. Maybe the engines and some avionics will be worth something.

Not to say that this is so negative to put anyone off buying a twin. Three weeks ago I bought a B55 Baron. Why? I was shopping for an A36 Bonanza, and realized that I could get the Baron for about $75,000 less than a similarly-equipped Bonanza.

There are a lot of fine twins being sold for far under $100,000 these days. It's a good time to buy.
 
Tom,
I absolutely agree with your assessment! Now is a great time to buy a Twin, my only problem is that the wife really liked our Cirrus and wants another one. While, I'm trying to convince her to get a twin because I like the 6 seats, I like/hate the extra engine (more $$). A used Cirrus is around $250K and yearly maintenance will be about $5K or less, but a used twin will be $100K and around $10-15K for yearly maintenance. So you pay less up front, but more over time. In the end, their is no free lunch.
 
jmp470 said:
Tom,
I absolutely agree with your assessment! Now is a great time to buy a Twin, my only problem is that the wife really liked our Cirrus and wants another one. While, I'm trying to convince her to get a twin because I like the 6 seats, I like/hate the extra engine (more $$). A used Cirrus is around $250K and yearly maintenance will be about $5K or less, but a used twin will be $100K and around $10-15K for yearly maintenance. So you pay less up front, but more over time. In the end, their is no free lunch.
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In that light,it would be the Defiant, as the cheaper to own over 5 years.
 
Tom Gresham said:
The twin market is in the dumps. There are some great deals, but there also are a lot of planes which have been neglected for several years.

It doesn't really matter which twin you get for the first one -- they all will perform okay. The reality is that the prices of twins will most likely continue to drop as the price of fuel increases.

That being said, buying quality may be the best way to go. Also, buy with the full understanding that the plane you buy may be worth exactly zero in a few years. When enough of them are being parted out, there won't be any value in the parts. Maybe the engines and some avionics will be worth something.

There are a lot of fine twins being sold for far under $100,000 these days. It's a good time to buy.
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I hear ya, I wasn't looking for a plane when Jerry called me to tell me this one was going to be for sale and that it's had about $200k in rehab work done over the last 12 years, has super low time engines and new props at a price I wouldn't be able to refuse since he wanted the hangar for a different plane project. Well, I went and look, and f- if he wasn't right lol, just couldn't walk away from a gorgeous redhead. I'll probably never run into a plane in this condition for this kind of a deal ever again. I've got more in the panel than in the rest of the plane and that's ok, I can complete the panel with G300 in the right side and an autopilot and a GNS-750 and still be under the price of an A-36 with a mid time engine and no glass.
 
He can buy mine near that price, they can't be more than a few serial numbers apart and unless he's one of those guy's that's gotta go fast or always is hauling a heavy load, the 470s are less costly engines to run by a pretty fair margin.
 
Henning said:
Wow, this surprised me on the Defiant: "[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] 165 kts at 18 gal/hr",
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I agree, I'd have expected better, too. Maybe because it does not have CS props?
 
jhausch said:
I agree, I'd have expected better, too. Maybe because it does not have CS props?
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You guys would have to show me 165 knots on 18 GPM in a 310. in other than a glide.
 
Tom-D said:
You guys would have to show me 165 knots on 18 GPM in a 310. in other than a glide.
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Yes sir, not a problem, I do 180 on 21, if I pull the red handles back for 18 I'm right around 165, that's why it surprised me.
 
Henning said:
Yes sir, not a problem, I do 180 on 21, if I pull the red handles back for 18 I'm right around 165, that's why it surprised me.
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That's 9 gallons each on a 0-470 ?

At 11.5 gallons each on the 0-360, the defiant should be around 200, with MT constant speed props it should be very comparable to the 310, at 25% of the maintenance, no augmenters, no retract L/G, simple fuel system, and owner maintenance.
 
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