FAA Burn Certification?

[poadeleted21]

Replacing the interior in my cherokee, just wondering what the odds are of this having burn certificates?

Yes, I found part of a pair of blue jeans holding my wall panels together... It was ACTUALLY a good job, you can see the carpet tucked and glued there at the bottom and it was all ironed and felt starched.

 

[Tom-D]

Your PA 28 doesn't need burn certs for part 91 use.

 

[poadeleted21]

Your PA 28 doesn't need burn certs for part 91 use.

i use it for part 121

 

[Tom-D]

i use it for part 121

Are you in compliance with Part 119.5

you will be required to comply with your operating certificate which dictates your requirements. which might be "flame resistant" not "fire proof"

 

[poadeleted21]

Are you in compliance with Part 119.5

you will be required to comply with your operating certificate which dictates your requirements. which might be "flame resistant" not "fire proof"

Actually, I am. I have contacted Boeing and they have agreed to outsource their interior on the 787 to Wrangler.

 

[poadeleted20]

Your PA 28 doesn't need burn certs for part 91 use.

You may not need "burn certs," but you do need materials which have been tested. See Greg Amy's excellent article on the subject for all the details, including reference to AC 23-2A.

 

[Tom-D]

You may not need "burn certs," but you do need materials which have been tested. See Greg Amy's excellent article on the subject for all the details, including reference to AC 23-2A.

A quote from your reference
Parsing the regs

However, this got me thinking: Where did I get that rule interpretation? At first glance, FAR 23.853 seems pretty clear: All materials in our non-commuter-category FAR 23 aircraft must use "flame-resistant" materials. (The full FAR 23 is available on the FAA web site; it makes great bedtime reading...) So, keep that web page open and follow along as we parse FAR 23.853:

Is his aircraft a FAR 23 certified aircraft?

What fabric will the FAA allow in a 121 operator certificate?

 

[Tom-D]

Actually, I am. I have contacted Boeing and they have agreed to outsource their interior on the 787 to Wrangler.

Now you are talking part 25, your PA 28 isn't a transport category aircraft.

 

[Capt. Geoffrey Thorpe]

What fabric will the FAA allow in a 121 operator certificate?

I think it would depend on if you post pictures of it on the internet...

 

[Tom-D]

You may not need "burn certs," but you do need materials which have been tested. See Greg Amy's excellent article on the subject for all the details, including reference to AC 23-2A.

That's not really true either..

If I pull a OEM leather & wool interior from an early 170/2 and replace it with a new leather & wool interior must I test the materials?

no.

 

[poadeleted20]

That's not really true either..

If I pull a OEM leather & wool interior from an early 170/2 and replace it with a new leather & wool interior must I test the materials?

no.

I didn't say you had to test them. Read the article.

 

[Tom-D]

I didn't say you had to test them. Read the article.

I did, it says

(a) "The materials must be at least flame resistant"

OK, sounds easy enough. So, where's the definition of "flame resistant," and how do we prove it? Well a simple check of FAR 1, "Definitions and Abbreviations," defines:

"Flame resistant" means not susceptible to combustion to the point of propagating a flame, beyond safe limits, after the ignition source is removed.

Problem is, while the FAA defines what it is, they don't tell us how to demonstrate it. Traditionally, the simple "Bic test" was sufficient ... you ignite the edge of the material on fire with a lighter, and see if it goes out by itself.


show me any FAR rule that says any one must test materials, prior to return to service.

 

[Tom-D]

I'll make it easy on ya, look at FAR 43.13, and the piper maintenance manual.

IF there is a requirement, that is where it will come from, not the FARs, I'd think that any one writing for the EAA or AOPA would know that rather than going the AC route.

 

[poadeleted21]

I'm a little slow..... My intention was to poke fun at my denim plane not launch into a FAR discussion, but, my assumption was that I needed FAA blessed material, i.e. I can pick up some kydex, since it meets some sort of FAA standard. You sayin' I can just go down to wal-mart and pickup some material and install it?

 

[Tom-D]

I'm a little slow..... My intention was to poke fun at my denim plane not launch into a FAR discussion, but, my assumption was that I needed FAA blessed material, i.e. I can pick up some kydex, since it meets some sort of FAA standard. You sayin' I can just go down to wal-mart and pickup some material and install it?

You can do what ever makes your A&P happy.

There are sprays that will make most fabrics comply with the flame resistant rule.

 

[Dan Thomas]

If you go to the local upholstery shop and ask to see samples, those samples often have fire ratings on the back. FMVSS 121 and FAR 43 are commonly noted, among others. Buy something with the FAR 43 rating.

Dan

 

[Tom-D]

If you go to the local upholstery shop and ask to see samples, those samples often have fire ratings on the back. FMVSS 121 and FAR 43 are commonly noted, among others. Buy something with the FAR 43 rating.

Dan

OMG you mean to tell me you can actually buy fabric with a known fire rating, and nobody needs to test it?

What's that say about those who think we all need burn certificates?