El Paso vs Lubbock

Discussion in 'Hangar Talk' started by Harold Rutila, May 20, 2016.

  1. Harold Rutila

    Harold Rutila Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2016
    Messages:
    420
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Harold Rutila
    I have a potential opportunity to relocate to El Paso or Lubbock. Can anyone provide me some insight into either of these two cities?

    Thanks in advance for your input. I have to decide by next Thursday!
     
  2. NoHeat

    NoHeat En-Route

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2009
    Messages:
    4,178
    Location:
    Iowa City, IA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    17
    From Lubbock you can fly north east south or west and there is no terrain. From El Paso you can fly east or west and there are mountains.
     
  3. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    Messages:
    5,121
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    hindsight2020
    Dude, Lubbock. The border sucks. I'm serious.
     
    zaitcev likes this.
  4. pikespeakmtnman

    pikespeakmtnman Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2012
    Messages:
    344
    Location:
    Colorado Springs
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    n/a
    I've never even been close to El Paso.....but my vote is still solidly for Lubbock
     
  5. KSCessnaDriver

    KSCessnaDriver Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2008
    Messages:
    2,184
    Location:
    C62
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    KSCessnaDriver
    My personal opinion would be ELP, but that's because I hate humidity
     
  6. Frogs97

    Frogs97 Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2013
    Messages:
    401
    Location:
    Fort Worth, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Frogs97
    I grew up in El Paso, and really didn't like it all that much. But Lubbock is the armpit of Texas. If you're a bird hunter, then you have some great opportunities for lots of different kinds of hunting all around it. Other than that, it sucks. There's seriously nothing there but dirt. At least in El Paso there's great food, and proximity to some good times in the New Mexico mountains.
     
  7. RyanShort1

    RyanShort1 En-Route

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2010
    Messages:
    3,708
    Location:
    Dallas, Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    RyanShort1
    I'd personally take El Paso - but there are good things about Lubbock. I like the variety and options closer to El Paso. Lubbock is probably safer, more boring.
     
  8. SCCutler

    SCCutler Administrator Management Council Member

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2005
    Messages:
    17,028
    Location:
    Dallas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Spike Cutler
    El Paso was a complete mystery to me - a place to drive through on the way to California - until recently, when I've gone there several times on business. Works out to be a pretty nice place, generally clean and good weather.

    It has been so long since I was in Lubbock, I could not comment - but with as many snarky comments as it gets, there must be something good about it! :)
     
  9. GlennAB1

    GlennAB1 Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2015
    Messages:
    4,889
    Location:
    Home will always be Vandalia, OH
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    GlennAB1
    When I lived in that neck of the woods, EL Paso was on all the rock bands tour schedule.... don't know if it's still that way, or about Lubbock... if it matters to ya.
     
  10. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,423
    Location:
    west Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Dave Taylor
  11. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Messages:
    23,226
    Location:
    Alabama
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
  12. navigator44

    navigator44 Pre-Flight

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2009
    Messages:
    64
    Location:
    Diana, Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Navigator44
    I lived and worked in Lubbock. The city is laid out nicely and it is easy to get around in. The weather from March thru October is very nice. The humidity avgs. about 30% year round. The wind does blow sometimes, but generally avgs. around 10 to 15. The winters are usually mild, but on occasion expect some below freezing weather, but usually only for a short time.

    I have visited El Paso, and the scenery is different and for a plains person a nice change. El Paso is rather difficult to get around in. Traffic can be very bad and somewhat hazardous. I enjoyed the mountains, but it can get very cold and the wind can sometimes be horrendous. As a pilot, I would much rather be based in Lubbock. El Paso is along way from the many attractions in Texas. You fly east quite a while before reaching any major population. Same for going south.
     
  13. bikert

    bikert Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2015
    Messages:
    346
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    bikert
    That is a heinous choice! :eek:

    I'd have to vote for Lubbock reluctantly. Hell Paso is on the border with all the associated issues. It's as ugly as hell too. It is as far as hell from anywhere. Lot's of hells. That is why it is called Hell Paso.

    Lubbock is not too far by comparison from Dallas, Denver, Santa Fe, etc.
     
  14. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,423
    Location:
    west Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Dave Taylor
    "Things are closer to the middle of the pack in El Paso "
    they provide a link to the report.
     
  15. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,423
    Location:
    west Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Dave Taylor
    El Paso seems a lot more lively to me, greater variety of stores, restaurants, activities, and diversity of people. The locals tell me they have figured out how to avoid the sometimes-unpleasant traffic. El Paso is nearer more interesting geography.
    Lubbock seemed plastic and boring and grid-like with a surfeit of big box and chain stores to me, but I have not spend more than a few hours there. Plus they have a FSDO :(
    They both get decent weather and occasional hellacious windstorms.
    Both have really good medical facilities. Both have really cool flying possibilities. Both have aviation museums nearby.
     
  16. GRG55

    GRG55 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2015
    Messages:
    9,258
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Aztec Flyer

    Whichever has available hangar space at the lowest cost, and the cheapest avgas. :D
     
  17. Fearless Tower

    Fearless Tower Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Jan 1, 2010
    Messages:
    15,459
    Location:
    Norfolk, VA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Fearless Tower
    This is a good point. El Paso is a bit more developed and closer to AZ/NM.

    But, you might want to contact your auto insurance and compare. I've been told by insurance guys that El Paso is one of the worst places auto insurance.
     
  18. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    6,632
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    Lubbock will give you a better OA experience. ELP you are in the heart of the border wars. Seriously. If you are close to the fence, your opportunity to hear gunfire will increase exponentially.

    People who want to live in ELP are from ELP. People who are not, end up leaving. Been there, worked there, don't really have any desire to go back.
     
  19. mscard88

    mscard88 Touchdown! Greaser!

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2015
    Messages:
    23,226
    Location:
    Alabama
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mark
    I've always had a bad view of ELP 'cause that's where they shot Marty Robbins. ;)
     
    Zeldman likes this.
  20. Let'sgoflying!

    Let'sgoflying! Touchdown! Greaser! PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2005
    Messages:
    18,423
    Location:
    west Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Dave Taylor
    Many have told me and I have read that this is not at all true. Could they be mistaken?
     
  21. Harold Rutila

    Harold Rutila Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2016
    Messages:
    420
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Harold Rutila
    Thanks for the replies. Lots of good things to consider here. As of right now, I am leaning towards Lubbock over El Paso. I was impressed by Lubbock's 14% economic growth rate and 2.9% unemployment, too. Doesn't sound bad compared to the midwest U.S., where I'm from.

    I've got a couple of other potential options including Baton Rouge, LA; Lake Charles, LA; Wichita, KS; Des Moines, IA; and Ft. Smith, AR. I have contacts in those other cities but none in the west side of Texas. This is for work as an ATC. We got our placement list yesterday at the academy.
     
  22. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    6,632
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    What do you want to k ow about Ft Smith ? You'd be working for razorback approach. Income tax is about 6% for AR. Texas is 0.

    Lots of thunderstorms roll through there. COst of living is low. not a lot to do. Fayetteville is about 45 min away and lots to do there.

    Okc is about 2 hours away. Lake Tenkiller is a big draw if you are into boating and about 40 min west.
     
    krock918316 likes this.
  23. Everskyward

    Everskyward Experimenter

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2005
    Messages:
    33,127
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Everskyward
    Out of all those places I would probably pick Wichita. I like the coast and the mountains but if those were my choices....
     
  24. RyanShort1

    RyanShort1 En-Route

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2010
    Messages:
    3,708
    Location:
    Dallas, Texas
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    RyanShort1
    I think El Paso would be a lot more fun with ATC, personally. Gotta vector people around stuff, keep them out of military airspace, crossing the border, etc... and in Lubbock, it's just a bunch of military trainers going around the pattern all day.
     
  25. Ravioli

    Ravioli Final Approach PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Dec 1, 2014
    Messages:
    7,959
    Location:
    Somewhere else
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Guest
    From that list - Ft. Smith, AR. Distant second is Des Moines, but it gets really cold there for 3-4 months a year.
     
  26. SoonerAviator

    SoonerAviator Final Approach

    Joined:
    Jul 21, 2014
    Messages:
    6,352
    Location:
    Broken Arrow, OK
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    SoonerAviator
    I'd have to go with Ft Smith on that list for sure, with El Paso coming in last.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  27. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    Messages:
    5,121
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    hindsight2020
    Not having a family colors these kinds of vocational decision matrices. Do we know if the OP has a family?
     
  28. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    6,632
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    I know not what thou hast iterated on behalf of the OP.
     
  29. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    Messages:
    5,121
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    hindsight2020
    Sorry I just don't know if he did. I only speak for myself of course, but I would prefer to raise my family in Lubbock than anywhere in the mexican border. I wouldn't base my domicile decision based on marginally considering my job funner than another. Ultimately if that was that important to my life contentment, I would commute or geobachelor. But like I said, it's just one man's opinion.
     
  30. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    6,632
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    I was asked about taking a promotion there. I was like, no way in hell chief. Not gonna happen. Evvaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
     
  31. Harold Rutila

    Harold Rutila Pre-takeoff checklist

    Joined:
    Jan 22, 2016
    Messages:
    420
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Harold Rutila
    Nope, no wife/gf/kids/etc. Looking into Ft. Smith currently.
     
  32. timwinters

    timwinters Ejection Handle Pulled PoA Supporter

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2008
    Messages:
    13,737
    Location:
    Conway, MO
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    LTD
    I've been to all of 'em, and of all those choices, Des Moines is by far the nicest. No contest.
     
    Lachlan and Mason like this.
  33. Unit74

    Unit74 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2014
    Messages:
    6,632
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Unit74
    If you want to chat about Ft Smith, pm me your # and I'll call tonight. I work all day today.
     
  34. ETres

    ETres Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2012
    Messages:
    644
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    ETres
    Easy choice: Lubbock. Folks that rag on it either haven't been there in a long time (if at all) or have that snarky attitude of contempt and condescension for anything, anyplace, or anyone west of Ft. Worth. Yes, the spring windy season can stir up the dust from all the agriculture, but otherwise the weather on the Texas Plains is usually wonderful.
     
  35. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    Messages:
    5,121
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    hindsight2020
    When the time came to close down AETC bases, you can always tell where the nice locations are, cuz that's the ones mother blue will close. I can tell you if Reese was still open and I was told I got another 12 years left to get an Active Duty retirement, even in this airline hiring environment, I'd probably be staying in.

    Alas, they kept Laughlin open...which is why I'm quitting and swtiching careers. No kidding, crazy as it sounds: Location. We can't live holding our breath any longer, and my parents nor the grandbaby are getting any younger. Literally the singular reason I'm throwing a military retirement in the trash can. Life's too short to spend decades living in a craphole at the expense of your family's happiness and prosperity. Have several friends who have separated from service based on similar experiences at Biggs(Ft. Bliss) in ELP. America is a big Country, we'd be remiss to waste so much potential by living in the mexican border.

    Glad to hear the OP is considering literal "greener pastures". Good choice.
     
  36. Cooter

    Cooter Ejection Handle Pulled

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2015
    Messages:
    2,412
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Cooter
    You don't have to throw the retirement away, there's always the Guard and Reserve. You'll just have to wait a little longer t get it.
     
  37. MikeELP

    MikeELP Pattern Altitude

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2006
    Messages:
    1,645
    Location:
    El Paso, TX; Santa Teresa, NM
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Mike Bruening
    El Paso gets a lot of bad raps, but it's actually a very nice city to live in. Despite being right on the border, crime here is very low.
     
  38. hindsight2020

    hindsight2020 Final Approach

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    Messages:
    5,121
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    hindsight2020
    Yeah, I didn't go into detail cuz I didn't want to derail the thread. I AM Reserves already (active status aka AGR). The retirement I was talking about is the active duty one. 15 years of foregone annuity payments until 60 (when a reserve retirement could be cashed in, minus whatever chunks of 90-day blocks you could bump the disbursement age down by) is not chump change. It's 6/10th of a million dollars, in my most expensive household decades (45-60). That's real money right there.

    But, Ive decided that my 70s aged parents' ability to interact with my son before they die or get too old to know their own names, or my wife's ability to have a good job market for herself and educational options for our son, to be worth the opportunity cost of laying down half a million dollars. It's a monster hand I'm laying down. I figured, we can't take it with us when we die so by my common core math, I'm ahead by folding. Oh but by the grace of God go I. Sure, the airlines may just dump again for another 10 years and make my gamble look pretty foolish. But at this point, being closer to 40 than 20 with almost two decades of college, military separations,a divorce, and burying friends in the military, it's time for me to let my family live a little. I've certainly come to question how genuine people are in projecting their supposed respect and admiration for this profession, considering how few are willing to endure these locations, how they keep chippin away at the retirement and QOL indeces such as this border base BS (I'll never forget a chick I went on a couple dates with, tell me to hit her up if I ever got stationed somewhere close to her nice city and how she regretted it but dating me based on location would be career suicide. stay classy San Antonio).

    The ability to live where you want is a luxury I've never had. Airline pilots have 99 problems, but living where their families are happy isn't one of them. a 16% B fund is not a nice as the mil retirement, but it should help me bridge the gap when the reserve one kicks in.

    Sorry for the derail now back to the OPs question.
     
  39. colojo

    colojo Line Up and Wait

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2013
    Messages:
    684
    Location:
    Fullerton (KFUL)
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    Colojo
    I don't have a dog in this fight but I remember seeing this standup routine a few years ago and thought it was funny:

     
    NoHeat and MikeELP like this.
  40. NoHeat

    NoHeat En-Route

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2009
    Messages:
    4,178
    Location:
    Iowa City, IA
    Display Name:

    Display name:
    17
    Yes.

    Until I checked the numbers, I would not have believed it, but El Paso has less crime than Des Moines IA. Less than a lot of similarly sized cities.