Early Mooneys

A few out there with wood wings and tail feathers. The wood tails are VERY rare, but I have seen one. There is an AD requiring frequent inspections of the tail and if any sign is detected of failure then it must be replaced with metal. The above only applies to A and B models. C was metal throughout.

Also Standard T panel configuration wasn't in Mooneys until 1969. Prior was shotgun style.
 
RotorAndWing said:
In this thread you claimed to have knowledge on them (even though it was glaringly incorrect)
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Weren't we talking about the "A" wooden wing in that thread? I do know how they are built and why they had problems and quit making the "A" but the "A" isn't the only model made in the 60s.

Once again you quote out of context which shows who you are.

The one in the link is a "C" why are we talking about the "A"?
 
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Jaybird180 said:
http://www.mooneypilots.com/old/mapalog/woodwing.html

I think the C Mooneys had metal spars, Tom but I'm not 100%. Can't find a reference. The above has a little info about wood wing Mooneys.
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"A"'s had wood wings and originally had wood tails. Later converted to metal tail ( and earlier wood tails converted).

"B"'s were all metal as were "C"s.

There were no metal wing Mooneys with wood spars, nor were there any wood wing Mooneys with wood wings covered in metal as Tom suggested in an earlier post.
 
Incorrect.

M20A was Wood Tail and Wing
AD came out on tail and those with issues were converted to metal.
M20B came with metal tail and wood wing
M20C was metal wing and tail

Again, I can't say anything about the spar, but it doesn't make sense to me to have a wood spar on a metal skinned wing. I wonder what the ribs would be made of (if such thing exists).
 
Jaybird180 said:
Incorrect.

M20A was Wood Tail and Wing
AD came out on tail and those with issues were converted to metal.
M20B came with metal tail and wood wing
M20C was metal wing and tail

Again, I can't say anything about the spar, but it doesn't make sense to me to have a wood spar on a metal skinned wing. I wonder what the ribs would be made of (if such thing exists).
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Better check your facts.

http://www.theplaneexchange.com/reviews/mooney.html
 
Jaybird180 said:
Incorrect.

M20A was Wood Tail and Wing
AD came out on tail and those with issues were converted to metal.
M20B came with metal tail and wood wing
M20C was metal wing and tail

Again, I can't say anything about the spar, but it doesn't make sense to me to have a wood spar on a metal skinned wing. I wonder what the ribs would be made of (if such thing exists).
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You missed that by one notch by forgetting the original was an M-20 not an M-20A.
 
RotorAndWing said:
There were no metal wing Mooneys with wood spars, nor were there any wood wing Mooneys with wood wings covered in metal as Tom suggested in an earlier post.
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Would you like to wager there are none metalized?
 
Tom-D said:
Have you ever owned one?
Have you ever completed an annual on one?
Have you ever even flown one?
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Never owned one. Great airplanes if I was in the market I would consider one.

Did an annual on a friends '66 C. Kinda tight to work on, not horribly bad.

I've flown the B, the C, the E and J (201).
 
RotorAndWing said:
Never owned one. Great airplanes if I was in the market I would consider one.

Did an annual on a friends '66 C. Kinda tight to work on, not horribly bad.

I've flown the B, the C, the E and J (201).
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If the aircraft was a 64 "D" but had retract, what would you be looking for? (concerned with)
 
RotorAndWing said:
I never said it was, I just used that as a quick reference.

Please check your facts.
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A great example of find some thing on the internet saying what you want to think, like here, every body's an expert
 
RotorAndWing said:
You have to ask someone else. I'm aware of the D and the conversion, but don't have experience with that particular model.
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If a "D" is converted to retract, doesn't it become a "C"?
 
RotorAndWing said:
Still remains as a D.
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The big question rears it's ugly head once again, You say you are an FAA employee, yet you didn't think of the major modification paper work to requires to do that retract mod.

That's the first thing any FAA inspector would have thought of.
 
Tom-D said:
The big question rears it's ugly head once again, You say you are an FAA employee, yet you didn't think of the major modification paper work to requires to do that retract mod.

That's the first thing any FAA inspector would have thought of.
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What?

I thought this discussion was about early Mooneys??

You asked about a D model converted to a retract, I answered I was aware of them, but had no direct experience with one.

Then you drift off on a tangent of swapping data plates to make a D into a C (what logical reason would anyone do that?)

And now you're twisting this into yet another boorish attack.

Go troll somewhere else Tom.
 
Jaybird180 said:
M20B came with metal tail and wood wing
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My Larry Ball book says: "Beginning with the 1961 models all Mooneys were of all-metal construction".

In any case, why are we even discussing that? I'd be fine flying a Charlie if it weren't corroded.
 
zaitcev said:
My Larry Ball book says: "Beginning with the 1961 models all Mooneys were of all-metal construction".

In any case, why are we even discussing that? I'd be fine flying a Charlie if it weren't corroded.
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Mooney also made multiple models during the same calendar years, so you can't use year to determine how it should be equipped.
 
RotorAndWing said:
What?

I thought this discussion was about early Mooneys??

You asked about a D model converted to a retract, I answered I was aware of them, but had no direct experience with one.

Then you drift off on a tangent of swapping data plates to make a D into a C (what logical reason would anyone do that?)

And now you're twisting this into yet another boorish attack.

Go troll somewhere else Tom.
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Because the D was a bad idea from the beginning. It was reasoned that it would be purchased by flight schools to use as advanced trainers. They didn't sell many of them.

There's a "pristine" one on our Bulletin Board. Poor saps spent a lot of time and money restoring it to original D-Spec. Problem is: nobody wants a D. Most D's have been converted to C-Spec.

I first noticed the cork board ad about 2 years ago. Now the ad is just "there".
 
Jaybird180 said:
Because the D was a bad idea from the beginning. It was reasoned that it would be purchased by flight schools to use as advanced trainers. They didn't sell many of them.

There's a "pristine" one on our Bulletin Board. Poor saps spent a lot of time and money restoring it to original D-Spec. Problem is: nobody wants a D. Most D's have been converted to C-Spec.

I first noticed the cork board ad about 2 years ago. Now the ad is just "there".
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Agreed. My point being if someone took a stock D (fixed gear) and converted it to a retract (factory kit) what would be the purpose of trying to get a new data plate to call it a C?

Makes no sense.
 
Tom-D said:
109 mooneys on T-A-P any gotchas on the M20 early 60 versions

http://www.trade-a-plane.com/detail/Single+Engine+Piston/1962/Mooney/M20C/1544645.html
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Tom, I just looked at the ad. What can I say, you are an A&P, and I am not. Are you afraid of airframe corrosion? I am and that is what's getting the price slashed 50..60% on that thing. Usually an M20C with these numbers would sell for about $30..33k.

The price is extremely enticing. I could buy it if I were experienced in the maintenance of aluminum airplanes, if I could determine the extent of the corrosion during the prebuy, and if I determined that I can fix it easily. It may be a very nice airplane that scares buyers by its hideous paint and admission of corrosion, or it may be a hulk that is ready to be scrapped. I cannot tell.
 
Is this D-C Mooney conversion done under an STC and the original airworthiness certficiate, or is it a remanufacturing of the airplane complete with a new airworthiness certificate? If it's the former, I'm pretty darn sure the data plate remains the same, just as my Tigerized Cheetah still has its original AA-5A data plate. Every Cheetah-specific part has been replaced by Tiger parts, but it's still an AA-5A to the FAA -- just heavily modified.

Where that gets to be a problem is when I'm adding something else, like the K&N Challenger air filter, where I had a heck of a time getting the supplier to give me the right part and STC for my IA to stack on the STC's already installed. Those familiar with Tigers and Cheetas will realize that a Cheetah air filter does not fit in a Tiger's induction system. The supplier was not happy about sending me a Tiger part to go on an airplane with serial number AA5A-0856, but eventually, I talked them into it.
 
Pete, I agree with your assessment. I don't even think this would be worth scrap value.
 
Depends on where the corrosion is. There is a known problem with corrosion in the tube structure under the pilots window. I was told this can be a $20M+ repair and very few shops do it. Mooney SB208A&B need to be performed on any Mooney prebuy. 208B even it it was done before.
Here's model info from the Mooney Owner's website other good info there too.
http://www.mooneyevents.com/chrono.htm

Inspection article by Mooney guru Don Maxwell.
http://www.mooneypilots.com/mapalog/prepurchasehowwhy.html

And I'll attach a PDF of production I got from the Mooney factory website before it went down.
 

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RotorAndWing said:
What?

I thought this discussion was about early Mooneys??

You asked about a D model converted to a retract, I answered I was aware of them, but had no direct experience with one.

Then you drift off on a tangent of swapping data plates to make a D into a C (what logical reason would anyone do that?)

And now you're twisting this into yet another boorish attack.

Go troll somewhere else Tom.
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The question was put to you directly, what would you be concerned with. Never dawned on you that that was a major mod. You don't demonstrate the basic knowledge of a FAA ASI.

In Rons thread you demonstrated you don't know how the internal workings of a FSDO.
 
Ron Levy said:
Is this D-C Mooney conversion done under an STC and the original airworthiness certficiate, or is it a remanufacturing of the airplane complete with a new airworthiness certificate? If it's the former, I'm pretty darn sure the data plate remains the same, just as my Tigerized Cheetah still has its original AA-5A data plate. Every Cheetah-specific part has been replaced by Tiger parts, but it's still an AA-5A to the FAA -- just heavily modified.

Where that gets to be a problem is when I'm adding something else, like the K&N Challenger air filter, where I had a heck of a time getting the supplier to give me the right part and STC for my IA to stack on the STC's already installed. Those familiar with Tigers and Cheetas will realize that a Cheetah air filter does not fit in a Tiger's induction system. The supplier was not happy about sending me a Tiger part to go on an airplane with serial number AA5A-0856, but eventually, I talked them into it.
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My FSDO agrees with you, it remains a D, This aircraft was modded in the field the year it came out. No STC, back then it was completed on the ASIs approval.

I've yet to see the history files, but the owner says the 337s are there. we will see Friday.
 
Tom-D said:
The question was put to you directly, what would you be concerned with. Never dawned on you that that was a major mod. You don't demonstrate the basic knowledge of a FAA ASI.

In Rons thread you demonstrated you don't know how the internal workings of a FSDO.
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Jaybird180 said:
Incorrect.

M20A was Wood Tail and Wing
AD came out on tail and those with issues were converted to metal.
M20B came with metal tail and wood wing
M20C was metal wing and tail

Again, I can't say anything about the spar, but it doesn't make sense to me to have a wood spar on a metal skinned wing. I wonder what the ribs would be made of (if such thing exists).
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Negative. B had zero wood in it.
 
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