Dumb Question about PAPI

MBDiagMan

MBDiagMan

Final Approach
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Doc
I have shot several hundred landings at my local airport as a Student Pilot. When Wayne came over and flew with me last week, after the lesson in my plane, we went up in his beautiful 180 and he let me fly it around some. When we went back to the airport, I noticed that the PAPI was on as we approached.

I forgot to ask him about it at the time. Is it possible that it is Pilot Controlled like the runway lights?

Thanks for your patience with the dumb rookie question. I consulted the airport information and found nothing about it. The airport does indeed have PCL.

Doc
 
At the non-towered airports I've flown into - the VASIs are part of the PCL.

At the towered airports I've been to - the VASIs are on when the the rwy lights are on, at dusk (maybe in IMC, too, but I'm not rated). Otherwise, if you want them on you use the PCL.

I suppose PAPIs work the same way, but I can't remember the last time I saw any.
 
Thanks Mathew! It is looking like we will get some flying weather late this week, so I'll give it a try.

Since I've made several hundred landings WITHOUT a VASI or PAPI, I guess I can get by without them, but I would indeed like to be using them just to imbed one more thing into my mind with practice.
 
Yes, they are part of the PCL. Our airport manager gets mad when the local jetjocks key up the PCL to high intensity in the middle of broad dayight for a departure. So he just rekeys it to medium (saves a boatload of electricity).

Personally, PAPIs and VASIs didn't really "click" for me until after I already had my license.
 
Matthew said:
At the towered airports I've been to - the VASIs are on when the the rwy lights are on, at dusk (maybe in IMC, too, but I'm not rated). Otherwise, if you want them on you use the PCL.

I suppose PAPIs work the same way, but I can't remember the last time I saw any.
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At the towered airports I've been to, the VASI/PAPIs are on bright during the day and dimmed at night.
 
roncachamp said:
At the towered airports I've been to, the VASI/PAPIs are on bright during the day and dimmed at night.
Click to expand...

This is how three of the non-towered airports that I regularly land at operate, including my home field.
 
roncachamp said:
At the towered airports I've been to, the VASI/PAPIs are on bright during the day and dimmed at night.
Click to expand...

My towered airport normally leaves them off during the day - if you want them on, you key them. The rwy lights must be switched off in the tower during the day, though, because if you key the PCL only the VASIs come on.
 
Matthew said:
My towered airport normally leaves them off during the day - if you want them on, you key them. The rwy lights must be switched off in the tower during the day, though, because if you key the PCL only the VASIs come on.
Click to expand...

My towered airport has no control of the PAPIs in the control tower. They're on bright during the day because they wouldn't be very effective otherwise. They're on dim when it's dark because they'd be annoyingly bright otherwise.
 
roncachamp said:
My towered airport has no control of the PAPIs in the control tower. They're on bright during the day because they wouldn't be very effective otherwise. They're on dim when it's dark because they'd be annoyingly bright otherwise.
Click to expand...

Same here in Jackson Hole......

Ben.
 
OK - I now amend my earlier comment. At the towered airport I USED to fly from (it's been almost a year), the VASIs were off during the day unless you keyed them (or unless the tower turned them on). It sounds like they are on 24 hrs now.

The latest A/FD says:

ACTIVATE VASI Rwy 18, MALSR Rwy 36—CTAF. VASI Rwy 18 and Rwy 36 on 24 hrs.​
 
Morne said:
Yes, they are part of the PCL. Our airport manager gets mad when the local jetjocks key up the PCL to high intensity in the middle of broad dayight for a departure. So he just rekeys it to medium (saves a boatload of electricity).

Personally, PAPIs and VASIs didn't really "click" for me until after I already had my license.
Click to expand...


I understand them just fine. I used them constantly in my training 20 years ago. It's just that in my putt-putting around in my Cessna 140 I don't really need them. In a way I'm glad that I can operate fine without them since my ultimate goal is to fly out of a grass strip at home. I won't be setting up anything like a VASI or PAPI there.

Thanks again for your comments.

Doc
 
The PAPI finally came on line at 47N, and it's on all the time. Probably dimmed after dark; I'm not sure yet.
 
They're on all the time at CJR. (no tower). They might dim themselves at night. The PCL just turns on the runway lights an the REIL.
 
We have PAPIs on 7. When we first installed them, we left them on PCL day and night. Later, we found out that there is a problem with our brand of PAPI (Siemans) with condensation on the lenses when the temperature gets close to the dew point. With this condition, red becomes sort of pink and hard to distinguish from white (very dangerous). We now leave them on at night so that the $25 a pop limited life light bulbs ( 3 in each one) act as heaters to prevent the condensation. During the day, they are normally on PCL unless the visibility is poor, then we leave them on. They are very visible from a distance and a help in locating the airport.
 
In my plane, if I'm flying a PAPI or VASI then I'm not making the field if the fan stops turning. So, I don't fly the PAPI! Power off approaches are white over white every time.
 
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I saw it too, Doc, but we were talking about the landing practice drill and I didn't think about mentioning it. In any case I didn't activate it.

MBDiagMan said:
I have shot several hundred landings at my local airport as a Student Pilot. When Wayne came over and flew with me last week, after the lesson in my plane, we went up in his beautiful 180 and he let me fly it around some. When we went back to the airport, I noticed that the PAPI was on as we approached.

I forgot to ask him about it at the time. Is it possible that it is Pilot Controlled like the runway lights?

Thanks for your patience with the dumb rookie question. I consulted the airport information and found nothing about it. The airport does indeed have PCL.

Doc
Click to expand...
 
For some reason I assumed that PAPIs and VASIs were on all the time. I don't pay much attention to them in the day time so guess I never noticed when they were off.

Well now I know why I hear people clicking the mic to turn the lights on in the daytime.
 
wabower said:
I saw it too, Doc, but we were talking about the landing practice drill and I didn't think about mentioning it. In any case I didn't activate it.
Click to expand...


Well, now my curiosity is REALLY tweaked! I think I have flying weather this afternoon, so if my headache will go away I will find out this afternoon.

Thanks Wayne!

Doc
 
timwinters said:
In my plane, if I'm flying a PAPI or VASI then I'm not making the field if the fan stops turning. So, I don't fly the PAPI! Power off approaches are white over white every time.
Click to expand...
Don't fly many ILS's either?
 
roncachamp said:
At the towered airports I've been to, the VASI/PAPIs are on bright during the day and dimmed at night.
Click to expand...
At my home base the PAPI and VASI controls are really weird. IIRC, some are controlled by the tower (or MSP TRACON when the tower is closed), some are pilot controlled and the tower cannot turn them on without transmitting on the CTAF, and some can be PCL or tower controlled.
 
I fly out of an uncontrolled field and the PAPI's are on the PCL circuit with everything else except the beacon and obstruction lights. Most of the time (if they are on) they are all white with the approaches I fly until I get almost to the runway.
 
As I said, I never use it, but on one of my approaches yesterday, I kept hitting the PTT and sure enough it came on for 17. I don't know if there is one at the other end or not. As soon as the wind is again out of the North I will try it on 35.

Learn something new ever day!

Thanks for all the replies and comments.
Doc
 
On all the time at GAI too, no tower either. I just assumed they were always on everywhere!

flyingron said:
They're on all the time at CJR. (no tower). They might dim themselves at night. The PCL just turns on the runway lights an the REIL.
Click to expand...
 
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