Drone and fighter bump

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Half Fast

Half Fast

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Half Fast
Gonna guess we have video of what really went on. Early accounts reported one jet and one drone down.
 
"The Pentagon did not say whether the drone was armed ..." ;)
 
Here's the video..as usual, Russia is full of ****. I see where the plane hits the drone and the propellers slow but I don't see any prop damage.

 
The fighter almost had to hit the right stabilizer on the drone. Too bad the video doesn’t show that.
 
Half Fast said:
No. The question is whether the US will do anything about it.
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I'm recalling the story when Iran was harassing an American drone over the Gulf years ago. The next time the drone was accompanied by F-22s that snuck up on the Iranian F-4s and politely suggested they go home. I would be curious if a similar response would be wise. Would we want to risk showing too much of the F-22s capability to the Russians over a drone? Would things escalate? I doubt a Russian SU-27 or newer would back down as easily as an Iranian F-4.
 
Drones are attritable. I think I’d consider putting a warhead/destruct charge on one and waiting for a Russian to get real close.....
 
Bob Noel said:
looks like a tip is bent... look at the last couple of seconds of footage.
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Yep. And I know from experience that bending the tips of a prop severely limits its capabilities.
 
Perhaps the pilots were also stock car drivers and were just trying to do some bump drafting?
 
luvflyin said:
Tried googling that. Couldn’t find anything. What’s the story?
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It's an old tale. Country X sends out its Soviet-era attack aircraft and takes a few potshots at the unmanned/unarmed drone operating in international airspace. The associated Theater Commander gets all heated about it and adds a dozen (or so) sorties a day to escort the unmanned asset with manned assets. That continues until some O-5 says, "jeez Sir, this sounds kinda stupid." Unmanned aircraft are unmanned for a reason...

I mean...in all fairness, it DID break up the monotony of looking for fast-moving surface traffic:dunno:.

Edit: Country X missed the drone. Multiple times.
 
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Rich Holt said:
Do you mean like in 2012 when we sent manned hornets to escort the unmanned drone? That was a colossal embarrassment. No thanks.
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Google: F-22 F-4 drone iran

You'll find it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
jimhorner said:
Google: F-22 F-4 drone iran

You'll find it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
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And in that case, I don't think of the F-22s as being there to protect the drone. The drone was the bait, and the F-22 was the mission, to teach a lesson to Iran.
 
I think something asymmetrical would be appropriate. Do they still have any subs that run? Maybe bounce a training torpedo off of one.

Or...put some aim-9's on an mq-9, but paint it a little bit differently and give it to Ukraine. Just for fun.
 
Albany Tom said:
I think something asymmetrical would be appropriate. Do they still have any subs that run? Maybe bounce a training torpedo off of one.

Or...put some aim-9's on an mq-9, but paint it a little bit differently and give it to Ukraine. Just for fun.
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You are cheering for conflict escalation with a nuclear power run by aging and ,what some suggest , a terminally ill dictator.

That is insane.
 
We've been taking occasional pot shots at each other for almost 80 years, way more than this, and funding various proxy conflict against each other for almost as long. This isn't all that unusual, or that big of deal. A direct escalation would be a mistake. I think a reminder of some of our capabilities in other areas is warranted, to adjust or reaffirm where the limits are. The alternative is slow degradation in our posture, and an associated increase in the likelihood of further escalation.
 
Not nearly as concerning as the times our submarines have bumped into their submarines, which has happened like half a dozen times.
 
Warmi said:
You are cheering for conflict escalation with a nuclear power run by aging and ,what some suggest , a terminally ill dictator.
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Hi.
The worst thing we can do is, do nothing. We've done that before it got us, the World, in this mess.
This guy is a coward, and thinks too much of himself and does not want to die, and the lack of response will only embolden him, and others. Like all cowards he is afraid of dying. He knows that a nuclear war is not winnable but will threaten everyone with it.
We need to shut up, you got all these politicians spewing trash, and make sure they do not do that again. Many mistakes were already made and if we allow them to take control of international waters, and other countries, a nuclear war will be inevitable because he thinks no one will respond.
I hope everyone realized by now that Global warming is Not our biggest enemy.
 
We are no longer United States of 1940s or even 1960s … we are gender, race and trivial ******** obsessed, 10 minute attention span society with total aversion to risk and inability to sustain anything worse than purely symbolic losses.
Compare that with a totalitarian nation like Russia when they are already at one year mark with manpower losses more significant than the Vietnam war with hardly any dissent ( not to mention historically being known to be able to absorb staggering manpower losses counting in tens of millions - again with hardly any dissent )

Are we really up for it ?
 
Some fighter pilots were queried by one news agency for their opinion. They proceeded to say the fuel dumping claim couldn’t have been accurate since the fuel would evaporate instantly. Well, yes it might evaporate, but not when your within an airplane length of the target! They should use the armed version of this drone to escort the surveillance version so they can splash the Russian fighter.
 
Half Fast said:
No. The question is whether the US will do anything about it.


View attachment 115819
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It seems that whatever type of incitement by Russia, China, or North Korea is produced, the response from Washington is that there will be "consequences".

What that will consist of is never articulated or acted upon.
 
TrueCourse said:
Some fighter pilots were queried by one news agency for their opinion. They proceeded to say the fuel dumping claim couldn’t have been accurate since the fuel would evaporate instantly. Well, yes it might evaporate, but not when your within an airplane length of the target! They should use the armed version of this drone to escort the surveillance version so they can splash the Russian fighter.
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I saw that as well. The MSM agencies who tend to kowtow to Russia have been putting those pilot's statements to good use.
 
Warmi said:
We are no longer United States of 1940s or even 1960s … we are gender, race and trivial ******** obsessed, 10 minute attention span society with total aversion to risk and inability to sustain anything worse than purely symbolic losses.
Compare that with a totalitarian nation like Russia when they are already at one year mark with manpower losses more significant than the Vietnam war with hardly any dissent ( not to mention historically being known to be able to absorb staggering manpower losses counting in tens of millions - again with hardly any dissent )

Are we really up for it ?
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There is great dissent in Russia. It is suppressed with prejudice. Sometimes with extreme prejudice. I have distant relatives in both Russia and Ukraine. Only the latter are vocal.
 
TrueCourse said:
Some fighter pilots were queried by one news agency for their opinion. They proceeded to say the fuel dumping claim couldn’t have been accurate since the fuel would evaporate instantly.
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Sure, because cold Jet A is known for being extremely volatile. :rolleyes:
 
3393RP said:
It seems that whatever type of incitement by Russia, China, or North Korea is produced, the response from Washington is that there will be "consequences".

What that will consist of is never articulated or acted upon.
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Was the Russian jet flying within a few hundred miles of US border or was it the other way around and it was US drone flying close to their border ?
So ..who is inciting whom ?
 
Kenny Phillips said:
There is great dissent in Russia. It is suppressed with prejudice. Sometimes with extreme prejudice. I have distant relatives in both Russia and Ukraine. Only the latter are vocal.
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It is suppressed of course, it is a dictatorship after all, but Russia is more like Nazi Germany - there is dissent but rather minimal and majority of people fully support the regime ( at least for now )
 
Seems to me that cropdusting with jet fuel a machine that has hot parts, a lot of electrical circuits, and potentially flame in its exhaust kinda seems like a cold napalm run on a fire, a risky manouver to destroy it without actually “shooting it down”. I have no doubt they intentionally splashed it, just not the way they were trying to do it, but didn’t want to cross the line of actually firing kinetic weapons at it.
 
I don't think our response has to be public. In the past it often wasn't. If my history/understanding is right, the Berlin airlift was very close to, if not sometimes, actual air combat...which I don't think was public knowledge at the time. In addition, again based on limited knowledge, we sent nuclear armed B-29's and P-80's to England during the event as a threat. At that time, I think it would've been one sided in terms of nuclear exchange, and therefore a pretty clear message as to our potential next steps.

Fast forward to Korea, both sides pushed the envelope a bit, secretly. US jets flying into China, and Russian pilots flying against US pilots over Korea as "advisors". Cuban crisis? Really close to the edge, and months after Russia pulled missiles out of Cuba, we pulled intermediate ballistic missiles out of Europe. I think not to return until the Reagan era.

My point being not only are we not as close now as we were in the past, but that we've gone down this road before, and the response doesn't have to be public to be effective.

As to leadership, part of the above happened during the time of Stalin, who was far more dangerous than this guy. Much smarter, much more ruthless, and probably crazier. He was absolutely paranoid, but I'm not sure if he was a coward. I don't know if anyone alive really knows, but my belief is that his own subordinates eliminated him, as they recognized he wasn't good for the country anymore, and was too reckless. That type of regime change is always a risk in that country, probably has been since the beginning of time.

I think our overall goals here are twofold - to help Ukraine liberate itself, and to help Russia lose as many assets and dollars along the way as possible. I think both goals are admirable.
 
What concerns me is manufacturing capacity. WWII USA, there was a heavy bomber rolling off the line every hour, in just one of the plants producing them. And the munitions to arm them. The axis had vastly superior “wonder weapons” but were simply overrun by the manufacturing capacity of the Allie force. We could build them faster then they could destroy them. Like kicking over a bee hive, you can swat a bee and kill it, then the next and then again, but as the hive starts coming you’ll loose. Just shear overwhelming numbers. It’s been a year since the start of the invasion, Russia initiated their equivalent of marshal law on manufacturing quite awhile ago, the do not underestimated the power of the manufacturing capacity of China and India (both of which have been doing their best to avoid taking an official stance on it) that concerns me. Throw in North Korea, Iran, and a couple dozen other countries that are anti west,.. I think it may be better for decision makers at top levels to focus on rapidly expanding heavy industry capacity at home than focusing on social policies.
 
The Wall Street Journal has clear pictures of the jet fuel dumps by the Russian pilots. It becomes a semi transparent, thick cloud, and persists. Pictures taken from rear view camera on drone.

I would guess they were trying to damage the engine with an over rich, low octane fuel. This could damage enough to shut down the engine, and crash the drone. The last pass was a meter or so too close.

The Polish Migs may deter such activities. Better with Migs than non Russian aircraft, for diplomatic reasons.
 
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