DOT to end Block Aviation Registration Request (BARR) program

'Secretary Ray LaHood said the move fits with the current administration's transparency policies.'

Bwahaha! I get it now.

"Transparent" government is that anyone who receives services, all their information is published -- not transparency in how the government provides those services.

Silly me! I thought it was the other thing. Gosh, Wally. Gee, Beaver.

That cover line from LaHood made me laugh out loud. Wow, what a manipulative prick.
 
denverpilot said:
'Secretary Ray LaHood said the move fits with the current administration's transparency policies.'

Bwahaha! I get it now.

"Transparent" government is that anyone who receives services, all their information is published -- not transparency in how the government provides those services.
Click to expand...

Consider that it's anyone who receives services that the Administration thinks might be spending more than an underprivileged citizen. I don't see any rush to release the names of everyone on welfare rolls, or those that get unemployment, or records of the travels of each citizen that has a toll tag.

Nope, this is more about trying to bring folks with private aircraft to heel. It's all about the tax debate...

I see huge business for security consultants producing justification - just like they already do to justify private use of corporate aircraft for IRS purposes.
 
Simple solution... Make the registration information on aircraft private, just as it is on automobiles. Then the FAA can publish all the ATC data, so they'll be transparent, and folks will still have their privacy.
 
Watch how much more active N12345 becomes.
 
Interesting.

Here in Illinois firearm owners have to have a state ID card called a Firearm Owners ID (FOID) to get a FOID card you have to send in a picture and sign a form that you are not a felon or mentally disturbs. A citizens group here wanted to be able to access those records to see who has a FOID, to actually make the information public. The legislature did not pass the law required to do so and the info on who has one is still not public knowledge.

That was a state action, but how does the ownership of an airplane differ that it needs to be public? Why one but not both either private or public?
 
Scott,

I think most states have laws that restrict the information the state collects unless specifically made public.

The fed gov't default mode is to make it public unless there's code to make it private (privacy act, etc).
 
TMetzinger said:
Scott,

I think most states have laws that restrict the information the state collects unless specifically made public.

The fed gov't default mode is to make it public unless there's code to make it private (privacy act, etc).
Click to expand...
I understand. My question is why is one right and the other not. They should either both be private or both be public don't you think?
 
ScottM said:
I understand. My question is why is one right and the other not. They should either both be private or both be public don't you think?
Click to expand...
Absolutely. And I think they should both be private.


I can't go run a license plate just because I'm curious. I shouldn't be able to run an airplane either. Or a pilot certificate for that matter.

I'm wondering if the airplane registry data could be considered PII? If nothing else, publish the reg number, and make and model, and that's it.
 
ScottM said:
Interesting.

Here in Illinois firearm owners have to have a state ID card called a Firearm Owners ID (FOID) to get a FOID card you have to send in a picture and sign a form that you are not a felon or mentally disturbs. A citizens group here wanted to be able to access those records to see who has a FOID, to actually make the information public. The legislature did not pass the law required to do so and the info on who has one is still not public knowledge.

That was a state action, but how does the ownership of an airplane differ that it needs to be public? Why one but not both either private or public?
Click to expand...

There was a newspaper in Memphis I believe that got the names and addresses of every concealed carry permit holder in the state (via FOIA) and published them.
 
TMetzinger said:
Simple solution... Make the registration information on aircraft private, just as it is on automobiles. Then the FAA can publish all the ATC data, so they'll be transparent, and folks will still have their privacy.
Click to expand...
That's almost the way it is now. You aren't required to register your airplane in your own or your company's real name. You can create a dummy company or register it with a trustee.
 
Everskyward said:
That's almost the way it is now. You aren't required to register your airplane in your own or your company's real name. You can create a dummy company or register it with a trustee.
Click to expand...

That's what I've done as well, and it seems that most people who I know do that with their aircraft.
 
Everskyward said:
That's almost the way it is now. You aren't required to register your airplane in your own or your company's real name. You can create a dummy company or register it with a trustee.
Click to expand...

Those will, of course, block the casual searcher. However corporate ownership and trusteeships are also registered and public records. A determined researcher can unravel all of this to find out who owns an aircraft.
 
JeffDG said:
Those will, of course, block the casual searcher. However corporate ownership and trusteeships are also registered and public records. A determined researcher can unravel all of this to find out who owns an aircraft.
Click to expand...
A determined researcher could also go out to the airport to see who gets on the airplane.
 
This will benefit Warren Buffett and Netjets.
 
wsuffa said:
This will benefit Warren Buffett and Netjets.
Click to expand...

Bingo.

I was kind of neutral on the subject (though leaning in favor of privacy), but bristled at some of the justifications for this rule, i.e. to get the "fat cat" execs, etc. I think this is definitely the case of looking to see what the other hand is doing. Good call, Bill.
 
Everskyward said:
That's almost the way it is now. You aren't required to register your airplane in your own or your company's real name. You can create a dummy company or register it with a trustee.
Click to expand...

"Seven Niner Mike, LLC"... :) Yup.
 
The FAA reauthorization bill passed by the House contains language to keep BARR intact. It will have to be reconciled with the Senate version prior to the President signing it.
 
Last edited:
Yep, easy to find. We'd make the Corporate address a "rental" PO Box with a real street address if going for further "security by obscurity". It'd make cross referencing to the address impossible unless you Social Engineered the box owner out of the box rental place. I'm sure Corporations do that level of security all the time. Register the Corp that owns the aircraft with the hangar address, if it has a USPS address, etc.

Like someone said, anyone with a camera can fix the correlation problem. See who arrives in the cars.
 
JeffDG said:
Those will, of course, block the casual searcher. However corporate ownership and trusteeships are also registered and public records. A determined researcher can unravel all of this to find out who owns an aircraft.
Click to expand...

I'm thinkin' that it may be more difficult than you imagine. When a private corporation is registered with the Secretary of State (in say Colorado), all that is required is the name of the agent and the corporate resolutions. Actual ownership can be hidden from internet eyes at least.

Of course my info is a bit dated since I formed a corp prior to 2001. Maybe things have changed.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top