Does anyone else know my pain and anguish?

nharney

Filing Flight Plan
Joined
May 7, 2006
Messages
22
Display Name

Display name:
NHarney
I checked to see who now owns my 1978 Grumman AA-5B Tiger.
The fellow I sold it to in 2007 went down a few hundred yards offshore from his home airport on the coast of Florence, Oregon. His 15 year old grandson, who wanted to be a pilot, was with him and his body was never found.

That hit me like a a kick to the chest. I really liked the guy. I spent 3 days with him going over the plane and showing him how it liked to be flown. I delivered it to him from SoCal and spent the night at his house, too.

I don't know how every other pilot feels, but my greatest fear has always been taking down passengers. If I die because of this love of flying it's one thing. I can only imagine how it felt to him in those last seconds knowing that his grandson's life was ending, at his hands.

The plane was arguably one of the very best performing Grumman Tigers in the world when he bought it. I bought it from David Fletcher in Houston. Grumman owners know him well. The Fletcher family has been in the Grumman piston-engine planes business since the 1970's. N28718 was David's Mom's plane. Their asking price was over-the-top, but I wanted to use it for flights north of the Arctic Circle and the Bahamas. On top of that I put $24k to upgrade the panel. Those long flights were accomplished without so much as a hic-up from the aircraft. The engine and prop, with advanced head work, powerflow exhaust, and a new prop, had less than 400 hrs when he bought it. TTAF was about 2300 hrs.

From reading the NTSB report, it appears it was a low ceiling approach with breakout just a few hundred feet above the ocean. The only eye-witness was not a pilot. Was he in over his head? Was his aspiring-to-be-a-pilot grandson at the controls? I'll never know. The NTSB said the devastation was so complete that there were no parts large enough to bother to recover other than the engine and prop.

It's difficult to explain how hard this news hit me. My dream airplane, that I was finally able to buy, upgrade to modern, and make lifelong flying dreams come true... and then pass it on to another guy who wants to make his dreams come true, and it ends in needless death and destruction.

Sorry. I just needed to express my sorrow and it's one of those things that only other pilots might understand.
 
I'm sorry to hear that, man. It's always harder when a youngster perishes.

I don't know what else to say, but I feel for you. :frown3:
 
Thanks. I just needed to tell somebody who might understand. The real tragedy was about the grandson. The PIC was recently retired and about my age. No great loss if one of our age pays the price for bad judgement, but the kid? What potential was lost?

38 Years of reading accident reports and it ~almost~ always comes down to some kind of pilot JUDGEMENT error.
 
Anyone who's been flying long enough knows folks who've gone west in airplanes. It's not the fun part of the hobby to say the least.
 
I'm trying to sell my fire-breathing sport bike and am going through some similar trepidations. I don't want to be responsible for someone's crash. I don't want to be that guy.
 
Thanks. I just needed to tell somebody who might understand. The real tragedy was about the grandson. The PIC was recently retired and about my age. No great loss if one of our age pays the price for bad judgement, but the kid? What potential was lost?

38 Years of reading accident reports and it ~almost~ always comes down to some kind of pilot JUDGEMENT error.

The tragedy stands on its own merit, and you had nothing to do with the accident other than the fact that you happened to have owned the plane. It's sad to hear regardless, but don't beat yourself up over it.
 
The tragedy stands on its own merit, and you had nothing to do with the accident other than the fact that you happened to have owned the plane. It's sad to hear regardless, but don't beat yourself up over it.
I concur. You can feel sad and have sympathy. But don't feel responsible or guilt.
It is definitely sad about about the kid, and the surviving family members.
 
A fellow crashed my rental Citabria, killing himself and the son of his fiancé - a teenager.

Unauthorized low level aerobatics, leading to either a loss of control or structural failure.

I've linked to the NTSB report before. N7596F if you're curious.

Relevance is that it shook me so much I took about a two year hiatus from flying, letting both my medical and CFI lapse. Never thought it would be permanent, but I just needed a break.

Coincidentally, my personal plane was a Grumman Tiger, and it basically sat for those two years or so patiently awaiting my return.

Regardless, I empathize with your situation it can hit pretty hard even if one is in no way at fault.
 
Sorry for your Sorrow.
 
I have flown the last complete and successful flight on 6 airplanes now....that is the plane crashed on the next flight. The first time that happened it hit me really hard.

As someone else already stated, if you fly long enough you will know someone that didn't survive the crash.
 
I have flown the last complete and successful flight on 6 airplanes now....that is the plane crashed on the next flight. The first time that happened it hit me really hard.

Remind me not to fly after you. :nonod:

Sorry for your pain OP tough business but I could say the same thing about cars and other conveyances.
 
That kind of news is never easy, especially if you grow attached either to the vehicle or the new owner.
Sorry to hear and RIP for the 2 souls onboard.
 
I'm trying to sell my fire-breathing sport bike and am going through some similar trepidations. I don't want to be responsible for someone's crash. I don't want to be that guy.

Getting out of riding or just slowing down?
 
not to sound morbid, but do you have a link to the NTSB report? I'm curious to see what happened.
 
That is terrible. So sorry.
 
My dad sold his 1979 Piper Dakota in 1986. Not long after, the guy who bought it flew into IMC and killed he and his wife. We took lots of flights in that Dakota, including fishing trips to Mexico. :(
 
Sorry sir.

Also, I hope nobody that ever sells me a plane has a story like this.
 
This totally pales in comparison, but my first plane was a C150 and after 4+ years of co-ownership we sold it. Eventually I looked it up online and found it had crashed. After some searching I found a picture of it on an insurance salvage website and when I pulled it up it took my breath away. Those were MY yokes, MY harnesses, MY wingtips and strobes, etc., etc. The A/C was a total loss and I couldn't help but feel some guilt for some reason.

So I've 'touched' there, but certainly not to your extent. My sincere condolences.
 
I have flown the last complete and successful flight on 6 airplanes now....that is the plane crashed on the next flight.
I'm wondering if I'm reading this correctly. :hairraise:
 
Tragic and it's not your fault but I know that doesn't help the feeling...

Part of the feeling is losing the plane itself. They become like loved ones in a way ...
 
I have flown the last complete and successful flight on 6 airplanes now....that is the plane crashed on the next flight.

Yeah, I'm wondering if I'm reading this as you meant it as well.

The odds of you selling 6 different planes and all of them crashing on their very next flight are astronomical.
 
Getting out of riding or just slowing down?

Neither

I think he dumped it for a newer model.
(look out Mrs. Steingar):D

Kinda, but different sort of bike. Old:
104783d1235521265-mansons-new-ride-honda-cbr-954rr-img_0341.jpg
(not my bike, but one quite similar)

New:
Honda%20CB1000R%2008%20%203.jpg
(again not my bike, no good photos yet)

The new bike (also a Honda) has far better ergonomics than the sport bike. I was starting to hurt in the places I hurt on the sport bike when not on the sport bike, and that was my signal from Odin that it was time to let the sport bike go.

The new bike has a detuned racing engine cranking out about 125 horsepower at the rear wheel (old bike was running around 140) and with its racing chassis weighs in at about 470 lbs, versus 360 for the old bike. That said, the 954 was one of the lightest and most nimble sports bikes ever made by anyone, and the 1000r is only about 30 lbs heavier than Honda's top of the line liter sport bike.

The new bike has a more upright ergonomic position, which means I don't hurt in the places I hurt on the sport bike when on the new bike. It is still plenty fast, and as an added bonus was designed and built in Italy, meaning it doesn't look like a Honda (damn thing doesn't even look Japanese). Added to the me factor, these bikes are quite rare on these shores, most naked sport bike enthusiasts prefer the more powerful Aprillas and KTMs. That's fine by me, I prefer a distinctive ride. But the bike is a Honda in its soul, and I suspect it will spend a great deal of its time unbroken.

Weird to ride, since the seating is still cafe forward, but there's no fairing or anything else out ahead. Fun, fun fun.

Sorry to hijack the thread. I'll return you to your regularly scheduled doom and gloom.
 
Originally Posted by Zeldman
I have flown the last complete and successful flight on 6 airplanes now....that is the plane crashed on the next flight.

Yeah, I'm wondering if I'm reading this as you meant it as well.

The odds of you selling 6 different planes and all of them crashing on their very next flight are astronomical.

Never sold a plane because at the time I never owned one. The first three were during flight school. 2 different schools. 2 were broken throttle linkages. The other was a broken crankshaft after going around from a simulated engine failure. Over flew their field into a fence then trees. Minor injuries.

On one of the broken throttle linkages, they tried to extend the glide over a lake. 2 fatal.

The other three, all in Alaska. One C-207 lost a prop, the other was a C-207 that sheared the pins for the drive gears on the magnetos. Another was a Piper Chieftain that the gear would not come down. The company considered the plane a total loss and parted it out.

All crashes happened on the very next flight after I finished flying the plane. On a couple the crash was the first flight of the next day.

Then on the day I was to take my multi commercial checkride, the examiner came up to me with a very stressed looking student. He explained that this guy needed to take his ATP ride and then catch a flight out right after. I let them take the plane and my scheduled time.

When I came back to do my ride, the dispatcher looked at me funny and asked if I had heard. No, I haven't heard. Well, on the simulated engine out ILS approach, the good engine tossed a couple rods on short final. They landed hard, taking out the gear and sliding to a stop just a few feet short of the runway. I saw the examiner about an hour later. Well, smelled him is more like it. I smelled the bourbon as he walked in the door.

Oh, the pilot passed his ride.

I used to let this bother me. Now when someone I know is killed in a crash, I just get mad. Mad because either he made a mistake or the plane failed.
 
A dear friend of mine swapped Comanches with a guy. He took the twin and the other guy took the single. He's terrified the guy that took the single (his
PRide and joy) will bang it up.
 
Back
Top