do you long XC pilots ever get used to it?

[wabower]

One of the local long-tooth Lear/Falcon/G-whiz drivers, who, based on his background might be expected to be somewhat dismissive of light GA, has consistently maintained that the biggest gain occurs when you can fly rather than drive. He says when the C-172 replaces the F-150 you've achieved the majority of the benefit and anything bigger or faster is simply incremental gain.

Dunno if he's right, but it's plenty good enough for me. For several years I owned an interest in a 340, T210 and 172 at the same time. We used the 172 mostly for training friends and kids, but occasionally somebody had to fly it on and X/C when the other planes were busy. Our reaction to such trips was consistent in that we found the 172 to be quite comfortable and capable with block times that weren't all that much different and almost indistinguishable portal times.

No argument there. Yesterday as we were loading up the 310 another family hopped in a Global Express to head wherever they were going. But they had 3 kids to our 1.

Meanwhile I was feeling pretty good about seeing 200 over the ground and truing out at 180-185.

 

[Ted]

One of the local long-tooth Lear/Falcon/G-whiz drivers, who, based on his background might be expected to be somewhat dismissive of light GA, has consistently maintained that the biggest gain occurs when you can fly rather than drive. He says when the C-172 replaces the F-150 you've achieved the majority of the benefit and anything bigger or faster is simply incremental gain.

Dunno if he's right, but it's plenty good enough for me. For several years I owned an interest in a 340, T210 and 172 at the same time. We used the 172 mostly for training friends and kids, but occasionally somebody had to fly it on and X/C when the other planes were busy. Our reaction to such trips was consistent in that we found the 172 to be quite comfortable and capable with block times that weren't all that much different and almost indistinguishable portal times.

I'd agree. Our 3-hour block time in the 310 this weekend would be about 5 in a 172, for substantially less money.

Of course, if a 172 was our option, we'd just stay home.

 

[Otto the pilot]

Long cross country in a GA aircraft is limited to it's size/comfort and my bladder.

My record XC is 16.6 hour flight (Mumbai, India to NYC), but four pilots (plus autopilots), restrooms, sleep bunks (7 hr nap), a couple meals = easy money!

 

[Ted]

Yabut Wayne's probably done that in a G-V. In a sandstorm. And without the bunks.

What plane was that trip in?

 

[Skylane81E]

Long cross country in a GA aircraft is limited to it's size/comfort and my bladder.

My record XC is 16.6 hour flight (Mumbai, India to NYC), but four pilots (plus autopilots), restrooms, sleep bunks (7 hr nap), a couple meals = easy money!

My tanks are the limiter for me, and my biggest speed mod. You have to be a lot (more than 20kts) faster to cover the same ground as I do in 7hrs if you had to stop for fuel

 

[Ted]

My tanks are the limiter for me, and my biggest speed mod. You have to be a lot (more than 20kts) faster to cover the same ground as I do in 7hrs if you had to stop for fuel

Done.

And I agree that tanks are more a limiting factor for me - Gatorade bottles work well.

 

[Skylane81E]

Yes Ted, your plane is in the "much faster" category.

Point still stands

For example, I can make the a trip at the limit of my range in about same time as a 180kt plane that only has three hour legs

 

[AdamZ]

I'd agree. Our 3-hour block time in the 310 this weekend would be about 5 in a 172, for substantially less money.

Of course, if a 172 was our option, we'd just stay home.

Even if thats all you knew? Everything is relative.

 

[Ted]

Even if thats all you knew? Everything is relative.

Actually it didn't have to do with "I don't like 172s," it has to do with how much of a trip I want to deal with for a personal getaway. We're going for a weekend to visit the family. At 3 hours we wake up when we want, get there a bit after lunch, get a full afternoon in, and similar on return. At 5+ hours with a stop it's more hassle than I want to do for a weekend with the baby at this point.

The 8-9 hour block time trips to Newfoundland are different - that's a week. And when it's a dog flight, that's work, and so I don't mind.

 

[Otto the pilot]

Yabut Wayne's probably done that in a G-V. In a sandstorm. And without the bunks.

What plane was that trip in?

Boeing 777

 

[Ted]

Boeing 777

GE90-115B?

 

[PPC1052]

No argument there. Yesterday as we were loading up the 310 another family hopped in a Global Express to head wherever they were going. But they had 3 kids to our 1.

Meanwhile I was feeling pretty good about seeing 200 over the ground and truing out at 180-185.

I have lead for you on a slightly crispy Global Express if you are interested. I am sure you can get it for a relative bargain.

 

[Otto the pilot]

GE90-115B?

GE90-94B

 

[Kelvin]

GE90-115B?

GE90-94B

 

[Ted]

I have lead for you on a slightly crispy Global Express if you are interested. I am sure you can get it for a relative bargain.

No thanks, Jetstar all the way. Maybe Sabreliner. We're only interested in jets with cool names and minimal practicality, and the Global Express doesn't sound cool enough and is far too practical.

 

[Neal Howard]

8 hours in the old Cherokee to/from Oshkosh was about the max for me. The excitement of going to Oshkosh on the trip up there kept me from feeling too fatigued and had plenty of energy left once I got there, but the return trip back home after walking for several miles each day at Osh combined with an 8-hour flight home, with roughly half of that at 10.5K the last half of the homeward trip pretty much left me with feeling I'd had enough flying for a week once I'd landed back home in blast furnace summer heat and usually a strong gusty crosswind landing at the home field.

Switching to the Vans RV and reduction in flight time from 8 hours to only 5 sure was a welcome change for those long Oshkosh XC's

 

[Fearless Tower]

We're only interested in jets with cool names and minimal practicality, and the Global Express doesn't sound cool enough and is far too practical.

And Global Express ain't got nothin' on the LearBaron!

 

[Ted]

And Global Express ain't got nothin' on the LearBaron!

You got that right!

 

[Skylane81E]

You say global express I hear planet express...

 

[Goofy]

Before Friday the longest I'd flown in one day was about the three and a half hours. Friday I spent most of the day giving tours for family that ended with me clicking 7.3 hours for the day. I pretty much slept through Saturday.

Henning, Ted, and others who do long long flights reasonably regularly, do you guys get work down after these flights or do you pretty much get used to it?

Is there anything to do to help with the post flight fatigue?

Don't understand it, may be worth investigating. I flew 11.5 Hobbs from Memphis to Seattle with 3 fuel stops. Felt fine the next day.

 

[Dead Stick]

There is a big difference between 8 to 10 hrs at 150 knots and 8 to 10 hours at .84 Mach which typically involve crossing several time zones. The danger comes when you don't recognize and deal with the symptoms of fatigue. However, the answer is pretty much always the same - adequate rest. I've spent the past 30 years flying coast to coast on a weekly basis, with a boatload of trips to Europe, South America and the Pacific Rim thrown in for good measure. During that period I've lived on either coast, but my body clock always seemed to be somewhere around the Mississippi river. You get used to it. You learn to deal with it.

 

[GCA319]

I'm fascinated by a portion of your post. Can you elaborate on exactly how you and the other pilot interact on the shared responsibilities that you mentioned?

Haha nice.

 

[Rex Kramer]

There's something to be said for looking down at your watch and thinking, ok this watch has to go around 12 times and after that I'll only have another 4 hours to do. 16-17hrs on a plane is a LONG time.

Of course, the lav, bunks, FAs, food, TV, helps some of the time go by... Still, coming out of NYC and realizing that once you get to east side of Findland you are almost halfway to your destination takes some getting used to.

 

[Dead Stick]

There's something to be said for looking down at your watch and thinking, ok this watch has to go around 12 times and after that I'll only have another 4 hours to do. 16-17hrs on a plane is a LONG time.

Of course, the lav, bunks, FAs, food, TV, helps some of the time go by... Still, coming out of NYC and realizing that once you get to east side of Findland you are almost halfway to your destination takes some getting used to.

...or realizing, on climbout out of LFPB that before the day is over you'll be landing at KPDX. That's a long day at 400 knots GS.

 

[PilotAlan]

16-17hrs on a plane is a LONG time. ...
Of course, the lav, bunks, FAs, food, TV, helps some of the time go by..

So does Aleve, Benadryl, alcohol, and a first class seat.
The flight only lasts the amount of time you are awake.

This doesn't work as the pilot. But when I'm the pilot, it doesn't bother me.
I guess spending 12 hours a day in police cars helped acclimate me.

 

[PPC1052]

And Global Express ain't got nothin' on the LearBaron!

I know of a slightly crispy Lear, too, if that's what you really want. Same fire.