Declared an emergency today

Half Fast said:
More likely they're running a credit check on you to see how soakable you are....
;)
Click to expand...
Hah! Maybe so.

I did pop in to the shop today. I didn't get to see what it looked like before they started working on it, but they told me the connection broke at the ball joint where it connects at the carb, and that the cable itself was okay. I'm not familiar enough with that connection to visualize it, so I'll see what it looks like when they put it back together. (Maybe parts 26/27/28 on page 3B1 of the parts manual?)

All I saw at the shop was the bare end of the throttle cable and the bare carb throttle lever, with none of the connection hardware in-between.

I did see this on p. 2K24 of the maintenance manual:
1718279977500.png

I wonder what that felt like last Sept when it was in for annual?
 
Last edited:
Jim_R said:
Hah! Maybe so.

I did pop in to the shop today. I didn't get to see what it looked like before they started working on it, but they told me the connection broke at the ball joint where it connects at the carb, and that the cable itself was okay. I'm not familiar enough with that connection to visualize it, so I'll see what it looks like when they put it back together. (Maybe parts 26/27/28 on page 3B1 of the parts manual?)

All I saw at the shop was the bare end of the throttle cable and the bare carb throttle lever, with none of the connection hardware in-between.

I did see this on p. 2K24 of the maintenance manual:
View attachment 129984

I wonder what that felt like last Sept when it was in for annual?
Click to expand...
Hopefully they will replace it with a rod end and bolt and nut like mine is in the above picture.
That ball joint is not as secure as you found out.
 
It would be good to know what broke, and how. Was it the ball bolt that goes into the throttle lever? Was it overtightened at some point? Or did the ball wear its way out of the socket? That's should have been caught a long time ago, with lots of slop evident. That type of link is an ancient design. My 1951 International pickup had steering rod ends that were just big versions of that, and they were adjustable to take up slack. No seals; they had to be greased regularly to pump the dirt out of them. I have seen that fitting like yours on gear doors of retractables. They don't last well there, either.
 
Dan Thomas said:
Nope. It's permanently swaged together. But if it's the same age as the other controls, you can get an idea of what's happening. Your carb heat cable:

View attachment 129872

Looks like some roughness on the wire. Run a fingernail along it and see. Roughness is not good at all. At the end where it is clamped to the lever there's another place that can fail. Sometimes mechanics overtighten the nut on that drilled bolt, which is actually a Cessna part number and is called a clamp. This can partially shear the wire, and it eventually breaks there. We can get a better look at the idea on the mixture control:

View attachment 129873

The wire is bent (normal) but not sheared. You can also see some wear on the wire just ahead of the housing clamp. Push the mixture full rich and get a better look. Run your fingernail along it.

McFarlane sells a PMA'd mixture control that uses a larger wire, around .090". Great stuff, but now you have to drill that 1/4" clamp bolt to take the larger wire, and so there's a lot less metal in the bolt around the hole, meaning it can crack and eventually break with any overtightening. Compromises everywhere.
Click to expand...
I do appreciate any critique of anything you see in my pictures. Always looking to do it better and safer.
Since I had the exhaust off to anti seize it, it was easier to get in there to install new stainless cotter pins.
I have a small assortment of stainless pins from Spruce and I need a 1/16” longer for the mixture cable nut? So I feel better about it like this since it is maybe too short to go in the other way?
The old pins were 4 years old and had 879 hours on them. I think I am ready for the 2nd half and hopefully make it to TBO.
The cables are all smooth. The carb heat cable is a 3 year old McFarlane with some kind of liner. It’s real smooth to operate. But my other 2 cables are oem and have 2450 hours on them. Didn’t replace them during the engine swap. So far so good?
IMG_0002.jpeg
 
Last edited:
Gary Ward said:
I do appreciate any critique of anything you see in my pictures.
Click to expand...
Below are some comments from a bored person. None are exciting/vital or criticisms.
Gary Ward said:
Always looking to do it better and safer.
Click to expand...
I think you have a great attitude and I also try to abandon all ego when it comes to safety.

Below; comments on my comments most welcome.
 

Attachments

  • cable housing end.png
    cable housing end.png
    436.7 KB · Views: 30
  • carbdrainplug.png
    carbdrainplug.png
    304.5 KB · Views: 29
  • cotterpin.png
    cotterpin.png
    652 KB · Views: 29
  • sheathprotection.png
    sheathprotection.png
    837.4 KB · Views: 28
  • firesleevesafetywire.png
    firesleevesafetywire.png
    488.8 KB · Views: 29
Gary Ward said:
But my other 2 cables are oem and have 2450 hours on them. Didn’t replace them during the engine swap. So far so good?
Click to expand...
Your call. 2450 isn't bad, but I don't think I'd run them to the next overhaul.
 
Let'sgoflying! said:
Below are some comments from a bored person. None are exciting/vital or criticisms.

I think you have a great attitude and I also try to abandon all ego when it comes to safety.

Below; comments on my comments most welcome.
Click to expand...
Good catch on that uncompleted lockwiring job on the carb bowl drain plug.

If one takes the time during an inspection, it's not hard to identify many such shortcomings in an airplane, creating the impression that the annual "inspections" are little more than walkarounds.
 
Actually that safety wire was intact around that carb drain plug in that picture. It looked loose and was sloppy but intact. I didn’t want to crank on it to protect the fragile hole in the carb.

Edit now that I think about it I think I cut that wire while I was working on something else knowing I was going to service it. Either way it was not tightly wrapped because the wire was oversized. I learned to use a smaller diameter wire down there. Thanks to everyone here.

I think I just got finished cutting off every piece of safety wire off this engine for inspections and cleaning part of my annual inspection. I even have the safety wire off of the alternator mounting because of a front crankshaft seal replacement.
Plane has been down 6 days so far. Everything is looking good so far. New gasket in the fuel strainer and was clean inside. The inlet screen for the carb only had 2 specks in it which was able to gently blow out.
IMG_4553.HEIC
Plan to fly it tomorrow on the 7th day! lol
IMG_4547.HEIC
 
Last edited:
Dan Thomas said:
Your call. 2450 isn't bad, but I don't think I'd run them to the next overhaul.
Click to expand...
Checkout this inspection list. Look at 18.
IMG_4549.HEIC

#5 says...What do they mean by .050" movement? #7 is what you were telling me about the mag Dan.
IMG_4551.HEIC

Fresh seal.
IMG_4556.HEIC

IMG_4554.HEIC
 
Last edited:
So they've lowered the bar to 1500 hours. Probably due to SDRs reporting failures close to TBO.

Um. This:

1718487345841.png

That bolt could work loose, quite a bit. The lockwire should wrap around the head of the bolt tightly, pulling it in the direction of bolt tightening. Like so:

1718487474756.png



I know it's just a baffle attachment, but what do the propeller bolt lockwires look like?
 
They look like a spider web on the propeller bolts!
I haven't put them in yet, later tonight. Just got here and will be here until 1 or 2 am. Favorite time to work. Quiet and cool.
I got some old pictures of the prop bolts safely wire. probably can't find them tonight. They were put on properly, I think?
 
Dan Thomas said:
So they've lowered the bar to 1500 hours. Probably due to SDRs reporting failures close to TBO.

Um. This:

View attachment 130107

That bolt could work loose, quite a bit. The lockwire should wrap around the head of the bolt tightly, pulling it in the direction of bolt tightening. Like so:

View attachment 130108



I know it's just a baffle attachment, but what do the propeller bolt lockwires look like?
Click to expand...
Better? Iast picture , sorry for the hi jack Jim_R.
Do they have you back in the air?
IMG_4563.jpeg
 
1718498489652.png

Better on the screw. But what's to stop that loop of wire through the starter lug from moving up the lug if the bolt decides to come loose? The wire should loop through the top of the hole, and the wire between the lug and screw should be tight. No curves to it.

Maybe I'm just too fussy.
 
1718498727172.png

Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like .032" lockwire. It should be .041". Service manuals sometimes specify what to use, but I don't see it in Cessna's manuals. Big hardware like that needs bigger wire. AC43.13 doesn't have a chart of hardware sizes to lockwire sizes, either.



Otherwise it's not bad at all. I liked to pull that wire tight so it sat flat on the bolt head hex flats. It looks like lubricant was used on those bolts? Only permissible if the manual calls for it. Otherwise, the bolt stretch vs, torque setting is messed up.

While we're on the subject of lockwire, turnbuckles are another place often screwed up. They should look like this:

1718500146452.png

Using lockwire as per:

1718500189214.png

Unless the aircraft manufacturer's service manual says otherwise, anything else is unacceptable. Sometimes I have found this:

1718500377322.png

That twisted end can snag on stuff and cause control difficulties. This is just plain laziness. Not acceptable at all. I found this type of lockwiring in a Maule, on the aileron cables above the headliner, and those twisted ends were snagging on another turnbuckle as the ailerons were moved. Dangerous. I've found it many other times as well, though not snagging. Yet.

You could see some of your lockwiring through the inspection panel under the left wing at the aileron pushrod. Should be two turnbuckles there, on the bellcrank. One at the right aileron. Three more on the control yoke assembly behind the instrument panel, maybe hidden by the plastic fascia panel.

Lockwiring turnbuckles is not a job for the impatient or foulmouthed. Working through small access holes with sharp edges can get you cut up and bruised pretty good.
 
Dan Thomas said:
View attachment 130120

Better on the screw. But what's to stop that loop of wire through the starter lug from moving up the lug if the bolt decides to come loose? The wire should loop through the top of the hole, and the wire between the lug and screw should be tight. No curves to it.

Maybe I'm just too fussy.
Click to expand...
Like this?IMG_4568.jpeg
 
Dan Thomas said:
View attachment 130121

Maybe I'm wrong, but it looks like .032" lockwire. It should be .041". Service manuals sometimes specify what to use, but I don't see it in Cessna's manuals. Big hardware like that needs bigger wire. AC43.13 doesn't have a chart of hardware sizes to lockwire sizes, either.



Otherwise it's not bad at all. I liked to pull that wire tight so it sat flat on the bolt head hex flats. It looks like lubricant was used on those bolts? Only permissible if the manual calls for it. Otherwise, the bolt stretch vs, torque setting is messed up.

While we're on the subject of lockwire, turnbuckles are another place often screwed up. They should look like this:

View attachment 130123

Using lockwire as per:

View attachment 130124

Unless the aircraft manufacturer's service manual says otherwise, anything else is unacceptable. Sometimes I have found this:

View attachment 130125

That twisted end can snag on stuff and cause control difficulties. This is just plain laziness. Not acceptable at all. I found this type of lockwiring in a Maule, on the aileron cables above the headliner, and those twisted ends were snagging on another turnbuckle as the ailerons were moved. Dangerous. I've found it many other times as well, though not snagging. Yet.

You could see some of your lockwiring through the inspection panel under the left wing at the aileron pushrod. Should be two turnbuckles there, on the bellcrank. One at the right aileron. Three more on the control yoke assembly behind the instrument panel, maybe hidden by the plastic fascia panel.

Lockwiring turnbuckles is not a job for the impatient or foulmouthed. Working through small access holes with sharp edges can get you cut up and bruised pretty good.
Click to expand...
It is.032! A couple years ago my AP/IA put the prop bolts safely wire in. He never said a thing to me about it.

And that' thought went through my mind in the past about that.
I will get some.041 and replace this.
This is what I hope to fly with tomorrow.
Never use lube on these bolts. I did Manu flux them. Then they were cleaned with mineral spirits and installed clean and dry.



IMG_4567.jpegIMG_4565.jpegThey got new washers.
 
Last edited:
My IA says to use the thickest wire that’ll fit in the hole. Seems like a good way to approach it to me.
 
Also, and this is just my opinion, it's best if you can keep any 'extra' wire from wrapping around the bolt head, where it could potentially slip off.
Compare these two pics to see what I'm talking about.
If I'm incorrect, I welcome any input from others.. I'm definitely no expert.

eta:
Left picture: Bolt at 4 o'clock could be redone.
Right picture: Bolt at 7 o'clock, the 'extra' wire is behind the 'pigtail' to help a little.
Left picture: Bolt at 2 o'clock is decent view of what I believe Dan mentions regarding the wire flat on the bolt head hex flats


1718548527263.png1718548559188.png
 
Last edited:
Skyrys62 said:
Also, and this is just my opinion, it's best if you can keep any 'extra' wire from wrapping around the bolt head, where it could potentially slip off.
Click to expand...
That twisted wire needs to to wrap around the head some to provide a positive pull tro keep the bolt tight. Look at this as an example:

1718549380781.png

The bolt at top left has little chance of loosening. The wire pulls it tight. The other bolt is a different animal; the wire isn't pulling that bolt tight. If that bolt was loose, and I pulled on the lockwire, the bolt wouldn't turn to tighten.

Very often that wire will have to wrap around like this:

1718549811227.png

But it should be pulled tighter than that. The twisted wire should be pulled tight against the head. It won't slip off.
 
So, just to verify.. in this example, bolt on upper right is good.
Bolt at bottom, is good also, as it's straight enough to still provide the pull ?

1718550532509.png
 
Skyrys62 said:
So, just to verify.. in this example, bolt on upper right is good.
Bolt at bottom, is good also, as it's straight enough to still provide the pull ?

View attachment 130144
Click to expand...
I'd have gone around to the far side with that wire. See how the twist isn't up against the hole in the bolt head? The wire can slip into the hole if the bolt turns to loosen. The bolt could make 1/8th of a turn before the wire would stop it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top