DC Folks - what are the transponder requirements for operation within the 60nm ring?

Fearless Tower

Fearless Tower

Touchdown! Greaser!
Joined
Jan 1, 2010
Messages
16,473
Location
Norfolk, VA
Display Name
Display name:
Fearless Tower
I'm a bit stumped. I took the SFRA training a few years ago. Looked at the current training info on the FAA website, but can't find anything specific regarding transponder requirements for operating between the SFRA and the outer 60nm ring.

In short, if you are outside the Class B mode C veil, but inside the 60nm ring, is a transponder required?

A client is trying to move an airplane to ESN in order to have an avionics guy complete the certification of a newly installed transponder.
 
Yes. Need a mode C transponder.
If you do not have one, contact ATC and and get permission for a ferry flight. When I have called to do it (five years ago), they always want a flight of two, specific altitude and speed restrictions. Not a big deal as I recall, 3-5K and max speed of 150 KIAS, under ATC control the whole time.

Tim
 
Not trying to be argumentative, but what is the reference? You normally wouldn't be required to contact ATC in that area.

I need to be able to advise the client.
 
tspear said:
Yes. Need a mode C transponder.
If you do not have one, contact ATC and and get permission for a ferry flight. When I have called to do it (five years ago), they always want a flight of two, specific altitude and speed restrictions. Not a big deal as I recall, 3-5K and max speed of 150 KIAS, under ATC control the whole time.
Click to expand...
Checkout_my_Six said:
mode C...for now
Click to expand...

You guys have a cite for that?

§91.161 is the regulatory implementation of the 60nm ring, which was for many years a notam. It is for training only; no requirement for a transponder.

Outside the mode C veil, outside the SFRA, but inside the 60nm ring, no transponder required.
 
Last edited:
The 60nm ring is solely for the "special awareness training" requirement. The above posters except for BradZ are wrong.
 
Last edited:
Fearless Tower said:
In short, if you are outside the Class B mode C veil, but inside the 60nm ring, is a transponder required?
Click to expand...
Below 10k, I don't believe so. The 60nm ring is the speed ring.

Fearless Tower said:
A client is trying to move an airplane to ESN in order to have an avionics guy complete the certification of a newly installed transponder.
Click to expand...
To ESN from where?
 
Then someone please explain to me why, when looked at on a TAC, the ring says "mode C" right on it.

Ah, wait, never mind. The 60nm DCA VOR ring has no such markings. I think if you're inside that you must have taken the SFRA course.
 
Last edited:
Just call Potomac approach and ask for their current procedures. Best way to be sure. If they deny you entry, arguing about regs isn't gonna get you in.

Edit: I see you are talking ESN. That's outside of the part of the SFRA that needs a transponder.
 
Chip Sylverne said:
Then someone please explain to me why, when looked at on a TAC, the ring says "mode C" right on it.

Ah, wait, never mind. The 60nm DCA VOR ring has no such markings.
Click to expand...
The IAD and BWI mode C veils extend well beyond the SFRA and a fair distance into the 60 nm ring.
 
Chip Sylverne said:
Then someone please explain to me why, when looked at on a TAC, the ring says "mode C" right on it.

Ah, wait, never mind. The 60nm DCA VOR ring has no such markings. I think if you're inside that you must have taken the SFRA course.
Click to expand...
yup.....now I see dat. :D
 
Fearless Tower said:
Airplane is VFR only without a fully certified xpdr
Click to expand...
I'd call SBY tower. Everything is readily available, but just ask the tower what they like and want, and you'll get a quick and easy answer in 30 seconds.
 
SFRA course required, transponder not required. Depart SBY, fly at 3000 under R-4006, and you're on a 40 mile final to ESN, the flight will take less time than this thread has :)
 
Used to be max 230 kts inside 60nm; is that no longer the case?
 
GeorgeC said:
Used to be max 230 kts inside 60nm; is that no longer the case?
Click to expand...

Sorry, this is still the case, just never heard anyone call it a speed ring before.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top