DA-50 Turboprop

Nice,can't imagine what it will cost.
 
380hp for 200kts? Wow, sounds like they should make the legs come up.
 
Makes a salvage yard C-310 affordable by comparison....oh wait...

/stirpot
 
Awesome. If the cirrus does 200+ knots in their turbo version why would a turboprop not be considerably faster?

I know the engine is more reliable from my research but what's the main purpose?
 
Awesome. If the cirrus does 200+ knots in their turbo version why would a turboprop not be considerably faster?

I know the engine is more reliable from my research but what's the main purpose?

Diesel fuel/kerosene/jet fuel is more available anywhere in the world. 100LL is not.
 
Diesel fuel/kerosene/jet fuel is more available anywhere in the world. 100LL is not.

Ahh i forgot about that.

It said takeoff weight less then 2000kg. I wonder what the load is? 465hp on takeoff is legit..
 
I am genuinely interested in why they named it after a fuel that hasn't been used for 16 years.

That being said, I really hope they put the plane into production.
 
I am genuinely interested in why they named it after a fuel that hasn't been used for 16 years.

That being said, I really hope they put the plane into production.

I'm trying to figure out who would buy it. I can't see it being under $800k. Who is going to spend $800k on one, then deal with the high operating costs?:dunno:
 
It is sub-2000kg to avoid European airway fees(in Europe for example most Senecas are with 1999kg MTOW STC), and a turboprop so you can fly it where 100LL isn't available.
 
It is sub-2000kg to avoid European airway fees(in Europe for example most Senecas are with 1999kg MTOW STC), and a turboprop so you can fly it where 100LL isn't available.

The CD-350 would give the same benefits with less fuel burn several hundred thousand dollars cheaper. Slightly heavier install so gives up a bit of useful load to stay below 4400lbs, but it may be matched in the weight of the extra fuel you have to take off with for the turbine. If it was a pressurized cabin, I could see more sense to the turbine.
 
I'm trying to figure out who would buy it. I can't see it being under $800k. Who is going to spend $800k on one, then deal with the high operating costs?:dunno:

Maybe trying the market for the price points between a Cirrus SR22 and something like the TBM-900? Is there anything between there right now? Maybe ~$1 million to $2+ million?

I have no idea...
 
Maybe trying the market for the price points between a Cirrus SR22 and something like the TBM-900? Is there anything between there right now? Maybe ~$1 million to $2+ million?

I have no idea...

Bunch of twins, Meridian (and it's piston counterparts whatever they're called), TBM 750 & 850, and probably a few others that I'm forgetting.
 
I'm trying to figure out who would buy it. I can't see it being under $800k. Who is going to spend $800k on one, then deal with the high operating costs?:dunno:

Perhaps the same type of person who'd buy that Cirrus jet? If you want to spend a bunch of money on a small airplane this sounds a good choice. Not that I've ever meet anyone like that...
 
Perhaps the same type of person who'd buy that Cirrus jet? If you want to spend a bunch of money on a small airplane this sounds a good choice. Not that I've ever meet anyone like that...

What makes it sound like a good choice?:dunno: I don't see anything about it that makes it a good choice.
 
I'll believe it when I see it for sale. Diamond has been talking about various incarnations of the DA50 for years and years and can't seem to make up their minds what they want to do. This is going to be an expensive plane for being so slow, so few passengers and not pressurized... If you want to get away from Avgas there are better/cheaper ways than going after a turbine.
 
Actually, I can see it as a choice for many places in the developing world. The one that comes first to mind is China. They will indeed have a market, a rather large one I suspect.
 
Actually, I can see it as a choice for many places in the developing world. The one that comes first to mind is China. They will indeed have a market, a rather large one I suspect.

China ownes Cirrus and Continental with the CD-350 Diesel. Where you you think this project falls in the Chinese market plan?
 
What makes it sound like a good choice?:dunno: I don't see anything about it that makes it a good choice.

I don't think it is a good choice, I certainly wouldn't buy one (as much as I like Diamonds). The thing is that it doesn't really have any competition, if you want a turboprop with 4 seats, that's your only choice. I don't know anyone who would want to buy an airplane of that sort either, however I also don't know anyone who would want to buy those small jets (Cirrus jet, Citation Mustang, Honda jet, Embraer 100 ect...), yet you still see them around so someone clearly buys them. I suspect the same thing is going to happen here, sooner or later some rich guy is going to wake up and realize that he needs a small non aerobatic plane with fixed gear and 500hp!
 
Just a thought, maybe Diamond wants the reliability of a turbine?
 
I don't think it is a good choice, I certainly wouldn't buy one (as much as I like Diamonds). The thing is that it doesn't really have any competition, if you want a turboprop with 4 seats, that's your only choice. I don't know anyone who would want to buy an airplane of that sort either, however I also don't know anyone who would want to buy those small jets (Cirrus jet, Citation Mustang, Honda jet, Embraer 100 ect...), yet you still see them around so someone clearly buys them. I suspect the same thing is going to happen here, sooner or later some rich guy is going to wake up and realize that he needs a small non aerobatic plane with fixed gear and 500hp!

The small jets make much more sense, they fly fast, high, and are pressurized. They are a mini budget business jet. This is a slow utility plane of low capability. An operator who could use this can use a turbine 206 to much greater effect for the same price, and can probably end up more profitable with a 208 for a few bucks more, if any. Notice there was no price point, I suggest $800k as a minimum.

I'm just looking at a plane with what appears a non existent market.:dunno:
 
Flying Magazine said:
Dries [one of the two test pilots] said the flight lasted about 40 minutes and included agility testing, and the evaluation of power ratings at various altitudes up to 8,000 feet and climb rates at different speeds. The initial climb rate at 3,300 lbs was 2,800 fpm and the airplane reached a top speed of 175 knots indicated.
Read more at http://www.flyingmag.com/aircraft/turboprops/turbine-powered-diamond-da50-takes-flight#Tp0CdPc3uVwqkE7F.99

175 KIAS at 8000 feet means this thing will be one fast mother up in the low FLs.
 
I have to assume it would be pressurized...

Not pressurized = not very useful
 
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The small jets make much more sense, they fly fast, high, and are pressurized. They are a mini budget business jet. This is a slow utility plane of low capability. An operator who could use this can use a turbine 206 to much greater effect for the same price, and can probably end up more profitable with a 208 for a few bucks more, if any. Notice there was no price point, I suggest $800k as a minimum.

I'm just looking at a plane with what appears a non existent market.:dunno:

Guess we're starting to hijack the thread now, buy anyways. The only reason to buy a small jet is if you have the money to maintain your own airplane and you only travel locally. They don't have much range (with load) and again you can't carry that many people.
So you wouldn't buy it for charter purposes (then you're better off with a turboprop), and if you yourself have to go far you either have to make a few fuel stops or charter a bigger jet which makes no sense if you already own a small one.
People do still buy them so perhaps there is something I don't understand, however you do have to agree that you don't see those small jets very often...must be a reason.


Regarding the Diamond I really do hope that it works out for them and people actually buy it.
Back to that point I made regarding reliability. Would you rather fly a twin-piston or a single-turboprop? I'd prefer the turboprop, and on that basis if they can make the 50 cost about as much as the TwinStar, they got a market.

They really do need to make it look better and change the name.
 
I really wish Diamond would scrap the turbine idea and use the CD-350 and have a power plant and price point suited for the job. Designing an unpressurized plane for the upper flight levels is a very limited market, and a TDI engine will do the lower flight levels just fine and much more fuel and cost efficiently. The only time unpressurized turbines are practical is in work planes that need the power to weight ratio to pick up their load, and the 'turbine revolution' in the Ag business required a high level of concentration of work to survive, and many operators never survived the cost increase.
 
Sucking O2 for the same price and lower speed than a PA-46 JetProp...

If it can indicate 175 at FL 200 or even FL 230 then it's going to be in that 250 KTAS class as a (and here I'm guessing) $1MM to $1.3MM 4-seat single.

The PA-46 Malibu Meridian lists at $2.2MM and is a pressurized 6-place. I'd put that one a category up from the DA-50.

For 2 to 2.5 hours of O-sucking you could go a loooong way. I suck O's now for a lot less speed (and price!) than that. :D
 
If it can indicate 175 at FL 200 or even FL 230 then it's going to be in that 250 KTAS class as a (and here I'm guessing) $1MM to $1.3MM 4-seat single.

The PA-46 Malibu Meridian lists at $2.2MM and is a pressurized 6-place. I'd put that one a category up from the DA-50.

For 2 to 2.5 hours of O-sucking you could go a loooong way. I suck O's now for a lot less speed (and price!) than that. :D

Not many people want to fly an unpressurized plane at 200-230. Exactly, you suck Os at a very reduced price! The DA-50 will not see a greatly reduced price over a PA-46 JetProp.

If the DA-50 JP7 had a big market, you would see a lot more turbine Bonanzas, if the market existed Beech would have produced one like Piper did with the Meridian. Without pressurization, turbines don't make sense in GA.
 
Not many people want to fly an unpressurized plane at 200-230. Exactly, you suck Os at a very reduced price! The DA-50 will not see a greatly reduced price over a PA-46 JetProp.

If the DA-50 JP7 had a big market, you would see a lot more turbine Bonanzas, if the market existed Beech would have produced one like Piper did with the Meridian. Without pressurization, turbines don't make sense in GA.

Probably true. I have no idea what it would cost to operate a turboprop. Maintenance must be a beyotch. All else being equal (and it ain't) I would happily suck O's if the trade-off is rocketing along at two-fiddy with TP reliability.
 
Probably true. I have no idea what it would cost to operate a turboprop. Maintenance must be a beyotch. All else being equal (and it ain't) I would happily suck O's if the trade-off is rocketing along at two-fiddy with TP reliability.

That's the thing about turbines, maintenance is not a beyotch, that is why they charge so much for what they do.:lol: Turbines are very reliable and need little care between their planned major maint cycles, not zero, but no where near a recip. One of the factors to contend with on most turbines is cycles. Not only are parts time limited, they are also hot-cold cycle limited. With Ag planes they wrote us an extension where if we kept the engine burning, we could count 3 landing cycles as 2 on the PT-6 engines. The scheduled maintenance though can be eyewateringly expensive, and when you do have surprise failures, they can be really expensive. Many people operating turbines take part in a "power by the hour" type fixed cost engine program.
 
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