Cost of Repairs to sitting 182

Chad Vancil

Chad Vancil

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Chad Vancil
Hi everyone, I’m a student pilot currently training in a 172.
Through a friend I stumbled on a 182 that has been sitting for 18 years. The engine was pulled, fully refurbished then created (18 years ago). Wings are off and no fluids are in the plane and all been kept in a hanger. All logs are present. My question is and I know it’s tough, how much (ballpark) do you think it would cost to get it back in the sky? I know a few ADs have come out, a big one being the seat track. Any inside info would be appreciated. I still have a few months to get my PPL and looking to get my first plane. Thanks
 
I think you meant to write that the engine was "crated"? I guessing it wasn't run, so there is a better chance of it being in good condition than if it sat on the plane for 18 years. My opinion that is the costly part but I'm no A&P.

EDIT: See Nate's response below.
 
Sitting where?
Engine crated and pickled or just crated?
Avionics working, how old?

Just those three questions are tens of thousands of dollars if the answers aren’t good.
 
Very worthy project.
things to do, replace the fuel tank bladders, strip and paint it while apart, change the glass, prior to new paint.

All new tires and tubes, plus maybe wheels (if it still has the Mccauleys)
new interior the original must stink by now.
Pull all the cylinders, see what condition they are in, they could be perfect, they could be junk, and take a look at the engine interior, engines that were run varnish up, and protect themselves, a new engine that has no varnish, may have huge problems. Then again if it was preserved properly, who knows after 18 years.

but foremost, get your A&P involved day 1
I'm guessing 50k +-
 
Just Crated. yes it’s never been ran. 1976 Cessna 182P. Avionics work. Just looking for a ballpark so I know if the cheap price is worth the work restoring it. 15k owner passed unexpectedly and family friends wanting to sell. They have no use for it.
 
That aircraft is a 10k aircraft as is, and that much because it is a 182.
 
Chad Vancil said:
Just Crated. yes it’s never been ran. 1976 Cessna 182P. Avionics work. Just looking for a ballpark so I know if the cheap price is worth the work restoring it. 15k owner passed unexpectedly and family friends wanting to sell. They have no use for it.
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In that case offer 5k settle on 7500
 
You certainly are taking on an aggressive task. For a first time buyer,you could come across some expensive fixes.you should try to get quotes on an engine overhaul ,new bladders,a paint job and AD fixes. Then think what you might need for avionics. Good luck if you move forward.
 
My advice is run. You don't know what you don't know at this point. Maybe in 5 years you could do this, but you will easily pay a mechanic more than the plane will be worth to put it all back together.

If that doesn't bother you, then go for it. I'm always in favor of putting a plane back on line. But don't think you're getting a bargain, this is a money pit because you're a student and don't know the pitfalls.
 
Run. With fully working and regularly flown plane you will have enough headache. Trust me


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I figure it this way.

If I need a car to drive I buy a working car.

If I need a project I buy a project.

Do you need a project?
 
denverpilot said:
I figure it this way.

If I need a car to drive I buy a working car.

If I need a project I buy a project.

Do you need a project?
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Denver is offering sage advice here, although people need to realize that all airplanes, airworthy or not, are projects to some degree. Even new ones need work.
 
thanks everyone. Sounds like this is more of a headache than I need. Thought it might have been a good deal but that’s why I came here. Thanks
 
Snapshot - 2p.jpg Well ... had the same problem about 30 years ago. Hauled the hunk home on a flatbed. Gutted the interior, including all radios, instruments, and wiring. Started from scratch. Didn't spend a lot of time flying in the next two years, but I learned one HELL of a lot about my airplane. Engine had 1200 hours on it but hadn't run in ten years. Wings were in a farmer's hayloft in the barn. CHickens (literally) roosting on the back seat.

New bladders. New interior from Airtex. Overhauled all the instruments. Tossed away the crappy avionics and bought used on eBay. Primed and painted every single metal part on the airplane, then had a Navy painter that wanted outside work to do a $5k paintjob. Flawless. Bought three spools of wire and completely rewired the airplane.

Yeah, I have an A&P/IA, but didn't do anything that required anything more than a logbook entry about removal/repair and/or restorative painting that any A&P could do. $%k for the hull, another $20k and a couple of thousand hours and you have something that nobody else ever will.

Here you go. My widow will sell this airplane; I never will.



Jim
 
Tom-D said:
BIG RED flag, engine has had no protection for 18 years
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What if it was pickled? Just curious if that is something that protects long term, or has to be periodically renewed if an engine is sitting for years indoors.
 
weirdjim said:
View attachment 61562 Well ... had the same problem about 30 years ago. Hauled the hunk home on a flatbed. Gutted the interior, including all radios, instruments, and wiring. Started from scratch. Didn't spend a lot of time flying in the next two years, but I learned one HELL of a lot about my airplane. Engine had 1200 hours on it but hadn't run in ten years. Wings were in a farmer's hayloft in the barn. CHickens (literally) roosting on the back seat.

New bladders. New interior from Airtex. Overhauled all the instruments. Tossed away the crappy avionics and bought used on eBay. Primed and painted every single metal part on the airplane, then had a Navy painter that wanted outside work to do a $5k paintjob. Flawless. Bought three spools of wire and completely rewired the airplane.

Yeah, I have an A&P/IA, but didn't do anything that required anything more than a logbook entry about removal/repair and/or restorative painting that any A&P could do. $%k for the hull, another $20k and a couple of thousand hours and you have something that nobody else ever will.

Here you go. My widow will sell this airplane; I never will.



Jim
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She’s a beauty! What kinds of problems did you run into with the engine? If any?
 
Planes like that are for people that want to repair and restore, not fly. They own something else to fly.
 
Chad Vancil said:
I will bring my A&P and do my best not to get in over my head. Doesn’t hurt to take a look
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FWIW, I see people put huge effort and time into a homebuilt, and often end up with a lot less useful plane than a 182.

IF you are up to a project, and IF the airframe components are sound, you could end up with a nice plane for the effort. The nice thing about a project like this is you can pace the spending if you are patient and find a mechanic that will guide your work. Focus on those things needed to get it airworthy, get it flying, do the cosmetic stuff and really gee-wiz avionics later.

As Jim mentioned, you really don't need to blow your brains out on avionics. Eliminate the vacuum system with dual Garmin G5s, put in a used center stack. Upgrade it later.

Same with the interior. Clean it up or do something economical like Airtex now. Put in the leather after you get some time in it and decide if it's going to be a multi-year plane for you.

Even the engine shouldn't scare you too much as it can be borescoped to see if it has started to rust internally.

The airframe is the big item in my mind. Was it taken apart because of an accident? Poor quality repairs. Major corrosion issues. That's what kills airplanes. Everything else can be refurbished or replaced - junk airframes are junk airplanes.
 
Besides the expense and risk, don't plan on flying for 2 years. Yes there are outliers that get done in 6 months but "most projects".....

I agree with the $7500 price.
 
mondtster said:
...all airplanes, airworthy or not, are projects to some degree. Even new ones need work.
Click to expand...

:eek: :eek:

New Cirrus planes don't need work. :p
They go back to an authorized Cirrus Service Center to have the pixie dust coating renewed. Nothing else. @SixPapaCharlie made a tell-all video about that, but the Cirrus Police confiscated it and made him buy a Grumman for breaking the secret society oath. :fingerwag:
 
Chad Vancil said:
She’s a beauty! What kinds of problems did you run into with the engine? If any?
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Starter adapter had an internal bearing problem that sounded like a rod bearing from the get-go --- that was the crapshoot. Other than that, I've been somewhat religious about changing her oil and filters every 50 hours. She's got about 1900 hours and still 75+/80 although I admit to a top at about 1500 hours. I plan on running her to at least 2500 on the bottom end with cylinders as necessary (just like any other Continental papier-maiche cylinders on the engine).
 
SInce that engine was overhauled, there have been airworthiness directives against certain crankshafts and cylinders that might be in that engine. Those are much bigger deal-breakers than the seat and rail AD.
 
GRG55 said:
FWIW, I see people put huge effort and time into a homebuilt, and often end up with a lot less useful plane than a 182.

IF you are up to a project, and IF the airframe components are sound, you could end up with a nice plane for the effort. The nice thing about a project like this is you can pace the spending if you are patient and find a mechanic that will guide your work. Focus on those things needed to get it airworthy, get it flying, do the cosmetic stuff and really gee-wiz avionics later.

As Jim mentioned, you really don't need to blow your brains out on avionics. Eliminate the vacuum system with dual Garmin G5s, put in a used center stack. Upgrade it later.

Same with the interior. Clean it up or do something economical like Airtex now. Put in the leather after you get some time in it and decide if it's going to be a multi-year plane for you.

Even the engine shouldn't scare you too much as it can be borescoped to see if it has started to rust internally.

The airframe is the big item in my mind. Was it taken apart because of an accident? Poor quality repairs. Major corrosion issues. That's what kills airplanes. Everything else can be refurbished or replaced - junk airframes are junk airplanes.
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Thanks, the wings were only taken off to fit in a garage while the engine overhaul was taking place. Then he got sick and it’s never moved.
 
Chad Vancil said:
She’s a beauty!
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You want to hear about the airplane or the lady I spent the week with at Oshkosh that year? Yes, she is a beauty and I've had problems with her engine for the last 6 years. Let me give you some advice on marrying a lady when you are in your 70s.

When you make jewelry out of rocks, you pick pretty rocks and put them in a tumbler with some abrasive material and let them tumble to take off the rock sharp edges. Eventually those rocks will roll over each other and wear off the sharp edges and let the rocks wear until they slide over each other easily.

You put two 70+ year old rocks into a marriage tumbler and turn that tumbler on. Eventually those two rocks will polish and slide over each other and be totally compatible. But in the process, knocking those 70 year old sharp edges off is a CRYSTAL *****. If you understand what I mean.

Jim
 
Dan Thomas said:
SInce that engine was overhauled, there have been airworthiness directives against certain crankshafts and cylinders that might be in that engine. Those are much bigger deal-breakers than the seat and rail AD.
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Good call. I’ll research that.
 
Chad Vancil said:
Thanks, the wings were only taken off to fit in a garage while the engine overhaul was taking place. Then he got sick and it’s never moved.
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That seems like a lot of extra, unnecessary work for an engine overhaul. That's my initial reaction.

If it was me I would start with a knowledgable A&P, experienced with 182s and go over the airframe thoroughly. If it checks out then consider taking the next steps. If not, run.
 
GRG55 said:
What if it was pickled? J
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There are so many ways to do that, you'd never know how good it was until you see the interior.
 
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If you can get it cheap, buy it, you can always salvage it and make money.
 
The C-85 engine in my J-4 was overhauled and assembled in 1985 but never run until 2014. There has been no sign of internal corrosion.

It was kept in a dry Minnesota basement. I think you should demand your mechanic to show you why it isn't a good deal. Don't assume it yet.
 
GRG55 said:
What if it was pickled? Just curious if that is something that protects long term, or has to be periodically renewed if an engine is sitting for years indoors.
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When the Continental on my 190 crapped out, I found a Firewall Forward Jake that was a fresh overhaul but it was done 10 years earlier and it sat pickled for that time. Inside it looked fine, but the seals and gaskets had all dried out and the thing leaked like a seive. I would probably recommend a tear down just to replace the seals and gaskets. If there is no machining to do, I wouldn’t think it would cost all that much. But I am not an expert in those matters.
 
If I were going to buy it I would pay about half of what you think it could be parted out for mainly because of the engine unknowns. That way you MIGHT be able to recoup most of your money. I am currently looking at a plane that is running has been flying fairly regularly. It doesn't have a ton of hours on it but is an old overhaul. It is priced accordingly at about the price it is worth without the engine or about what you could part it out for. Still not sure if I am going to pull the trigger. Waiting on nice weather to fly it again and then possibly do the prebuy if I plan to go forward. It is one of those deals where if you could get 500 hours out of the current engine it would be a great deal. If you can't you would have a plane worth about what you had into it. Crap shoot I guess.
 
I’d be all over that plane if I was interested in a 182. If the engine was preserved and the rest is in good shape? It’s probably way better than a lot of the running airplanes you’ll find. Is there a component of risk? Sure, but there is with any airplane.

I’d expect some degree of engine disassembly and reassembly to inspect it. Not a big deal, especially off the airplane. The airframe itself should be as good as it was 18 years ago. It’ll need some attention to moving parts and a good corrosion inspection but those are simple to do while reassembling. You may have found a great opportunity.
 
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Greg Bockelman said:
When the Continental on my 190 crapped out, I found a Firewall Forward Jake that was a fresh overhaul but it was done 10 years earlier and it sat pickled for that time. Inside it looked fine, but the seals and gaskets had all dried out and the thing leaked like a seive. I would probably recommend a tear down just to replace the seals and gaskets. If there is no machining to do, I wouldn’t think it would cost all that much. But I am not an expert in those matters.
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That is exactly what I'd do. Just to get the warm and fuzzy feeling of knowing there is nothing wrong.
 
Since you stated you think the seat track AD is a "big one", I'll suggest you have a lot more research and learning to do before stepping into owning a 182, or any airplane. I've owned a share of '77 182Q for almost 14 years, and the seat track AD is one of the most trivial things we've dealt with.
 
Jeff Oslick said:
Since you stated you think the seat track AD is a "big one", I'll suggest you have a lot more research and learning to do before stepping into owning a 182, or any airplane. I've owned a share of '77 182Q for almost 14 years, and the seat track AD is one of the most trivial things we've dealt with.
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Well said. I was trying to think of how to put that. Same here. That’s a cheap AD and easy.
 
This
Jeff Oslick said:
Since you stated you think the seat track AD is a "big one", I'll suggest you have a lot more research and learning to do before stepping into owning a 182, or any airplane. I've owned a share of '77 182Q for almost 14 years, and the seat track AD is one of the most trivial things we've dealt with.
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This isn’t a money thing. Either way I go I’m not going to do a loan. It’s a is it worth my time question. Really I’m asking if I dump 30-40k in this would I end up with a nicer plane. Or buy a 50k plane and put 10-15k in it. Just trying to look at both ways to get the best bang for my buck.
 
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