Controllers can't eat??

flyersfan31

flyersfan31

Touchdown! Greaser!
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Freiburgfan31
http://www.denverpost.com/colleges/ci_4604717

I'm a little confused bythe article, saying now Denver tower controllers have to take vacation to get out of the tower. I assume the 8.5hr workday is a 9hr day, less .5hr unpaid lunch time. That's not unusual. I don't get the tower lockdown thing though. Can't they scoot out during their unpaid lunchtime and get food? Doesn't leave much time to buy, eat, and return, but lots of people are in that situation. It does seem unreasonable that they can't even brown bag it, since the TSA won't let stuff past the checkpoints.

The FAA seems a bit like the USPS - lots of nitpicky rules for the employees and no leeway for common sense or judgement.

I don't know enough about the situation either way, but I thought this was kind of a bizarre story.
 
flyersfan31 said:
The FAA seems a bit like the USPS - lots of nitpicky rules for the employees and no leeway for common sense or judgement.

I don't know enough about the situation either way, but I thought this was kind of a bizarre story.
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1) There are undoubtedly two sides to the story, each with a particular spin.

2) Many government agencies live by personnel (HR) management theories that were popular many years ago. And were, in part, responsible for labor problems and poor quality at many American businesses (I recently heard from someone who was rebuilding a car made in the early 60's and found a scap metal bar in a door that was labeled something to the effect: 'now you found the rattle'.)

3) I had a conversation on an airline flight yesterday that is a local government manager. He was asking me how I might deal with an employee issue related to an ambitious person that was beat out for a promotion by someone with seniority. He has direct and indirect reports well over 100 people. Those things ought to be addressed in management skills training that the particular agency doesn't undertake. See point 2) above.
 
wsuffa said:
1) There are undoubtedly two sides to the story, each with a particular spin.
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You betcha. Especially with the current labor friction, one can never be sure about the spin. One more reason why I couldn't make sense of the story -- I couldn't tell whose axe was being ground...
 
The story in the paper says that controllers at DIA have to pass thru security checkpoint. Supervisors can carry food and drink thru the checkpoints, so controllers could request their supervisor bring it iirc. Sounds like a bunch of BS regs and/or spin to make a story look good...perhaps somewhere in the middle lies the truth.
 
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No wonder C90 controllers are so testy.
 
smigaldi said:
They don't work in a tower they are TRACON controllers and this may not apply to them.
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Yeah. I guess I was just trying to come up with a valid reason. I'll just fall back on "because they like it that way".:goofy:
 
whew. When I first saw the threat title I was thinking this was gonna be another one of those "Oh poor us, we got passed by on another raise" threads.
 
I'll try to give as little spin as I can.

I am a NATCA member.

Controllers have "always" worked only an 8 hour day. We get a paid lunch because we are expected to be available for recall.

Historically we have been allowed to leave the facility to pick up food. This would have included these DEN controllers going out to the concourse and purchasing food to bring back to the tower. We are not allowed to leave the facility any more unless we are on some type of leave.

The FAA recently imposed new work rules on us and are strictly enforcing some of the rules.

Tracon controllers (C90) have to go through a security checkpoint to get in the facility, but it isn't AFAIK run by TSA, and not subject to the random TSA banned item list. They can bring pretty much whatever they want for lunch.

At one point in time I had to go through airport/passenger security (circa 1990) and they would actually force us to unwrap our hot dogs and such we had just purchased off airport. I can't imagine what the current crop of TSAers are doing.

These controllers could bring food from home, but it would be the subject to the same restrictions as airline passengers.
 
N2212R said:
Haven't been to DEN's tower, but GRRs tower you don't have to go through any checkpoints.
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I visited Denver's tower back before 9/11 and you do have to go through the security checkpoint. You get to it from Concourse C which is the one furthest north which you can't get to except on the train.
 
A friend works in the DEN tower. I haven't talked to him about the current situation. But when I asked if we could tour he said sure if you can find a way though security without a ticket.

And as someone else posted this is about paid lunches and being available. The security side just make it harder to bring their own lunches. Like one was quoted in the paper, 'you can bring leftover turkey but not the gravey'.
 
Ahhhh - I think I get it now. Because they're subject to immediate recall to the screens, they aren't supposed to wander too far away. The FAA is now saying going out to the concourse is too far away?

There has to be a way to fix something like this without coming to blows. Man's gotta eat, man needs a breather....
 
ejensen said:
A friend works in the DEN tower. I haven't talked to him about the current situation. But when I asked if we could tour he said sure if you can find a way though security without a ticket.
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It isn't hard to do if you know anything about the system.

For example, there was the guy that had the fake boarding-pass generator. The FBI has shut him down after he publicized it in his blog, and they are investigating whether he "aided terrorists".
 
wsuffa said:
It isn't hard to do if you know anything about the system.

For example, there was the guy that had the fake boarding-pass generator. The FBI has shut him down after he publicized it in his blog, and they are investigating whether he "aided terrorists".
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:) That's probably true. I was thinking legal.:dunno:
 
ejensen said:
A friend works in the DEN tower. I haven't talked to him about the current situation. But when I asked if we could tour he said sure if you can find a way though security without a ticket.

And as someone else posted this is about paid lunches and being available. The security side just make it harder to bring their own lunches. Like one was quoted in the paper, 'you can bring leftover turkey but not the gravey'.
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Hmm, could you freeze the gravy?

Just freeze everything solid as a rock and take it through, then melt it on the other side.
 
I'm sure there's a way for folks to be escorted through to the tower. God knows there are contractors who'll have to come visit and repair stuff in there.
 
TMetzinger said:
I'm sure there's a way for folks to be escorted through to the tower. God knows there are contractors who'll have to come visit and repair stuff in there.
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Haven't had the energy to call TSA and see. There are class D towers without the hassle. I'm guessing you have to have a purpose.
 
ejensen said:
:) That's probably true. I was thinking legal.:dunno:
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There is a perfectly legal way to do it. But I'm not going to post it here. All it requires is a credit card and some creativity. ;)
 
ejensen said:
Haven't had the energy to call TSA and see. There are class D towers without the hassle. I'm guessing you have to have a purpose.
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If the tower wants to sponsor a visit, I'm sure they could.

Both Washington Center and Potomac Approach sponsor get-togethers, and Dulles tower has as well, and the tower is past security. Last time I think everyone pre-registered and was met by the airport authority police and escorted past, bypassing TSA screening completely.
 
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