Controlled Burns (Fires)?

kimberlyanne546

kimberlyanne546

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Kimberly
Hello everyone,

Yesterday I was at work when a co-worker looked out the window and noticed smoke. We all went outside and the smell was very strong. Soon, the surrounding mountains / hills were no longer visible and they asked me to call the non-emergency number for the fire department.

The phone rang and a woman answered, asking immediately:

"Southern Marin Fire District, are you calling about the controlled burn?"

I thanked her, and told my co-workers (who have houses nearby) that everything was OK.

The next thing I did was to go online, looking for details such as time and location. I could not find anything but found a list of fires that seemed to be updated by the fire department. It had nothing for that day but did list fires as recent as the day before. Controlled burns were not listed - only "accidental" fires - I think.


My question is this:

Let's pretend I had planned to fly that day. Would calling 800-WX-BRIEF or using any other source of aviation weather have alerted me to this visibility / smell hazard before I took off so that I could either cancel my flight or use another route?

I spent quite a while searching fire websites and could not find any information.

Since this was a "planned" event I'm wondering who the people starting the burn notify. There are forms to fill out, etc. so there should be a record of it somewhere?
 
They notify the local fire department. I believe it stays with the local fire department unless it gets out of hand, in which case they would call CDF. If that happens then there could potentially be a firefighting TFR for the affected area. Controlled burns don't show up otherwise in a brief as far as I know, unless the fire had been reported in a pirep.
 
I was walking down the street once and saw smoke. I started sprinting toward it in case my assistance was needed (although what I could have done is somewhat less than obvious in retrospect) and saw that it was a house being burned down by firemen. Made sense, actually. Good way to get training, and the house had to go anyway. Not enough smoke to affect aircraft, though.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
My question is this:

Let's pretend I had planned to fly that day. Would calling 800-WX-BRIEF or using any other source of aviation weather have alerted me to this visibility / smell hazard before I took off so that I could either cancel my flight or use another route?
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Generally no, unless it was a REALLY big burn.

Last summer, I was flying from Bullhead City to Phoenix and saw a smoke plume in the mountains S of Prescott. It was clearly coming from a fire in the forest - I reported it to Abuquerque Center and they were not aware of it so they called the Forest Service to find out that yes, it was a controlled burn. I wasn't reporting it as a hazard....just wanted the folks on the ground to know (in case it hadn't been reported yet) so that they could deal with it as soon as possible.

If ATC was unaware, then I doubt the WX service folks would know. Generally (speaking as a former volunteer FF who has done plenty of controlled burns myself) if the burn is producing enough smoke/hot air to seriously create a hazard to flight/navigation....then it is probably no longer a 'controlled' burn!
 
steingar said:
I was walking down the street once and saw smoke. I started sprinting toward it in case my assistance was needed (although what I could have done is somewhat less than obvious in retrospect) and saw that it was a house being burned down by firemen. Made sense, actually. Good way to get training, and the house had to go anyway. Not enough smoke to affect aircraft, though.
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Were there books in that house? That's probably why the firemen were burning it. :wink2:
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
...
My question is this:

Let's pretend I had planned to fly that day. Would calling 800-WX-BRIEF or using any other source of aviation weather have alerted me to this visibility / smell hazard before I took off so that I could either cancel my flight or use another route?
...
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S/Central KS burns prairie every spring. It's not unusual to see METARs with visibility down and the "FU" code a hundred or more miles away.
 
Growing up in Maine, we would have controlled burns during the spring. Mostly around the perimeter of property along roads to protect them from fries that could get accidentally started along a road.

Also to burn out heavy thatch in hay fields, open up the fields to fresh grass and the burning would add nutrients back to the fields. You could tell which fields were burned and which were not. The more recently burned were a lot greener later in the spring/summer.
 
At some parks (Yellowstone is noted for this now after the fires in the late 1980's), they do controlled burns. In Custer National forest in SD, it looks like they cut down "extra" trees. Both actions seem to control the pine beetles as well as limiting how big an uncontrolled fire can get.

In NE, one often notices a farmer burning the weeds out of their drainage ditches. Lincoln ATC set me straight on that some years ago when I reported a fire once.
 
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Blight burns, stubble field burns, USFS controlled burns, and where I live, we can burn yard waste. Most pilots up here are well aware of controlled burns. However, if we see smoke between June 1st and October 1st, somethings amiss. But unless its some ginormous FS burn, or a wildland fire, I've never come across a NOTAM for it.

Seeing as you are in the Bay Area, one would assume that the local fire dept or dispatch center would have a record of it.

Come Oct 1st, unless the county extends the ban because of the warm weather, I've got several piles of orchard trimmings and noxious weeds that need to be dealt with. Because they are relatively small piles, I don't have to notify anyone.
 
On my second dual cross country with my instructor we went to MVY - Martha's Vineyard. There was a controlled burn on the island with a fairly substantial amount of smoke about 4 nm from the airport. While I concentrated on flying the plane my instructor asked the tower about it and they said it was a controlled burn and nothing to be concerned about. If the winds had been a different direction it could have impacted visibility at the airport but probably not enough to lower it below VFR minimums.

No mention of the controlled burn on the ATIS. I now know that controlled burns are common on the Vineyard.
 
Ah, finally a topic I can comfortably comment on. Our Fire/Rescue helicopter's primary mission is fire fighting. (secondary is EMS then Law enforcement missions) It would take a large fire to produce enough smoke to produce that much of a hazard. I am sure out west has much bigger control burns but in Florida they rarely are more that 1000 acres.

And because they are 'control' burns, they only burn the under brush. It is when you have an uncontrolled brush fire that the smoke can become a problem. That is because these fires burn the underbrush, the peat (ground), the the trees and the crowns.

I hope this gives you some insight into the when and how the smoke can become an issue for pilots.
 
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flightmedic said:
Ah, finally a topic I can comfortably comment on. Our Fire/Rescue helicopter's primary mission is fire fighting. (secondary is EMS then Law enforcement missions) It would take a large fire to produce enough smoke to produce that much of a hazard. I am sure out west has much bigger control burns but in Florida they rarely are more that 1000 acres.

And because they are 'control' burns, they only burn the under brush. It is when you have an uncontrolled brush fire that the smoke can become a problem. That is because these fires burn the underbrush, the peat (ground), the the trees and the crowns.

I hope this gives you some insight into the when and how the smoke can become an issue for pilots.
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That is a good point. I've flown through controlled burn smoke before, and it really isn't an issue in terms of limiting visibility. I mean you can fly around the thick stuff anyway without going too much out of your way. Bigger concern to me is getting caught in a pop up TFR as will happen if it's a big uncontrolled burn and CDF sends their bombers out.

I did, however, leave San Diego (KSEE) once and there was a big uncontrolled fire in the hills, which made the flight IFR. And it actually was IMC, you really couldn't see much. I cancelled as soon as I got above it.
 
Sac Arrow said:
That is a good point. I've flown through controlled burn smoke before, and it really isn't an issue in terms of limiting visibility.
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Agreed. It might look like a lot of smoke from the ground, but you'll be lucky to even notice it from the air.
 
I don't know what is required in CA, but where I am, I contact the Sheriff dispatch to let them know I am burning. Open burning season begins again October 1. There have been quite a few wildfires in the state and all the local TFR's for them appear to have been lifted. I flew to Helena today and on my initial climb I went through a dense smoke layer. Must have dropped the visibility to perhaps 10 miles max. I sure would not like having reduced visibility like that as a normal day.

Anyway, I got past that ok and visibility returned to our normal. Along the way, I went past another wildfire where the winds were blowing it away from me. Flames were everywhere and I saw one tiny aircraft in the distance flying low near the flames. Must have been a chopper. I would say it looked like the equivalent of a beetle trying to put out a house fire with teaspoon full of water. On second thought, that might be overstating how much water it could drop... Too bad I did not take my camera with me today.
 
kimberlyanne546 said:
My question is this:

Let's pretend I had planned to fly that day. Would calling 800-WX-BRIEF or using any other source of aviation weather have alerted me to this visibility / smell hazard before I took off so that I could either cancel my flight or use another route?
Click to expand...

Only if someone had filed a PIREP or it's an ongoing thing from a big fire then they'll issue some SIGMET or NOTAM in the briefing. Outside of that though, for small limited fires, there will be no NOTAM issued.
 
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