Clarity Aloft’s overpriced?

172andyou said:
Probably placebo effect. It isn't because the ANR is causing pressure, that's just a non-starter from a physics standpoint.
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It’s may be a non-starter from an oscilloscope standpoint, but it is real, and it makes sense from a physical standpoint.
 
172andyou said:
Correct, it's not perfect. Incorrect if your implication is that somehow it increases the sound pressure (commonly known as volume) on the eardrum. The imperfections are why you can still hear the engine some despite the ANR. If it were perfect, you wouldn't hear it at all. The real problem isn't processing lag either, it's that sound is coming from all directions and the headsets can only cancel whatever their microphone(s) pick up. So some of the sounds coming from other directions are out of phase with the corrective signal.

I'm guessing that somewhere you might have misunderstood what the prof was saying, because (as someone who has worked in related fields) this is physics 101 stuff. Not something an actual prof would likely get wrong. It's a shockingly messy problem to get perfect, but in no instance is it actually increasing sound pressure. The reason it sounds quieter is because it *is* quieter from a sound pressure (volume) standpoint.
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I would guess that where we’re differing is what constitutes “volume”...the ANR’ quiet sound, no question...but “volume” isn’t generated by a constant pressure on the eardrum, it’s generated by the amount of deflection from where the eardrum was before the sound occurred. Constant pressure has a constant deflection that we feel, but there’s very low volume associated with it because the deflection of the eardrum isn’t being changed because of the cancellation sound generated.
 
MauleSkinner said:
I would guess that where we’re differing is what constitutes “volume”...the ANR’ quiet sound, no question...but “volume” isn’t generated by a constant pressure on the eardrum, it’s generated by the amount of deflection from where the eardrum was before the sound occurred. Constant pressure has a constant deflection that we feel, but there’s very low volume associated with it because the deflection of the eardrum isn’t being changed because of the cancellation sound generated.
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Any chance you can translate to layman's English. And does this have anything to do with the fact we actually "hear" pressure differentials, not sound waves?

Tim
 
MauleSkinner said:
It’s may be a non-starter from an oscilloscope standpoint, but it is real, and it makes sense from a physical standpoint.
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But it's not real and doesn't make sense. O-scopes measure what's actually happening. The energy is being dissipated, not doubled.

MauleSkinner said:
I would guess that where we’re differing is what constitutes “volume”...the ANR’ quiet sound, no question...but “volume” isn’t generated by a constant pressure on the eardrum, it’s generated by the amount of deflection from where the eardrum was before the sound occurred. Constant pressure has a constant deflection that we feel, but there’s very low volume associated with it because the deflection of the eardrum isn’t being changed because of the cancellation sound generated.
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I appreciate you trying to find the gap, but that's not it. :)

I was trying to make it simpler by using the volume example. But failed.

There is no increase in air pressure or volume. Period. The system works by taking sound energy out of the air by oscillating the speaker in the ear cup exactly opposite to the sound waves. To get more pressure you would need to pump more air into the cups. So you would have to have a fan or something in the headset. And the air would leak out the cups. And any change would be minuscule compare to the pressure changes associated with altitude, or someone blowing your ear. And, and, and. It's just a total non-starter.
 
tspear said:
And does this have anything to do with the fact we actually "hear" pressure differentials, not sound waves?
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Sound waves and pressure differentials are the same things. A sound wave *is* a rapidly oscillating series of pressure differentials. When ANR is active, it oscillated the speaker exactly opposite the sound wave and cancels it out so that pressure doesn't continue to propagate.
 
Let's try it this way. I think you might be envisioning a sound wave and thinking that ANR, kind of, fills the sound wave to the top and without the oscillations the ear doesn't perceive any sound. That's how one would get an increase in pressure. But that ignores the negative phase of the sound wave. What actually happens is that the negatives are raise to the static value and the peaks are reduced to the static value. This happens by adding energy to the negative phase and removing energy from the positive phase. In both instances, the result is that the pressure wave (sound wave) is eliminated. Not raise to the peak, not lowered to the minimum, but flattened to the static pressure of the system (air).
 
172andyou said:
But it's not real and doesn't make sense. O-scopes measure what's actually happening. The energy is being dissipated, not doubled.



I appreciate you trying to find the gap, but that's not it. :)

I was trying to make it simpler by using the volume example. But failed.

There is no increase in air pressure or volume. Period. The system works by taking sound energy out of the air by oscillating the speaker in the ear cup exactly opposite to the sound waves. To get more pressure you would need to pump more air into the cups. So you would have to have a fan or something in the headset. And the air would leak out the cups. And any change would be minuscule compare to the pressure changes associated with altitude, or someone blowing your ear. And, and, and. It's just a total non-starter.
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If I’m understanding you correctly, you’re saying that I can’t feel if an ANR headset is in or off. Maybe I can’t explain the physics of it to your satisfaction, but I CAN feel whether they’re on or off.
 
MauleSkinner said:
If I’m understanding you correctly, you’re saying that I can’t feel if an ANR headset is in or off. Maybe I can’t explain the physics of it to your satisfaction, but I CAN feel whether they’re on or off.
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It's likely the silence making you think you can feel it. Kind of like the sensation of getting water in your ear.
 
MauleSkinner said:
If I’m understanding you correctly, you’re saying that I can’t feel if an ANR headset is in or off. Maybe I can’t explain the physics of it to your satisfaction, but I CAN feel whether they’re on or off.
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I'm not doubting you can "feel" it. I'm wondering what the feeling really is, since it is demonstrably not a pressure change.
 
Ravioli said:
Did you try them at a show for a couple minutes or in an actual airplane for an hour or so?

I ask because you previously said "they couldn't give them to me..."

Your opinion could change with actual usage.
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Never flown with them but I don’t think it would matter. Even foam ear plugs bug me. I use over the ear muffs for yard work and shooting.
 
I have about 300 hours on a set of Halos. They work pretty well, although the mic doesn’t stay put very well, and also tends to twist so it’s not pointed straight at my mouth. With putting it in and out of the plane on every flight, the mic boom broke inside the heat shrink covering.

I sent it in for repair. All it needed as a new wire for the mic boom, but he went ahead and rebuilt the whole headset. That was nice, but he charged $100 because it was beyond the warranty period.

Pretty soon I’ll finally have a plane that is just mine, so the headset will stay in it. I’ll use a pair of David Clarks for instructing.
 
I personally have been flying nothing but my Clarity Aloft Headset since my 2nd or 3rd flight in training. I love them and wouldn't trade them for any over the ear headset. Price was cheaper than the Lightspeeds I was using my first couple flights, and considering the price of most things in Aviation, I had no issues spending the money on a good set of Clarity Alofts. I have bought some cheaper versions for my favorite passenger and I have several over the ear for passengers as well. I bought a second set of Clarity Alofts at Oshkosh this year to replace the cheap set, because my passenger couldn't hear well. She loves the Clarity Alofts.

I have roughly 180 hours on mine, I purchased the Link option i.e. Bluetooth, at around $795 (this is list price, and I don't recall the price I paid with Tax) but that still comes out to $4 an hour so far. Cheaper than fuel at most airports per gallon.
 
I have the clarity aloft, my only issue is how long it takes the stick the plugs in my ears.

Since I CFI sometimes I jump in and out of airplane several times a day. Just easier to toss the old reliable DCs on my head.

For longer XCs, it’s CA all the way.
 
Ryanb said:
I’ve been doing some window shopping for a new headset recently. I have to say that it’s impressive how much coin a thin piece of wire and some ear plugs will bring in. $525-$795 depending on the model seems astronomically high considering what it is. Kudo’s to their marketing and production team for being able to make excellent margins on their product.
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I have two older Lightspeed Mach 1 headsets... the in ear type that was once a competitor to Clarity Aloft. Recently, I decided to consider buying a newer headset. I checked out the CA headset, but I wanted a modern headset with Bluetooth. When I saw that it costs $200 to add Bluetooth to a CA, I said no thanks... that should be about a $15 upgrade.

Instead I spent $75 to have my Lightspeeds refurbished. It’s a better headset anyway.
 
I didn't much like sticking the things in my ears (I only typically wore Margy's CA's when I had a passenger in the right seat (other than her) and I'd give them my lightspeeds and I had my own tips for the CAs.

Of course, I may feel differently now after having hearing aids stuck in my ears for two years now.
 
I have QT Halos and Bose A20s, with a LEMO plug for power. I fly with the Halos and let the passengers use the Bose. The Bose works nice, and it's nice and quiet, but I personally find the Halos more comfortable. I wouldn't say the noise attenuation/reduction is all that much "better" either way, but they are quite different. I can understand radio calls better with the Halos. About the only thing I don't like is the tiny little cord that could stand to be a foot or two shorter... it's really easy to get tangled up on my shoe if I'm not careful. And that's the biggest gripe I have, so it's not much of a gripe.

My co-owner bought Halos. Didn't like them, sold them, bought Lightspeed and loves them. I guess it's just a boxers/briefs/whatever else kind of thing, personal preference.
 
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