Cirrus crash (?) in Indy

How much ya wanna bet the loud bang was the parachute deployment?

It looks like Cirrus just had another save.

Now if they can just get past why the engine sputtered.
 
mikea said:
How much ya wanna bet the loud bang was the parachute deployment?

It looks like Cirrus just had another save.

Now if they can just get past why the engine sputtered.
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According to the witness in the article, there were two loud booms. The first he associated with the engine shutting off and the second with the chute deployment.
 
Frank Browne said:
According to the witness in the article, there were two loud booms. The first he associated with the engine shutting off and the second with the chute deployment.
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My $.02, the first boom was the rocket engine on the parachute, the second was the parashute itself filling up with air.
 
smigaldi said:
My $.02, the first boom was the rocket engine on the parachute, the second was the parashute itself filling up with air.
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Isn't there a good bit of squiding with those systems to lessen the opening shock? Wouldn't that keep the chute from snapping open too rapidly? :dunno:
 
Frank Browne said:
Isn't there a good bit of squiding with those systems to lessen the opening shock? Wouldn't that keep the chute from snapping open too rapidly? :dunno:
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There is ring around the chute that holds it closed until it's fully deployed the the ring slides down and gradually (relatively) opens the chute.

There are also line cutters so that the chute deploys in a good nose down attitude then the cutters cut one of the lines and the plane levels off.

Joe
 
Areeda said:
There is ring around the chute that holds it closed until it's fully deployed the the ring slides down and gradually (relatively) opens the chute.

There are also line cutters so that the chute deploys in a good nose down attitude then the cutters cut one of the lines and the plane levels off.

Joe
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I think I mis-used the term squiding. Thanks Joe. As I thought.
 
Frank Browne said:
According to the witness in the article, there were two loud booms. The first he associated with the engine shutting off and the second with the chute deployment.
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Why would the engine go "boom" if it were shutting down - unless it was a major backfire event (do Cirri have electronic ignitions or magneto systems?), or there was a major catastophic engine failure?

Maybe a sputter from bad fuel. A boom just does not compute Will Robinson.

This sounds like a question for the resident wrench, if he is available for a consult.
 
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Frank Browne said:
Isn't there a good bit of squiding with those systems to lessen the opening shock? Wouldn't that keep the chute from snapping open too rapidly? :dunno:
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I am sure they do Frank. I was just commenting that with the info we have, and prior experiences, I was doubting the engine shutting off with a boom. Sounded like a set up for the classic 'engine stall' report.

The two booms could have even been just one boom echoing. There are a lot of strange acustic things and I would not relay on just what someone heard to figure out what happened.
 
smigaldi said:
I am sure they do Frank. I was just commenting that with the info we have, and prior experiences, I was doubting the engine shutting off with a boom. Sounded like a set up for the classic 'engine stall' report.

The two booms could have even been just one boom echoing. There are a lot of strange acustic things and I would not relay on just what someone heard to figure out what happened.
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I agree completely. I was just noting that in the article, the witness reported two separate booms. And I think Winston is right. There could have been some sound from a catastophic engine failure, then the sound of the chute deployment.
 
Areeda said:
There is ring around the chute that holds it closed until it's fully deployed the the ring slides down and gradually (relatively) opens the chute.

There are also line cutters so that the chute deploys in a good nose down attitude then the cutters cut one of the lines and the plane levels off.

Joe
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And the line cutters mounted at the firewall are also small explosive charges. I was just reading that they have to be replaced every 5 years, or at least there's an AD to replace the ones on the early Cirrii.
 
That news photo makes me wonder just how fast these planes make contact with the ground while descending on that parachute. Anyone have any idea?
 
Pjsmith said:
That news photo makes me wonder just how fast these planes make contact with the ground while descending on that parachute. Anyone have any idea?
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I think IIRC that it's roughly 1400fpm, or a bit over 23fps. :hairraise:

That's why the landing gear is designed to take the brunt of the damage. This is the second time a Cirrus has chuted into water, the first resulted in a fairly serious back injury 'cuz the water keeps the gear from doing its job.
 
wbarnhill said:
Looks like the pilot passed away.
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I heard a news report this morning that said the pilot may have suffered a stroke.

Rather than answering questions, it just brings up more?
Who deployed the 'chute?
Was the engine still operating?

- Aunt Peggy
 
I've heard that, with regard to how hard the landing in a chute-deployed Cirrus is, it's not something you'll want to volunteer to repeat.

Unless, I guess, you're being saved from a catastrophic malfunction...
 
AuntPeggy said:
I heard a news report this morning that said the pilot may have suffered a stroke.

Rather than answering questions, it just brings up more?
Who deployed the 'chute?
Was the engine still operating?
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The word is the son pulled the chute. We can hope he knew the procedure was to bring the engine to idle first.

I bet the procedure is on a placard at the chute handle.

What's weird to me is that they weren't too far from the airport. It must have been seconds after applying full throttle for takeoff that the son diagnosed the problem with dad and remembered to pull the chute. We can hope dad briefed them on popping the chute.
 
mikea said:
You take your wife, your son, and his girlfriend on your first flight in a new plane?
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Why not? My sense of self preservation is such that if it's safe for me, it's safe for anyone.
 
jkaduk said:
mikea said:
You take your wife, your son, and his girlfriend on your first flight in a new plane?
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Why not? My sense of self preservation is such that if it's safe for me, it's safe for anyone.
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John King says the same thing: Why do we think it's safer to take a risk of we don't have any others along? I'd say because there's a fine distinction between deciding that the risk is acceptable to bet your skin on and deciding that the risk is acceptable to bet the skin of others on it, too.

In this case they launched into a 700 foot overcast. If it really was the first flight in this plane for the pilot/co-owner, which I'll doubt, that would be plain dumb.

Even if I just sold one just like it, my first flight would have been with a CFI in VFR conditions, and after those few hours of dual, I'd have some more hours in the new plane before I took the family along. NASA and the Air Force wouldn't do anything less and they have a lot more preflight procedures and checks than Cirrus does. You ever had problems in the first few days of driving a new car?

There was the other Cirrus chute deployment where the guy took the first flight in the plane after repeated complaints and avionics work into low IMC, although I understand that was allegedly more of a case of a lose nut behind the stick.

I wouldn't be in hurry to push the new plane to the limits of its capability. There will be plenty more hours of flying time along in due course.
 
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AuntPeggy said:
I heard a news report this morning that said the pilot may have suffered a stroke.

Rather than answering questions, it just brings up more?
Who deployed the 'chute?
Was the engine still operating?

- Aunt Peggy
Click to expand...

So much for the stringent medical requirements. It goes to show that when its time, it's time.
 
AuntPeggy said:
I heard a news report this morning that said the pilot may have suffered a stroke.

Rather than answering questions, it just brings up more?
Who deployed the 'chute?
Was the engine still operating?
Click to expand...

Was the stroke the cause of the accident, or was something stressful leading up to the accident the cause of the stroke?
 
flyingcheesehead said:
Was the stroke the cause of the accident, or was something stressful leading up to the accident the cause of the stroke?
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According to the "news":
http://www.wthr.com/global/Story.asp?s=5336586 said:
Indianapolis - A friend who co-owned a plane that crashed in an Indianapolis pond Monday says the pilot may have suffered a stroke while he was flying.

Indianapolis attorney Bruce Kehoe says hospital personnel told him Robert Edesess had become incapacitated by a stroke or similar event before the crash.

A hospital spokesman said he couldn't confirm that information. A message was left with the Marion County coroner's office.
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flyersfan31 said:
I've heard that, with regard to how hard the landing in a chute-deployed Cirrus is, it's not something you'll want to volunteer to repeat.

Unless, I guess, you're being saved from a catastrophic malfunction...
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Or an acute myocardial infarction.

Edit: Oops I guess in this case I should have said cerebrovascular accident.
 
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mikea said:
You take your wife, your son, and his girlfriend on your first flight in a new plane?
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The same could be said for any plane over 10 years old...

mikea said:
In this case they launched into a 700 foot overcast. If it really was the first flight in this plane for the pilot/co-owner, which I'll doubt, that would be plain dumb.

Even if I just sold one just like it, my first flight would have been with a CFI in VFR conditions, and after those few hours of dual, I'd have some more hours in the new plane before I took the family along.
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You have no facts and you are asking questions in a way that is attacking the pilot who you know nothing about...

Bob was a wonderful man and a pleasure to know. He has owned cirrus aircraft in the past and has flown "brand new" models lately.


I'm SO TIRED of the crap that is placed on the internet when a pilot passes away doing what he loves!

***not trying to bash you mike just getting tired of reading this kind of post all over the internet just because it was a cirrus...
 
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Iceman said:
The same could be said for any plane over 10 years old...
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Or almost forty years old like mine.
That's what I said.

Iceman said:
You have no facts and you are asking questions in a way that is attacking the pilot who you know nothing about...

Bob was a wonderful man and a pleasure to know. He has owned cirrus aircraft in the past and has flown "brand new" models lately.


I'm SO TIRED of the crap that is placed on the internet when a pilot passes away doing what he loves!

***not trying to bash you mike just getting tired of reading this kind of post all over the internet just because it was a cirrus...
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I said, "which I doubt."

It wasn't bashing this pilot or Cirrus. I was bashing the idea that he took the controls of this plane the first time into IMC with 3 other family members on board. I think it will turn out that didn't happen.

Otherwise I was responding to John King's take that the risk assessment is the same. Deciding WHO to risk isn't the same.
 
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