Carbon Monoxide

[Rudy]

This happened to me a couple of months ago:
It was the first time i got to fly out of the pattern and i was thrilled. I was over my house which is east of the airport making circles just hoping someone would see i guess. I did about 3 circles or so and leveled out. As i started to head west i became very light headed and started to get tunnel vision. I looked at the detector and sure enough i had carbon monoxide in the cabin. I was about 2 miles east still and started to let down, i then opened the small window on the 140 and tried to breath in the outside air. As i got on final the tunnel vision got worse and it was like looking through a paper towel roll. I had to look funny, landing. One hand on the yoke one on the power and my head turned half sideways breathing in the air and using my peripheral vision to track the runway. I touched down pretty smooth i think ha it didn't matter i was just glad to be back on the ground.

Good experience though, you can bet that i'm checking that detector every minute or so now

 

[EdFred]

I have a Cherokee 180, and what I will do, no matter how cold it is, is that every few miuntes I will open up the outside air vents to full, and open the little side vent window. Or stick my hand out the side vent window and guide a bunch of fresh outside air in.

 

[Mark S]

I have a CO Experts CO detector located on the floor of my plane that provides a digital readout of CO along with an audible alarm when more than 10 ppm ( believe that is correct) of CO is present. It costs around $100 and is well worth the expense IMHO.

The bigger question to ask is where did your CO come from? Please have your exhaust and heating system checked to make sure it is tight and not leaking. The only time I have gotten CO in my cabin was climbing full rich and had not leaned like I should have.

Mark

 

[Carol]

I have a CO Experts CO detector located on the floor of my plane that provides a digital readout of CO along with an audible alarm when more than 10 ppm ( believe that is correct) of CO is present. It costs around $100 and is well worth the expense IMHO.

The bigger question to ask is where did your CO come from? Please have your exhaust and heating system checked to make sure it is tight and not leaking. The only time I have gotten CO in my cabin was climbing full rich and had not leaned like I should have.

Mark

I agree. Make sure you find out where that CO is coming from. The CO detector is well worth the money.

I had a CO episode returning from a long cross country a couple of years ago. It didn't occur to me at the time what was happening. Only after I got back and began to put things together did I realize the potential danger.

You were very lucky. CO can take you out quick. Did you have nausea and/or headache? Any other sick feelings?

Thank goodness you are okay and here to write about it for others to learn from.

Carol

 

[RobertGerace]

This is a big concern for me, too. I carry two different detectors. I used to cycle the heat on and off (and open vents/windows when off) but then learned that the instruments won't function properly if cold enough (and also that the pilot won't was well).

I wish there was some kind of pulse oximeter that would tell you if you have CO in your blood (they won't) -- although I carry one of those as well to make sure I'm never hypoxic (especially when on 02).

 

[Rudy]

Im sorry i didn't add in that we got if fixed. There two holes in the heating system that was allowing it to leak in. We had everything replaced and it works fine now. I still look at though just to make sure. It was my first real scare when i was flying and i wont forget it anytime soon.


I have also looked in to buying a more expensive one that will yell at me if i have a problem. Its the next thing on my wish list of many.

 

[Rudy]

You were very lucky. CO can take you out quick. Did you have nausea and/or headache? Any other sick feelings?
Carol

Just a tad bit of nausea, it would be easy to ignore and think nothing of it. Luckily i looked at the indicator. The real thing that got me was the tunnel vision. It was something else. I felt a little weak after it was all over but im not sure if that was from the CO or the natural high i was on. haha

 

[Carol]

Im sorry i didn't add in that we got if fixed. There two holes in the heating system that was allowing it to leak in. We had everything replaced and it works fine now. I still look at though just to make sure. It was my first real scare when i was flying and i wont forget it anytime soon.


I have also looked in to buying a more expensive one that will yell at me if i have a problem. Its the next thing on my wish list of many.

I'd put it pretty high on the list You are a lucky guy.

 

[Diana]

Im sorry i didn't add in that we got if fixed. There two holes in the heating system that was allowing it to leak in. We had everything replaced and it works fine now. I still look at though just to make sure. It was my first real scare when i was flying and i wont forget it anytime soon.

Rudy, did you hear about the carbon monoxide accident that happened at your airport (PTS) several years ago?

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001208X05374&key=1

These two were really lucky.

 

[gturner]

This is a big concern for me, too. I carry two different detectors. I used to cycle the heat on and off (and open vents/windows when off) but then learned that the instruments won't function properly if cold enough (and also that the pilot won't was well).

I wish there was some kind of pulse oximeter that would tell you if you have CO in your blood (they won't) -- although I carry one of those as well to make sure I'm never hypoxic (especially when on 02).

This is the closest thing that is made for CO detection. It is actually a breath test that measures end tidal CO. I'm not sure what they cost though.

http://www.creativebiomedics.com/Prod_COMonitorDetails.asp

Gary

 

[bbchien]

This one involved the luckiest man alive, an AME from Hoisington, KS. IT is better to be lucky than good, for sure. He was in my initial AME class....

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?ev_id=20001208X09271&ntsbno=CHI98LA055&akey=1

What is not in the report is that as he staggered to the nearby farmhouse, he looked so bad that the farmer pulled out his shotgun ("durned druggie"), as the aircraft could not be seen from the house. When the power quit, the Century II AP dialed full pitch up, or minimal sink rate, and maintained wings level (on the electric TC) until impact.

 

[Mark S]

This one involved the luckiest man alive, an AME from Hoisington, KS. IT is better to be lucky than good, for sure. He was in my initial AME class....

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief2.asp?ev_id=20001208X09271&ntsbno=CHI98LA055&akey=1

What is not in the report is that as he staggered to the nearby farmhouse, he looked so bad that the farmer pulled out his shotgun ("durned druggie"), as the aircraft could not be seen from the house. When the power quit, the Century II AP dialed full pitch up, or minimal sink rate, and maintained wings level (on the electric TC) until impact.

I remember reading about this incident. A Comanche 400 IIRC. Very, very luck to be alive for lots of reasons.

Mark

 

[Carol H]

Rudy, did you hear about the carbon monoxide accident that happened at your airport (PTS) several years ago?

http://www.ntsb.gov/ntsb/brief.asp?ev_id=20001208X05374&key=1

These two were really lucky.

The pilot stated that she and her passenger became incapacitated after takeoff. The airplane impacted the terrain. Both occupants were hospitalized for observation and testing for carbon monoxide. Tests were positive for carbon monoxide. A subsequent examination of the muffler system found holes in the muffler. An annual inspection had been performed 4 flight-hours prior to the accident, on 2/20/96. The National Transportation Safety Board determines the probable cause(s) of this accident as follows:

an inadequate annual inspection by maintenance personnel, a deteriorated muffler, and pilot incapacitation due to carbon monoxide.

I just happen to find the underlined information a tad scary. It makes me wonder how many inspections are inadequate?


Carol H

 

[Ken Ibold]

I just happen to find the underlined information a tad scary. It makes me wonder how many inspections are inadequate?


Carol H

Many, many. And it's more due to the attitudes of owners rather than the mechanics who work on them.

Most mechanics, as I'm sure Tom D will attest, really want to do the right thing and maintain airplanes to the best of their ability. However, many, many owners get fed up with the cost of maintaining their airplanes and coerce, cajole, intimidate, browbeat and argue with the mechanics to keep the cost down, defer, defer, defer maintenance and otherwise cut corners.

Then, there are some shops/mechanics that become known for pencil-whipping annuals ... oops, I meant performing "checkbook-friendly" annuals ... until the Feds find out and shut them down. Sadly, these guys are usually extremely busy.

I have a friend who is a safety inspector at the Orlando FSDO who is an A&P/IA by background. He flew my airplane when it had about 80 hours from the factory. I had done nothing to it, one way or the other, except changing the oil. He said, "that is the closest to a technically airworthy airplane I have ever seen. But ..." and then listed two legal "deficiencies" that had been overlooked at the factory. Maintaining airplanes right is a tough job. My hat's off to mechanics. I couldn't do what they do. I try to make sure "Let's hold off on that" is not part of my maintenance vocabulary.

 

[Rudy]

Sound like some real close calls. That stuff can be dangerous, im glad i was lucky.

 

[Skip Miller]

I just happen to find the underlined information a tad scary. It makes me wonder how many inspections are inadequate?


Carol H

I don't think cracks in muffler and exhaust stacks start and slowly creep across the affected surface. I think they occur bang! with a relatively sudden change in temperature (like applying take off power, holding it for a while) and the stress finally goes beyond the limits of the material to resist it. In other words, without information about other findings that indicate the holes were in fact present for a while, who is to say the A&P's inspection was inadequate? Maybe the holes did not exist when he looked.

TD if you read this, can you comment? Do holes or cracks in the exhaust occur suddenly or incrementally?

-Skip

 

[Henning]

I just happen to find the underlined information a tad scary. It makes me wonder how many inspections are inadequate?


Carol H

More than you imagine. That's one of the reasons I do all my own work. There's only a couple mechanics I trust to work on my stuff...and I can't afford them. One more reason my next plane and probably any that don't need to be certified aircraft will be homebuilt. I really want to build a LanceAir 360, gotta find the time....

 

[gismo]

I don't think cracks in muffler and exhaust stacks start and slowly creep across the affected surface. I think they occur bang! with a relatively sudden change in temperature (like applying take off power, holding it for a while) and the stress finally goes beyond the limits of the material to resist it. In other words, without information about other findings that indicate the holes were in fact present for a while, who is to say the A&P's inspection was inadequate? Maybe the holes did not exist when he looked.

TD if you read this, can you comment? Do holes or cracks in the exhaust occur suddenly or incrementally?

-Skip

Quite suddenly, if you hit "off" during your mag check and switch back on before the engine stops. I'd wager that this kind of thing is high on the list of causes for sudden exhaust failures.

 

[maximus]

I am surprised, with the way the heater systems are designed, that carbon monoxide detectors are not mandatory equipment. I personally would feel better if airplanes had em. I guess that is what I get for not being able to afford my own plane and being able to install safety equipment.

Maxwell

 

[gismo]

I am surprised, with the way the heater systems are designed, that carbon monoxide detectors are not mandatory equipment. I personally would feel better if airplanes had em. I guess that is what I get for not being able to afford my own plane and being able to install safety equipment.

A portable CO alarm is every bit as effective as a built in one, so rental's shouldn't be an issue.

http://www.aeromedix.com/?_siteid=a...2ad5990f0ae39cbf5ba4afc77&action=sku&sku=coex