Calling all Renters

E

evapilotaz

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Feb 13, 2012
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Gilbert AZ. VFR All Year Baby
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Drone airspace abuser
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KCHD
Calling all renters.

Do you have a dream of ever owning your own airplane. The closest I will come to ownership is being in a Partnership with someone that knows about airplane ownership? Single ownership just doesn't make economical sense to me.

For now I rent at a customer well treated FBO.

Blue Skies.
 
I would almost give my left nut to own.. but i don't know how i'd swing it. Partnership will probably be my saving grace too.
 
Yup. It's the stuff of dreams. Doing the math, there is no way I can swing it when compared to renting since I can barely afford that.

So I just day-dream about my C-177 with custom blue paint and upgraded interior, glass panel, larger engine for more useful load. It's perfect and doesn't cost me anything :)
 
Buy an ultralight of some sort, you can't go anywhere in most rentals anyway.
 
I should be able to afford airplane ownership 3 way partnership in 3-5 years. Maybe sooner. So for now dreaming.

Now lets defined airplane ownership to me. A C172, C182, Piper Cherokee, archer or something equivalent.

Sure I could get myself a cheap ultralight if that is the type of flying I want to do.

A matter fact I'm considering a Part 103 Ultralight for tooling around and rental for taking up Passengers.
 
It's a life choice. To some of us, the joy of flight and ownership is necessary for a fulfilling life. We will do whatever it takes and sacrifice other purchases and lifestyles to fly. There are those that can easily afford ownership and those that sacrifice for ownership. Then there are those that dream about owning a plane.
 
Rich I understand what you are saying.

I just bought a house built 6 months ago. I just bought a pool that is being built as I type this, I have a 2013 Travel trailer that cost a pretty penny I'm paying on. 3 kids one in college. A lot of big purchases this year. Finances needs to settle down again before I purchase that next big ticket item.

For now I'm a happy renter.
 
Boats, RVs, Pools, Planes, most people could probably afford any two easy enough. And those people probably own the first three already.:lol:
 
I've owned solely and in two-way, three-way and four-way partnerships. All were okay, each with advantages and disadvantages. Sole ownership is wonderful, but expensive. If you can swing it, it's great.

Two-way is almost as good as sole ownership at half the non-flying cost. Keeps the airplane healthier, too, by keeping it more active. Even with two pilots it will sit 95% of the time.

Three-way adds to the savings, but incrementally. It's probably the optimal joint ownership scenario for most economy with fewest hassles. You only need one partner to form a consensus and the third will usually go with the consensus.

Four-way was fine but decision-making was harder. "Well, whatever the other two want to do..." The incremental savings of the fourth partner and beyond isn't worth the additional logistics, IMHO.

Every time I've owned I did the math and figured it was cheaper to rent. Every time I rented it was so much hassle I wished I owned.

Of course, now I have the best of all worlds with multiple planes available that friends need to keep healthy so they ask me to fly them for them. I just add fuel and the occasional flight review/IPC for them.
 
Funny, I'm in the opposite basket -- we use our planes during the biz week for client and mechanic shuttles, and they sit around doing nothing all weekend, when recreational demand is at its highest.

I don't want to make a flying club out of it, but I'd love to just tack one or two dudes onto each of the insurance policies on the planes, and get the usage "fluffed" a bit.

Heck, our super-mouse already has "private or better" for the open, and I'd gladly let just about anyone fly the thing once -- and if they didn't trash it, I'd let em fly it again and again. :)

I bet I'm not unique in this scenario. I wish AOPA had done more to market partnerships when they bought out that one website. It seemed to have some good momentum.
 
I own,and still occasionally rent ,when the airplane is in another state.
 
RalphInCA said:
???

AOPA was trying to get into the partnership business?
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I dunno what AOPA were up to. They bought up theapa.com, which was "the aircraft partnership association", and grafted it onto their existing site. I was registered on theapa.com and thought they had a good head of steam going... just starting to get some buzz and some interesting plane listings going.

archive didn't capture their website very well, but here's where it was:

http://web.archive.org/web/20110203182012/http://theapa.com/

after that (circa 2012), it redirects to ap.aopa.org, which is a dead site. I never did see what AOPA was trying to do with it.

:dunno:
 
Timmer said:
So I just day-dream about my C-177 with custom blue paint and upgraded interior, glass panel, larger engine for more useful load. It's perfect and doesn't cost me anything :)
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I'd hope it would be the RG version. The straight leg is just horrible.
 
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Hey, I rented for 8 years. Then looked arround and things had changed enough to buy something "reasonable".

there are pros and cons to both. Renting: I loved just throwing the keys at the guy / gal behind the counter and waling off. Usually didn't even have to worry about filling up with gas (unless cross country). Owning: there is a cool feeling pulling your aircraft out of the hangar. Add in the ability to go pretty much whenever an wherever you want.

Enjoyed renting and reminisce once year - just about annual time :(
 
evapilotaz said:
From what I read a 3 way partnership makes since the most economically.
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For the first 6 years, it was a 2 way, last year we added a 3rd guy, a good friend of us both. It works fine. There is sometimes talk of adding a 4th, but I'm not on board. The benefit/PITA ratio goes south after three, IMHO.
 
I joined a flying club. It makes sense for me now.

I am in the process of building an RV-7, however. During the build I'm able to spread the cost out as I go, and will hopefully be able to save money in the long run by being able to perform my own maintenance.
 
I rent and that makes the most sense right now in 5-7 years when the house is paid for and the kids are gone maybe just maybe I can do the ownership thing but right now just getting the money together to fly is enough work.

I really only need something simple, champ, cub, colt to meet my mission.

My on big concern is that the only 172 for rent (still 45 minutes away) the guy is probably in his 60s and while healthy we all get older and things change. If he stops instructing and renting I will be driving well over an hour to get to a plane to rent at that point my hand may be forced to buy.
 
I would like to own, fo sho. each time I think I have picked a plane that fits my mission, I find another one that could also work. but to realistically make it work, I would need at least one other co-owner.
 
I'd much rather own. This past weekend, all planes at my FBO were reserved all day Saturday through Sunday. I'd like to be able to go flying on a whim and also not worry about when I need to bring the plane back.
 
pete480 said:
I'd much rather own. This past weekend, all planes at my FBO were reserved all day Saturday through Sunday. I'd like to be able to go flying on a whim and also not worry about when I need to bring the plane back.
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That can be a problem with renting. Then again, your one and only plane that you own can and will break on a whim, too.

I do wish it'd be a bit easier to grab a plane without scheduling a week out but then again, keeping the planes flying so much helps the fees stay down.
 
I've been in a 2-way partnership and a 5-way partnership and both were great. Like someone else said, the planes were sitting unused 90some percent of the time. In all those years not once was there ever a scheduling conflict. We did have rules in place for precedence, but honestly I don't think 2 people ever wanted to fly at the same time. And back then I flew somewhere overnight almost every week.

The way we worked the scheduling was that one pilot had precedence each month. If he wanted it at any time, it was his. Otherwise, the first to claim a day/time got it. We always figured that at least 2 people would want it at the same time occasionally ---just never happened. We split fixed expenses evenly and paid $x per dry flight hour which went into a reserve for maintenance and annuals.

For a small, simple plane flown by simple pilots it couldn't be easier or less expensive.

1. Our rules were in writing and signed.
2. If a partner wanted out he was responsible for selling his share of the partnership, but the sale was subject to approval of the other members.
3. We topped the tanks after every flight and left it clean afterward.
 
sferguson524 said:
I would almost give my left nut to own.. but i don't know how i'd swing it. Partnership will probably be my saving grace too.
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Lol, it would happen, just have some faith. The reality is that clubs and partnerships are most people's best option as they reduce not only the individual cost of ownership but the overall cost of ownership as well. There is nothing tougher on machines than sitting around, it's not what they were meant to do and if resource is sitting in the hands of nature, nature will immediately begin to recycle it into base components.
 
This thread has me chopping at the bit to own even if its a third of an airplane in partnership.

I wonder but not looking for explanation. Do most partnerships finance their airplane or purchase out right with Each member coming up with the funds on their own? I would think each member buying into the airplane with their own funds would be the simpler method.
 
Note: finance as little as possible... Be ready to drop in some serious coin after the purchase. I would have loved to buy an s35, but really glad I still have cash for some of the improvements in having made. Makes me feel more comfortable flying family.
( although I must admit using the card this time. If the wife finds out how much I spent on this annual.. Well I'll you'll know of from my silence...)

Love my airplane but these suckers are spendy..
 
Timmer said:
Yup. It's the stuff of dreams. Doing the math, there is no way I can swing it when compared to renting since I can barely afford that.

So I just day-dream about my C-177 with custom blue paint and upgraded interior, glass panel, larger engine for more useful load. It's perfect and doesn't cost me anything :)
Click to expand...

That is my dream plane as well. I'm part owner in a 182K (1967) - and it works out great financially...
 
After renting for a couple of years, then joining a club for a year, I now own. I drive an $8k car and fly a $50k airplane. On this Saturday we had breakfast at home in Austin and a late lunch in Albuquerque. I can't imagine having to deal with partners. I've owned the plane 7 months and have flown 75 hours. All on my schedule.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
Henning said:
Lol, it would happen, just have some faith. The reality is that clubs and partnerships are most people's best option as they reduce not only the individual cost of ownership but the overall cost of ownership as well. There is nothing tougher on machines than sitting around, it's not what they were meant to do and if resource is sitting in the hands of nature, nature will immediately begin to recycle it into base components.
Click to expand...

I've been tempted to stalk some of the ramp queens at HND and VGT and see what's not really flying, talk to the owners and offer to exercise their toys for them :)
 
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